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The Politics Thread 2020


G STAR RAM

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22 hours ago, Archied said:

How do people with such lack of a brain cell get into the kind of public positions they do? Totaly beats me

If you think about your question for a minute, i am confident you will have your answer

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38 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

The dividend relates to the period prior to the virus. 

The whole mindset relates to the period prior to the virus. We are now looking at a scenario in which unemployment will possibly go up to 20% and governments, companies and private individuals will be up to their necks in debt for years to come. The old system of doing things no longer applies.

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1 hour ago, A Ram for All Seasons said:

The £600 million  from the taxpayer is enough to fund 45,000 jobs on the minimum wage for a whole year, not just a couple of weeks. The taxpayer will also be paying the interest on the bonds that are issued to pay back the £600 million for years to come.

Please tell us why it's a good idea to use emergency funds to pay for a windfall to shareholders.

Because we're the shareholders now and paying the taxes in the future will be somebody else's problem.......

.....it seems the idea building something for our children has somehow gotten lost along the way.....

 

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11 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

Because we're the shareholders now and paying the taxes in the future will be somebody else's problem.......

.....it seems the idea building something for our children has somehow gotten lost along the way.....

An uncomfortable truth right there 

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1 hour ago, ramit said:

The controlled demolition of the economy?  A plandemic to create conditions for a centralized cryptocurrency?  The ushering in of the social credit score?

 

 

I got bored after 15 minutes so, I assume the podcast is exposed as a spoof at the end. Either that or this guy isn’t worried because the fairies at the bottom of the garden will save us all.

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18 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Agreed.

Any profit making company should pay back any sort of relief taken from the government 

 

Yet another lack of understanding of dividends and shareholders.

Tescos dividends pays money to pension funds that pay people’s pensions. .. you know .. their personal income. That income is then taxable. Pension funds values and income has been hit by the falling stock market. Pensions get their money from the value of the stock market. So by suggesting dividends are wrong you are suggesting that pensioners shouldn’t be allowed to earn money from the money that they have saved or contributed to in their life time. ..  Those rebates to companies, in effect allows them to continue to pay pensioners as well as to continue to operate in very trying circumstances. 
 

The startling ignorance of some left wing commentators who perpetuate the myth that dividends are somehow money that drips down a hole to some global mastermind in the Cayman Islands is as daft as it is blind 

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11 minutes ago, jono said:

Yet another lack of understanding of dividends and shareholders.

Tescos dividends pays money to pension funds that pay people’s pensions. .. you know .. their personal income. That income is then taxable. Pension funds values and income has been hit by the falling stock market. Pensions get their money from the value of the stock market. So by suggesting dividends are wrong you are suggesting that pensioners shouldn’t be allowed to earn money from the money that they have saved or contributed to in their life time. ..  Those rebates to companies, in effect allows them to continue to pay pensioners as well as to continue to operate in very trying circumstances. 
 

The startling ignorance of some left wing commentators who perpetuate the myth that dividends are somehow money that drips down a hole to some global mastermind in the Cayman Islands is as daft as it is blind 

It's nothing to do with a understand of dividends and shareholders.

Any company using taxpayers funds to increase their profits should be made to pay that money back. 

Why should taxpayers have to contribute to peoples private pensions?

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2 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Why should taxpayers have to contribute to peoples private pensions?

So if you look at the other side of the coin someone who worked in the private sector finds themselves out of work .They still have to pay their council tax part of which goes towards final salary scheme pensions for local government works ,police ,fire etc .

These pension are beyond what most private sector workers can dream of .Ask me how I know.

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13 minutes ago, King Kevin said:

So if you look at the other side of the coin someone who worked in the private sector finds themselves out of work .They still have to pay their council tax part of which goes towards final salary scheme pensions for local government works ,police ,fire etc .

These pension are beyond what most private sector workers can dream of .Ask me how I know.

Yeah fair comment 

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1 hour ago, GboroRam said:

Does all the dividend money end up in pensions? Or does some of it end up as yachts and lear jets?

Apparently Monaco-based Philip Green is also asking the government for assistance. This is, of course, the fella who spent his money on paying supermodels to hold their nose while posing next to him on his superyacht instead of paying it into his employees' pension fund.

https://www.retailgazette.co.uk/blog/2020/04/sir-philip-greens-arcadia-seeks-50m-funding/

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2 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

It's nothing to do with a understand of dividends and shareholders.

Any company using taxpayers funds to increase their profits should be made to pay that money back. 

Why should taxpayers have to contribute to peoples private pensions?

increasingly, they are the same people

as @GboroRam says tho...........not all dividends end up in this way........let us take a squint at the 2019 accounts and we find the 2nd largest shareholder is a bank (holding 3.99%) and the board and execs themselves held about 0.15%

....aaahhhh....the comfort blanket of data and numbers.........?

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3 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

It's nothing to do with a understand of dividends and shareholders.

Any company using taxpayers funds to increase their profits should be made to pay that money back. 

Why should taxpayers have to contribute to peoples private pensions?

By the same standard why should tax payers give any aid to business or individuals in this crisis. That in itself boosts profits or prevents loses which is the same thing

why is there a state fund that bails out pension funds like Philip Greens ? 

the object of all this aid is to keep the engine running so there is something left when it’s over. .. so imagine a private pension fails so the private pensioner then gets tax payers money via pension credit .... we are all links in the chain. 

 

 

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17 minutes ago, jono said:

By the same standard why should tax payers give any aid to business or individuals in this crisis. That in itself boosts profits or prevents loses which is the same thing

why is there a state fund that bails out pension funds like Philip Greens ? 

the object of all this aid is to keep the engine running so there is something left when it’s over. .. so imagine a private pension fails so the private pensioner then gets tax payers money via pension credit .... we are all links in the chain. 

 

 

Interesting last few posts. Especially this one. Going to do a bit of reading on it. 

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19 minutes ago, jono said:

we are all links in the chain. 

Very true ,I have numerous friends that had final salary schemes ,the firms that they work for no longer exist .Their pension funds have been sold  on to private institutions that so far have maintained their expected pension income .

These institutions had made a call on the fund value ,mortality rates etc when taking these schemes over ,very few things guaranteed in this sector.

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On 08/04/2020 at 09:49, i-Ram said:

Would any Remainers like to give me their current thoughts on how the EU are coming together to serve their people. No whataboutery please; let’s try to stick to the question for a post or two.

BBC Extracts in the last 24 hours:

EU finance ministers said on Wednesday still haven’t agreed an economic response. Northern EU member states like the Netherlands and Germany fear they’ll end up carrying other countries’ debts, while hard-hit nations in the south like Italy and Spain say not enough is being done 

Mauro Ferrari, the EU’s top scientist, dramatically quit last night because of the bloc’s response to the virus, saying he had “lost faith” in the EU.

The EU Taskforce set up to coordinate supplies of ventilators, PPE, masks, etc., as of yesterday had still not delivered one piece of equipment to a member state.

Italy clearly disappointed by EU support.  Not difficult to see Spain and France joining them. Be interesting to see how Germany play this, as it is not inconceivable they may find themselves ostracised in the EU.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-52224838

 

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4 hours ago, Tamworthram said:

I got bored after 15 minutes so, I assume the podcast is exposed as a spoof at the end. Either that or this guy isn’t worried because the fairies at the bottom of the garden will save us all.

Well, attention spans differ.  This guy is James Corbett and the reason i posted this after watching, is because i found the information gathered in the video rather convincing and because Corbett has a good track record of being credible and dealing with subjects in a factual manner. 

You assumed incorrectly, although i admit that i wish you hadn't.  i would not post a spoof at this time of probably the greatest social and economic upheaval in our lifetimes and no, the fairies are not going to save us all, but your garden may come in handy for you soon.

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2 hours ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

increasingly, they are the same people

as @GboroRam says tho...........not all dividends end up in this way........let us take a squint at the 2019 accounts and we find the 2nd largest shareholder is a bank (holding 3.99%) and the board and execs themselves held about 0.15%

....aaahhhh....the comfort blanket of data and numbers.........?

Would that happen to be Norges Bank, the central bank of Norway that happens to manage the government pension fund?

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