The Politics Thread 2020

[1967Ram]

20 minutes ago, Anag Ram said:

I think a key point is the social benefits of working with others.

Yes, I can do the same work at home but running ideas past people, gaining their trust and buy-in, bonding etc is very hard to replicate remotely.

Sure, we should travel less for work, but being part of a team needs banter, needs debate, needs physical closeness.

Maybe half the time in the Office and half the time at home would work in these situations?

[1967Ram]

7 minutes ago, Angry Ram said:

Not any more, too much risk now with GDPR. I guess there will always be a few examples but now GDPR is taking a grip, it's a fool who pushes the limits too much. 

I agree but there are plenty around mind

[alexxxxx]

1 hour ago, Tamworthram said:

I just don’t see that the benefits justify the enormous expense, impact on the environment and people/businesses that the line will run though.

Difficult to quantify economic benefits. People poo poo governments for not investing in the country's infrastructure but then there's always some reason why they won't back a big scheme. 

HS2 will transform the nations rail network, well beyond what the name suggests it does much more than cut journey times. It is a truly modern system and would be one the world's best if built. 

Would (and is currently) putting thousands of people in work. 

[King Kevin]

It's annoying that the East and West Mainlines were upgraded yet they've always dodged spending on the Midlands Mainline .

[Tamworthram]

1 hour ago, alexxxxx said:

Difficult to quantify economic benefits. People poo poo governments for not investing in the country's infrastructure but then there's always some reason why they won't back a big scheme. 

HS2 will transform the nations rail network, well beyond what the name suggests it does much more than cut journey times. It is a truly modern system and would be one the world's best if built. 

Would (and is currently) putting thousands of people in work. 

Well it's not meant to be a job creation scheme but I take your point.

I don't really know enough about the benefits but, I'm sure I read somewhere (can't remember where now) that the project had failed Treasury and National Audit Office viability tests. 

[Van der MoodHoover]

1 hour ago, Angry Ram said:

Not any more, too much risk now with GDPR. I guess there will always be a few examples but now GDPR is taking a grip, it's a fool who pushes the limits too much. 

For our small business, it was more about learning and ignorance about how things you take for granted work in terms of data. The obvious example being card payment machines that were operated over the company's broadband, whilst the same broadband was used to provide wifi access for staff and potentially for the public.

Breaches can be inadvertent through lack of understanding - of course there is expertise out there, at a price, but when you're struggling and trying to do as much as possible on your own...

[Van der MoodHoover]

5 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

Well it's not meant to be a job creation scheme but I take your point.

I don't really know enough about the benefits but, I'm sure I read somewhere (can't remember where now) that the project had failed Treasury and National Audit Office viability tests. 

I read somewhere that it scored very low. But then I have read that the method is flawed, as it focuses so much on short term economics that it unduly favours projects in the crowded SE. So a test of Boris's "levelling up" is to find a new formula that weights projects to other parts of the country.

 

Something like applying a BRF (Boris' Re-election Factor) of between 2 and 5 to selected investment proposals at the PM's sole discretion.....?

[Anag Ram]

2 hours ago, 1967Ram said:

Maybe half the time in the Office and half the time at home would work in these situations?

Yes sure I think we will change and won't be as tied into the 9-5 office routine. 

I just fear the situation whereby too many of our human interactions become 'virtual'. 

One of the plus points of this crazy situation is how many actual conversations we have had with our family as opposed to rushed texts. 

I hope we all appreciate each other more in the future. 

[GboroRam]

33 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

For our small business, it was more about learning and ignorance about how things you take for granted work in terms of data. The obvious example being card payment machines that were operated over the company's broadband, whilst the same broadband was used to provide wifi access for staff and potentially for the public.

Breaches can be inadvertent through lack of understanding - of course there is expertise out there, at a price, but when you're struggling and trying to do as much as possible on your own...

I think there's a degree of devil-may-care attitude which businesses will call pragmatism. For example my workplace started a new HR system and your logon for it was your year of birth. Nobody asked anyone if they were happy to use their personal data. Nobody knew anything about the new system - it was just something we were told we could log into, and were encouraged. One of my team challenged it, and the legal team came back and said there was no problem with data protection. I can't see how it can't be, and they just thought they'd push on and do what they wanted regardless. Customer data may be more of a concern, but I think employee personal data is still not properly thought through and gets abused and used as they like. For example spreadsheets with personal data are still emailed all over the place where they shouldn't be. 

[i-Ram]

Interesting discussion piece - will this virus see the fragmentation, indeed split-up, of the EU:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-52135816

Not simply an economics matter; how are member states in reality pulling together to help each other at a time of crisis.

[G STAR RAM]

9 hours ago, 1of4 said:

Of cause it's about politics. Everything that's happening now is going to have political repercussions. Maybe not now but definitely once this crisis is over. It's why people are already trying to look for scapegoats, like the Chinese and the WHO.

Who else will we see added to the list before this crisis is over? The more scapegoats that can be added, the more that can be blamed, to hide the failings of our current leaders and their inability to adequately deal with this crisis.

As for how the country pays the debts it's incurred during this crisis? That's a tightrope this government will have to walk very carefully. If people think that they are being asked to pay more than their fair share of the bill. While having the perception that any austerity measures are having less of an impact on the more affluent. Then the government are possibly in for a very bumpy ride.

So you think our Government should be under huge scrutiny for this but China and WHO are scapegoats when questions are asked of them?

[GboroRam]

12 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

Interesting discussion piece - will this virus see the fragmentation, indeed split-up, of the EU:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-52135816

Not simply an economics matter; how are member states in reality pulling together to help each other at a time of crisis.

True - at the moment there's a lot of focus on nation states. But that's no surprise - we live in a very materialistic world, EU or not. At a time of crisis, it seems that there's a lot of blame being thrown around, both nationally and internationally. The EU will obviously be under fire, justified or not. Every body in any position of power will be expected to do more. Unfortunately there's no global cure for any of this - it will be long, painful and costly for all. 

[Wolfie]

11 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

Interesting discussion piece - will this virus see the fragmentation, indeed split-up, of the EU:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-52135816

Not simply an economics matter; how are member states in reality pulling together to help each other at a time of crisis.

Thanks for the share. Very interesting indeed & I do like Katya Adler's analysis pieces.

The EU has shown repeatedly that it's just not capable of dealing effectively with crises in recent years. The southern countries feel like they're being continually punished and the Northern (richer) ones resent being asked to pick up the tab.

It's going to be interesting to see how the EU respond when/if some of the other eastern countries start buckling under the pressure from CV.

[RamNut]

17 hours ago, Pearl Ram said:

On a totally different note, can anyone shed any light on what Shammi Chakrachuffinbarti did to be made a Baroness ? 

...and what did this cow do anorl....

[GboroRam]

5 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

So you think our Government should be under huge scrutiny for this but China and WHO are scapegoats when questions are asked of them?

Are criticisms fair and proportional? I think, as I've said before, our government has a chequered history in terms of response to CV. The lockdowns came too late and in my opinion are too weighted in favour of personal freedom. China has definitely responded more quickly and enacted a faster lockdown - but early response to attempt to hide and distort the situation were bad choices. But, you know, I'd never expect the Chinese government to be open and honest about it, so they reacted how I'd expect. They shared their genome data openly which is commendable, and scientific communities worldwide have been able to benefit from that. The WHO are in China's pocket financially so you have to bear that in mind when you give them any analysis. China also was the first to be hit by this, so we've had the benefit of hindsight which they didn't have.

Criticism is due everywhere. I'm critical of China but that's nothing unusual - they are a secretive government and are unwilling to be open to much, and that's been the case for decades. I would be far more critical of our government if they took the same steps as China, because I don't live in China and I expect different behaviour from my government. I can't hold China to the same standards that I would from countries that are fundamentally different.

As for the talk of sanctions and economic payback, holding the Chinese responsible for the costs, that's just laughable. 

[A Ram for All Seasons]

20 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

Interesting discussion piece - will this virus see the fragmentation, indeed split-up, of the EU:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-52135816

Not simply an economics matter; how are member states in reality pulling together to help each other at a time of crisis.

I hear that the Americans have been gazumping other countries by buying up their consignments of protective equipment for cash while they were on the tarmac being loaded into the plane. I hope these aren't the same people who will be negotiating Trump's wonderful trade deal that will save Britain from the clutches of the EU.

[G STAR RAM]

3 minutes ago, A Ram for All Seasons said:

I hear that the Americans have been gazumping other countries by buying up their consignments of protective equipment for cash while they were on the tarmac being loaded into the plane. I hope these aren't the same people who will be negotiating Trump's wonderful trade deal that will save Britain from the clutches of the EU.

Where have you heard this? Reliable source?

[Comrade 86]

41 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Where have you heard this? Reliable source?

French and Canadian governments making noises about it.

 

[1of4]

27 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

So you think our Government should be under huge scrutiny for this but China and WHO are scapegoats when questions are asked of them?

Nothing wrong with a country or an organisation being scrutinised on how they are performing. As for China and the WHO, yes questions need to be asked of them. But the finger of blame is already being pointed at them, this is being done without any real evidence of any fault committed by them.  So yes China and the WHO are being lined up as possible scapegoats for other countries to hide behind when this crisis is over.

[Angry Ram]

2 hours ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

For our small business, it was more about learning and ignorance about how things you take for granted work in terms of data. The obvious example being card payment machines that were operated over the company's broadband, whilst the same broadband was used to provide wifi access for staff and potentially for the public.

Breaches can be inadvertent through lack of understanding - of course there is expertise out there, at a price, but when you're struggling and trying to do as much as possible on your own...

Information was mixed at first, no case studies to provide clarity for the legal people. Our biggest issue was data moving outside the EU and how you manage that. Sales and Marketing is a problem, that still needs to settle down a bit as to what is acceptable and what's not.