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The Politics Thread 2020

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On 23/03/2020 at 22:25, ramit said:

Globalism is dead in it's tracks.  Self sufficiency becoming king and capitalism is in it's death throes.

All it took was a tiny little thing, a virus.

Worth a watch, a clock even

 

"The problem with capitalism is that eventually no one can work because of a pandemic"*

Margaret Thatcher

 

*pretty sure she said something like that.,.

 

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2 minutes ago, A Ram for All Seasons said:

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He should write that on his beermats

Just another of the rich bamford business owners, who don't want to put their hand in their own pocket to help out their own staff. While crying crocodile tears with their hand out, wanting government hand outs for their businesses.

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4 hours ago, 1of4 said:

Just another of the rich bamford business owners, who don't want to put their hand in their own pocket to help out their own staff. While crying crocodile tears with their hand out, wanting government hand outs for their businesses.

This is my issue with unfettered capitalism. The claim made is that its a risk-reward system. But it doesn't seem to me to be that at all. Downside is limited and the potential upside not. It's as though these people have bought immense options on UK society. Economically, his business has performed like a winning lottery ticket...….

But we're supposed to admire him and aspire to BE like him..... 

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7 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said:

His pro-Brexit stance was nothing to do with been able to remove worker's rights. He can be fully trusted.

His pro Brexit stance seemed rather undermined by him selling American Brandy, Australian Whiskey etc etc as an example of the good deals we could do once we'd left, while we were still a member.

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In a time of national crisis this government is rudderless and full of BS. Johnson's wet dream of gaining some sort of a Churchillian status is crumbling by the day. He and his government needed to take more decisive action from day one. Instead they've dithered and waffled. The first action Johnson and his government took was to look after businesses, instead of looking after the nations health by making sure the NHS had all the support and equipment it need to fight the coronavirus.

If it had started making sure this equipment was available sooner. I wouldn't have had to watch Nadhim Zahawi the Minister for Business and Industry, on Newsnight, spouting crap so as not to tell an outright lie, while trying to evade answering the question of why the NHS had still not received the promised test kits for testing front line NHS staff.

When is Johnson going to call for a full lock down in this battle against the spread of the virus, as many other countries have already done. Do we have to see a dramatic rise in the number of deaths before this happens.

 I expect this post will be greeted with the usual responses of if Labour and Corbyn had been in charge, the situation would have been twice as bad. It could well have been but they're not in charge, Johnson is.

I don't want to hear that Johnson is doing his best under difficult conditions, no he isn't. The NHS and it's staff are doing it's best under difficult conditions. It just needs more support from the government and for some of the population to stop being stupid bamfords.

Even with all their dithering, I'll give our government my full cooperation and support for what ever they do at this time. I just want them to be honest with the country and stop the BS when asked question about our ability to contain the spread of the virus.

Stop telling the country that more test kits, ventilators and other much needed equipment would quickly be obtained or manufactured. Which they knew was not possible, so either lied or are just incompetent in doing their job. 

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, 1of4 said:

In a time of national crisis this government is rudderless and full of BS. Johnson's wet dream of gaining some sort of a Churchillian status is crumbling by the day. He and his government needed to take more decisive action from day one. Instead they've dithered and waffled. The first action Johnson and his government took was to look after businesses, instead of looking after the nations health by making sure the NHS had all the support and equipment it need to fight the coronavirus.

If it had started making sure this equipment was available sooner. I wouldn't have had to watch Nadhim Zahawi the Minister for Business and Industry, on Newsnight, spouting crap so as not to tell an outright lie, while trying to evade answering the question of why the NHS had still not received the promised test kits for testing front line NHS staff.

When is Johnson going to call for a full lock down in this battle against the spread of the virus, as many other countries have already done. Do we have to see a dramatic rise in the number of deaths before this happens.

 I expect this post will be greeted with the usual responses of if Labour and Corbyn had been in charge, the situation would have been twice as bad. It could well have been but they're not in charge, Johnson is.

I don't want to hear that Johnson is doing his best under difficult conditions, no he isn't. The NHS and it's staff are doing it's best under difficult conditions. It just needs more support from the government and for some of the population to stop being stupid bamfords.

Even with all their dithering, I'll give our government my full cooperation and support for what ever they do at this time. I just want them to be honest with the country and stop the BS when asked question about our ability to contain the spread of the virus.

Stop telling the country that more test kits, ventilators and other much needed equipment would quickly be obtained or manufactured. Which they knew was not possible, so either lied or are just incompetent in doing their job. 

Being clear and honest is what’s lacking in my view , I was very blunt regards my long held view of boris as a politician ( no matter what party) and was slated , that’s fair enough if people disagree but my view is he sold a lock down policy to protect health and lives that turns out on examination to be not that at all but rather a pass the responsibility on to employers , anybody with a tiny smidge of experience in the construction industry knows he is putting self employed and contractors in an impossible situation,

so really the policy they are pursuing is trying to balance protecting lives with protecting the economy , now if boris and gov feels this is the right course then fair enough ,only time will tell if it’s best, bffs Be honest and open about it from the start and don’t be ambiguous to avoid taking responsibility leaving workers and employers in a total state of confusion and having to make impossible decisions regards health and surviving financially ,seems to me boris is being trump but trying to disguise it 

there are times ( once in a generation?) when people need clear and unequivocal leadership from government and this is that time 

yet again I clearly state that NO party politics is involved in my view of the current situation we are navigating 

Edited by Archied

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8 hours ago, 1of4 said:

I wouldn't have had to watch Nadhim Zahawi the Minister for Business and Industry, on Newsnight, spouting crap so as not to tell an outright lie, while trying to evade answering the question of why the NHS had still not received the promised test kits for testing front line NHS staff.

Parliament has been sent into recess for 4 weeks at the height of the crisis, so she won't have to answer to MPs either.

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8 hours ago, 1of4 said:

In a time of national crisis this government is rudderless and full of BS. Johnson's wet dream of gaining some sort of a Churchillian status is crumbling by the day. He and his government needed to take more decisive action from day one. Instead they've dithered and waffled. The first action Johnson and his government took was to look after businesses, instead of looking after the nations health by making sure the NHS had all the support and equipment it need to fight the coronavirus.

If it had started making sure this equipment was available sooner. I wouldn't have had to watch Nadhim Zahawi the Minister for Business and Industry, on Newsnight, spouting crap so as not to tell an outright lie, while trying to evade answering the question of why the NHS had still not received the promised test kits for testing front line NHS staff.

When is Johnson going to call for a full lock down in this battle against the spread of the virus, as many other countries have already done. Do we have to see a dramatic rise in the number of deaths before this happens.

 I expect this post will be greeted with the usual responses of if Labour and Corbyn had been in charge, the situation would have been twice as bad. It could well have been but they're not in charge, Johnson is.

I don't want to hear that Johnson is doing his best under difficult conditions, no he isn't. The NHS and it's staff are doing it's best under difficult conditions. It just needs more support from the government and for some of the population to stop being stupid bamfords.

Even with all their dithering, I'll give our government my full cooperation and support for what ever they do at this time. I just want them to be honest with the country and stop the BS when asked question about our ability to contain the spread of the virus.

Stop telling the country that more test kits, ventilators and other much needed equipment would quickly be obtained or manufactured. Which they knew was not possible, so either lied or are just incompetent in doing their job. 

Expecting politicians to decline from giving BS answers? Now that’s a big ask.

I’m not particularly political and don’t have any strong allegiance to any party but, it was interesting to hear a labour spokesman (can’t remember his name) on the radio yesterday avoiding answering the question as to whether Keir Starmer, or another labour representative, should join Cobra. To me, it sounded a bit like he was advocating the government (on advice from Cobra) can make the decisions and then we can criticise them (possibly with the benefit of hindsight). I don’t know what the official labour view is but, I would have thought in this time of national crisis they should be pushing for as much of a coalition as possible.

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1 hour ago, Tamworthram said:

Expecting politicians to decline from giving BS answers? Now that’s a big ask.

I’m not particularly political and don’t have any strong allegiance to any party but, it was interesting to hear a labour spokesman (can’t remember his name) on the radio yesterday avoiding answering the question as to whether Keir Starmer, or another labour representative, should join Cobra. To me, it sounded a bit like he was advocating the government (on advice from Cobra) can make the decisions and then we can criticise them (possibly with the benefit of hindsight). I don’t know what the official labour view is but, I would have thought in this time of national crisis they should be pushing for as much of a coalition as possible.

Yep ,no way wil or can anybody get decisions and policy 100% right in this crisis, specially once hindsight is used when we are through it but please decide policy, own it and be clear when instructions are given to implement it

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On 23/03/2020 at 22:25, ramit said:

Globalism is dead in it's tracks.  Self sufficiency becoming king and capitalism is in it's death throes.

All it took was a tiny little thing, a virus.

Worth a watch, a clock even

 

Try telling google, Amazon, Apple

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5 minutes ago, jono said:

Try telling google, Amazon, Apple

If the economic system crashes, they will crash with it

Did you watch the video?

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4 hours ago, Archied said:

so really the policy they are pursuing is trying to balance protecting lives with protecting the economy , now if boris and gov feels this is the right course then fair enough ,only time will tell if it’s best

I suppose it's easier to make that decision when you know that you and your loved ones will not have to worry about getting a ventilator or an ICU bed when you need one

 

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1 hour ago, ramit said:

If the economic system crashes, they will crash with it

Did you watch the video?

I have no doubt business practices will change in the aftermath of this virus. However,  People and companies will still exchange labour and skills for a medium of exchange on a variety of scales- small large, national and international . I am sure certain large conglomerates will suffer or fail. There will be winners and losers, victims and predators. It’s called human nature.

As to the video, if I get a few minutes I might have a look but noisy declaimers of the new truth (theirs) are 10 a penny on you tube. Just as noisy activists for one form or another of self promotion are 10 a penny, along with conspiracy theories, miracle cures, purveyors of the next big thing. And with all of them there is one common factor.... A little bit of truth mixed up with a lot of BS and exaggeration. 

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27 minutes ago, jono said:

I have no doubt business practices will change in the aftermath of this virus. However,  People and companies will still exchange labour and skills for a medium of exchange on a variety of scales- small large, national and international . I am sure certain large conglomerates will suffer or fail. There will be winners and losers, victims and predators. It’s called human nature.

As to the video, if I get a few minutes I might have a look but noisy declaimers of the new truth (theirs) are 10 a penny on you tube. Just as noisy activists for one form or another of self promotion are 10 a penny, along with conspiracy theories, miracle cures, purveyors of the next big thing. And with all of them there is one common factor.... A little bit of truth mixed up with a lot of BS and exaggeration. 

A simple no would have sufficed

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, jono said:

I have no doubt business practices will change in the aftermath of this virus. However,  People and companies will still exchange labour and skills for a medium of exchange on a variety of scales- small large, national and international . I am sure certain large conglomerates will suffer or fail. There will be winners and losers, victims and predators. It’s called human nature.

As to the video, if I get a few minutes I might have a look but noisy declaimers of the new truth (theirs) are 10 a penny on you tube. Just as noisy activists for one form or another of self promotion are 10 a penny, along with conspiracy theories, miracle cures, purveyors of the next big thing. And with all of them there is one common factor.... A little bit of truth mixed up with a lot of BS and exaggeration. 

You shouldn't dismiss it if you've not watched it Jono. It's actually very interesting and is so from an economics perspective not a political one. There's no sensationalism from my perspective, just an informed and plain spoken analysis. Worth a look.

Edited by 86 Schmokes & a Pancake

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