Highgate Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 23 minutes ago, King Kevin said: I can understand your point of view ,I just don't agree with it. That's disappointingly civilized of you... have you forgotten that this is the Politics Thread? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TramRam Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 39 minutes ago, A Ram for All Seasons said: Derby's own Herbert Spencer, the founder of Social Darwinism. What a pillock. Having chops looks to be the fashion of the day, And from the Right. And he invented the Paper Clip ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 I'm gonna take a wild guess that Squeaky is bang on the bugle again ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 44 minutes ago, i-Ram said: Ah well, its another injustice which gives you something to keep tapping away on your keyboard about. Ah well - I see the time for reflection is over. I preferred it when you used to "take a few seconds more before pressing that send button" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i-Ram Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 1 minute ago, SchtivePesley said: Ah well - I see the time for reflection is over. I preferred it when you used to "take a few seconds more before pressing that send button" Sorry, but I did take well over 5 minutes before pressing the button and reworded it twice. Which part of my post has upset you, and why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 1 hour ago, Norman said: Ah come on. Are you saying it isn't better to be black now than in the 70's? No - I'm not, and that's what frustrates and puzzles me. We (as white blokes) would agree that it's nowhere near as bad as it was in the 70s See my post the other day about my black teacher in the 80s and the whole class doing monkey noises whenever he turned around. Wouldn't happen now without kids getting expelled But I guess you don't have to zoom out very far for the scale of change to disappear Fundamentally we can't have changed too much if the black community are still having to riot in order to have racist police brutality addressed - like they were doing in 1965 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 Just now, SchtivePesley said: No - I'm not, and that's what frustrates and puzzles me. We (as white blokes) would agree that it's nowhere near as bad as it was in the 70s See my post the other day about my black teacher in the 80s and the whole class doing monkey noises whenever he turned around. Wouldn't happen now without kids getting expelled But I guess you don't have to zoom out very far for the scale of change to disappear Fundamentally we can't have changed too much if the black community are still having to riot in order to have racist police brutality addressed - like they were doing in 1965 This country has changed. There is no case to answer for police brutality in this country. You can't keep lumping us in with other countries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 11 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said: Fundamentally we can't have changed too much if the black community are still having to riot in order to have racist police brutality addressed - like they were doing in 1965 Maybe a large part of the black community feeling as though its still 1965 is largely down to the left and leftist media's hateful obsession with identity politics. There seems to be so much racism around these days that there is huge focus on micro aggressions, unconscious bias and statues of people that lived 200-300yrs ago. Nobody ever credits how far we've come or really talks about what steps we can still take, only how modern Whitey can pay for the sins of his ancestors that more than likely didn't even have active involvement in the slave trade either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 43 minutes ago, i-Ram said: Sorry, but I did take well over 5 minutes before pressing the button and reworded it twice. Which part of my post has upset you, and why? Et tu, Brute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 13 minutes ago, maxjam said: Maybe a large part of the black community feeling as though its still 1965 is largely down to the left and leftist media's hateful obsession with identity politics. There seems to be so much racism around these days that there is huge focus on micro aggressions, unconscious bias and statues of people that lived 200-300yrs ago. Nobody ever credits how far we've come or really talks about what steps we can still take, only how modern Whitey can pay for the sins of his ancestors that more than likely didn't even have active involvement in the slave trade either. My family roots come from Norway, then Ireland. I have a lot to be sinful for. Rape, pillage, brutality and Mrs Brown's Boys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 16 minutes ago, maxjam said: Maybe a large part of the black community feeling as though its still 1965 is largely down to the left and leftist media's hateful obsession with identity politics. There seems to be so much racism around these days that there is huge focus on micro aggressions, unconscious bias and statues of people that lived 200-300yrs ago. Nobody ever credits how far we've come or really talks about what steps we can still take, only how modern Whitey can pay for the sins of his ancestors that more than likely didn't even have active involvement in the slave trade either. We are to be congratulated for not wanting to own slaves? Is that really the sum total of your argument? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 1 minute ago, Norman said: My family roots come from Norway, then Ireland. I have a lot to be sinful for. Rape, pillage, brutality and Mrs Brown's Boys. All pale into insignificance compared to Lutefisk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 21 minutes ago, Norman said: Rape, pillage, brutality and Mrs Brown's Boys. Sounds like a night out in Ripley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 29 minutes ago, Eddie said: We are to be congratulated for not wanting to own slaves? Is that really the sum total of your argument? Think you might have your sums wrong, Eddie. I'm amazed I'm not on your ignore list, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 34 minutes ago, Eddie said: We are to be congratulated for not wanting to own slaves? Is that really the sum total of your argument? Yes. Yes it is. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 1 hour ago, Norman said: There is no case to answer for police brutality in this country. There may be a a lesser case than could be argued is true of the US, but the States have hardly set an unattainable benchmark, have they? Stating there is 'no case to answer' is simply not true. The numbers may pale alongside US totals, but irrespective of that pointless and irrelevant comparison, there have still been over 160 BAME deaths in police custody since 1990 and for the families and friends of the victims, I would argue there is very much a case to answer. Some stats for you that might provide insight as to why folk are so angry: The proportion of BAME deaths in custody where restraint is a feature is over two times greater than it is in other deaths in custody The proportion of BAME deaths in custody where use of force is a feature is over two times greater than it is in other deaths in custody The proportion of BAME deaths in custody where mental health-related issues are a feature is nearly two times greater than it is in other deaths in custody Total BAME deaths in police custody or otherwise following contact with the police, England & Wales 1990-date Type Metropolitan Police Other Forces Total Custody 84 79 163 Shooting 15 5 20 All custody & shooting deaths 99 84 183 While the overall death-count is broadly in line with the 2011 census - that is, BAME victims account for 14% of the total figure - it is the number of deaths where BAME victims have died while under restraint that is the most notable anomaly. Is it any wonder then, that the manner of George Floyd's killing has triggered fury among the family and friends of those who have died here in the UK under very similar circumstances? Furthermore, and setting aside any BLM considerations, over 1740 people have died in police custody or otherwise following contact with the police in England & Wales since 1990. Perhaps those numbers beg no questions for you, but don't assume that everyone else feels the same way as they clearly do not. Given these statistics and again, setting aside any racial context, can you explain how it is you can state as you have that, 'there is no case to answer for police brutality in this country'? And notwithstanding the dangers presented by mass-gatherings at this time, is the real question not , why are black folk protesting, but rather, why isn't everyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 12 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said: There may be a a lesser case than could be argued is true of the US, but the States have hardly set an unattainable benchmark, have they? Stating there is 'no case to answer' is simply not true. The numbers may pale alongside US totals, but irrespective of that pointless and irrelevant comparison, there have still been over 160 BAME deaths in police custody since 1990 and for the families and friends of the victims, I would argue there is very much a case to answer. Some stats for you that might provide insight as to why folk are so angry: The proportion of BAME deaths in custody where restraint is a feature is over two times greater than it is in other deaths in custody The proportion of BAME deaths in custody where use of force is a feature is over two times greater than it is in other deaths in custody The proportion of BAME deaths in custody where mental health-related issues are a feature is nearly two times greater than it is in other deaths in custody Total BAME deaths in police custody or otherwise following contact with the police, England & Wales 1990-date Type Metropolitan Police Other Forces Total Custody 84 79 163 Shooting 15 5 20 All custody & shooting deaths 99 84 183 While the overall death-count is broadly in line with the 2011 census - that is, BAME victims account for 14% of the total figure - it is the number of deaths where BAME victims have died while under restraint that is the most notable anomaly. Is it any wonder then, that the manner of George Floyd's killing has triggered fury among the family and friends of those who have died here in the UK under very similar circumstances? Furthermore, and setting aside any BLM considerations, over 1740 people have died in police custody or otherwise following contact with the police in England & Wales since 1990. Perhaps those numbers beg no questions for you, but don't assume that everyone else feels the same way as they clearly do not. Given these statistics and again, setting aside any racial context, can you explain how it is you can state as you have that, 'there is no case to answer for police brutality in this country'? And notwithstanding the dangers presented by mass-gatherings at this time, is the real question not , why are black folk protesting, but rather, why isn't everyone? What's your Twitter handle? 160 deaths in 30 years. How many ruled unlawful? Because, from my own experience, the rest of the stats seem to be what I would expect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuffLuff Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 Racism hasn’t ‘got better’, it’s definition and how it manifests itself in society have changed. Once again I pop into this thread and see those who like to have an opinion completely missing the point. Much like they can’t see past their own little tunnel vision argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norman Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 I mean a great wall of text, that says deaths in custody of BAME is in line with the population. We have to use different restraint techniques on BAME. Sickle cell etc. So again, I'm not surprised figures dating from 1990 record higher for BAME under restraint. There have been major changes and awareness there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 10 minutes ago, Norman said: What's your Twitter handle? 160 deaths in 30 years. How many ruled unlawful? Because, from my own experience, the rest of the stats seem to be what I would expect. Ok mate ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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