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Greta Thunberg & Extinction Rebellion

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2 hours ago, maxjam said:

I'd like to see some more up to date figures tbh.

But what that does show is that China releases about the same CO2 as the next 4 countries or every country from 4-20 in the list.

China imports around 14 million tonnes of coal a year to power infrastructure -a lot comes from Australia.  That's a reduction from the previous levels .  You are correct that until this issue is looked at, other elements while relevant are miniscule.

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I'm going to assume @Hinzy9 and @Sexydadbod are just trolling and address @maxjam's point about China instead. His point is a relevant one. 

It's true that even if the US and the EU clean up their act completely it won't be enough to prevent catastrophic changes to the global climate.  It would buy us some time and I would never call it pointless, but it's true that if just those two regions became carbon neutral while the rest of the world, including China, carried on as normal then the reductions in GHG emissions would be insufficient and inadequate. 

I don't see this as a reason for inaction however,  As of 2017 the US still far outstrips China in per capita carbon dioxide emissions, so the US is probably the best place to start implementing the radical changes necessary (after Trump is gone in 2020 hopefully). We can only do what we can to create and facilitate a green economy here and then try to influence other countries to the best of our ability. The case for switching to a green economy is becoming more urgent every year and the argument is becoming easier to make as the penny finally drops for more and more people.

The Chinese are as aware as anyone to the dire threat that pollution and climate change pose.  How could you be unaware of pollution if you lived in a Chinese city or next to one of it' rivers?  It's all too apparent.  It's just that the population there has no simple way of influencing policy or the shape of the government.  They can't really protest can they?  And yet, seeing as Xi has all but appointed himself as president for life, we must hope that he gets the message somehow.  If he does, the changes will be rapid and determined.  He doesn't seem to do things in half measures. 

 

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1 hour ago, AndyinLiverpool said:

There is often the suggestion from the rich people in power that anyone who protests in anyway must want us to return to living in caves. People concerned with the state of the environment are hypocrites for putting the kettle on or going on holiday.

Exactly, I'd happily fly Al Gore around the world if the result was that he convinces thousands not to fly.

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38 minutes ago, BaaLocks said:

Exactly, I'd happily fly Al Gore around the world if the result was that he convinces thousands not to fly.

The attacks on Al Gore are classic ad hominem tactics.  Don't focus on his arguments because really the science proving human induced climate change is indisputable at this stage, so instead simply try to discredit the messenger. 

Depressingly it seems to work to some extent.  Some people will be only too eager to dismiss him as a hypocrite (I'm sure Al would take the electric plane option if it were available) and ignore the whole climate change issue along with him. 

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20 minutes ago, Highgate said:

because really the science proving human induced climate change is indisputable

I wish - Twitter is full of tinhats shouting conspiracy. We've even had a couple in this thread 🙁

Edited by SchtivePesley

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10 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

I wish - Twitter is full of tinhats shouting conspiracy. We've even had a couple in this thread 🙁

Indeed, 'indisputable' was spectacularly the wrong word to use...given all the deniers still at large.  Irrefutable might have been better.

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2 hours ago, Sexydadbod said:

The discussion of climate change seems to bring out the best and worst in everyone, it’s nice seeing people caring about the world but some of the suggestions to save the world are stupid.. Cannibalism in order to save the save the world ? Yeah count me out of that one, Id rather see the world be destroyed than ever resorting to eating a fellow human.

 

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.businessinsider.com/cannibalism-eating-human-flesh-climate-change-2019-9

You know people like this end up harming the cause rather than helping it

 

 

 

Edited by Sexydadbod

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1 hour ago, Highgate said:

I'm going to assume @Hinzy9 and @Sexydadbod are just trolling and address @maxjam's point about China instead. His point is a relevant one. 

It's true that even if the US and the EU clean up their act completely it won't be enough to prevent catastrophic changes to the global climate.  It would buy us some time and I would never call it pointless, but it's true that if just those two regions became carbon neutral while the rest of the world, including China, carried on as normal then the reductions in GHG emissions would be insufficient and inadequate. 

I don't see this as a reason for inaction however,  As of 2017 the US still far outstrips China in per capita carbon dioxide emissions, so the US is probably the best place to start implementing the radical changes necessary (after Trump is gone in 2020 hopefully). We can only do what we can to create and facilitate a green economy here and then try to influence other countries to the best of our ability. The case for switching to a green economy is becoming more urgent every year and the argument is becoming easier to make as the penny finally drops for more and more people.

The Chinese are as aware as anyone to the dire threat that pollution and climate change pose.  How could you be unaware of pollution if you lived in a Chinese city or next to one of it' rivers?  It's all too apparent.  It's just that the population there has no simple way of influencing policy or the shape of the government.  They can't really protest can they?  And yet, seeing as Xi has all but appointed himself as president for life, we must hope that he gets the message somehow.  If he does, the changes will be rapid and determined.  He doesn't seem to do things in half measures. 

 

Whatever your views around climate change, the manipulation and indoctrination of children for political and ideological purposes cannot be supported

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6 minutes ago, Highgate said:

Indeed, 'indisputable' was spectacularly the wrong word to use...given all the deniers still at large.  Irrefutable might have been better.

 

22 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

I wish - Twitter is full of tinhats shouting conspiracy. We've even had a couple in this thread 🙁

Does anyone think that it doesn’t exist? Must be pretty silly to suggest pollutants aren’t harmful. Saying however we only 11 years left is wrong, plain wrong- they’ve been saying this for 50+ years that we’ve only got so long left. Any effects will be long term, and in the very long term rather than as short as 11 years.

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1 minute ago, Hinzy9 said:

Whatever your views around climate change, the manipulation and indoctrination of children for political and ideological purposes cannot be supported

Who says she's been indoctrinated? Admittedly, to claim her childhood has been ruined because of climate change is ridiculous, but why would you suggest that she doesn't have any understanding of the issue? Perhaps her age may inhibit her ability to reason somewhat, but I guarantee she knows a damn sight more about the issue than the President of the United States.

 

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3 minutes ago, Hinzy9 said:

Whatever your views around climate change, the manipulation and indoctrination of children for political and ideological purposes cannot be supported

So Children aren't allowed an opinion or voice? Especially those with medical conditions it seems from your previous posts.

If you have something to say about climate change at least back it up with a considered opinion.

She is 16 you know? So not really a child.

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2 minutes ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said:

Who says she's been indoctrinated? Admittedly, to claim her childhood has been ruined because of climate change is ridiculous, but why would you suggest that she doesn't have any understanding of the issue? Perhaps her age may inhibit her ability to reason somewhat, but I guarantee she knows a damn sight more about the issue than the President of the United States.

 

I have no idea what her level of understanding of the issue is, that's not really relevant. 

I do know that last week 10,000s of UK school children were taken out of lessons to "protest" by teachers, irrespective of the children's views on climate change.

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2 minutes ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said:

Who says she's been indoctrinated? Admittedly, to claim her childhood has been ruined because of climate change is ridiculous, but why would you suggest that she doesn't have any understanding of the issue? Perhaps her age may inhibit her ability to reason somewhat, but I guarantee she knows a damn sight more about the issue than the President of the United States.

 

Do you think she wrote the speech herself? She has aspergers and autism, her mother spoke in her book about her mental issues when she was younger, including depression, refusing to eat or talk. She’s clearly very vulnerable and is getting more spotlight- I hope we don’t have a martyr type situation 

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13 minutes ago, Sexydadbod said:

 Saying however we only 11 years left is wrong, plain wrong- they’ve been saying this for 50+ years that we’ve only got so long left.

And maybe if we'd done something a bit sooner then we wouldn't be in the situation...

By the way - the 11 years refers to how long we have left to do something before it becomes irreversible, not that we have 11 years left before the world ends. But if you know that is "wrong, plain wrong" then feel free to share your scientific analysis. Would be interesting to see how it differs from the professional scientists...

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10 minutes ago, Paul71 said:

So Children aren't allowed an opinion or voice? Especially those with medical conditions it seems from your previous posts.

If you have something to say about climate change at least back it up with a considered opinion.

She is 16 you know? So not really a child.

She's just a pawn in a political game, it's just sad that people can't see through it. Shameful really

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1 minute ago, SchtivePesley said:

And maybe if we'd done something a bit sooner then we wouldn't be in the situation...

By the way - the 11 years refers to how long we have left to do something before it becomes irreversible, not that we have 11 years left before the world ends. But if you know that is "wrong, plain wrong" then feel free to share your scientific analysis. Would be interesting to see how it differs from the professional scientists...

Where’s the evidence to say we’ve only got 11 years before there’s irreversible damage? They’ve been saying since the 60s we’ve only got so long . Hopefully not by the Swedish scientist who said we should start eating human flesh, maybe I really will be worried then... 🤷‍♂️ Absolutely nothing will happen short term, long term if we haven’t wiped out the human race from a nuclear war then yes maybe we should be a concerned, but we will all be long gone by then.  

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4 hours ago, Hinzy9 said:

It's sad that the climate change movement has now reverted to getting a child with Asperger's syndrome to peddle their hysteria.

Seems like child abuse to me.

I'm actually embarrassed for you, likewise your fellow climate change denier @Sexydadbod The pair of you should be ashamed.

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9 minutes ago, Sexydadbod said:

Do you think she wrote the speech herself? She has aspergers and autism, her mother spoke in her book about her mental issues when she was younger, including depression, refusing to eat or talk. She’s clearly very vulnerable and is getting more spotlight- I hope we don’t have a martyr type situation 

You do know having aspergers or autism doesn't mean you cannot be a functioning human being dont you?

 

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12 minutes ago, Sexydadbod said:

Do you think she wrote the speech herself? She has aspergers and autism, her mother spoke in her book about her mental issues when she was younger, including depression, refusing to eat or talk. She’s clearly very vulnerable and is getting more spotlight- I hope we don’t have a martyr type situation 

I’m not comfortable with a 16-year-old guy with aspergers being such a public figure. But it’s seemingly what she wants to do and she’s promoting a message for the greater good, IMO at least.

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