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Rooney or Cocu


Owd miner

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19 minutes ago, Carl Sagan said:

Love that Philip Cocu is our manager. Finally someone with a brain and long-term strategy that will allow the club to benefit from its excellent academy and build a team that includes many of our talented youngsters. It was great to hear Pat Lyons raving about Sibley after the U23 game against Liverpool. 

I will happily give Cocu 2 seasons now. We may not be, but I suspect that by the time Rooney arrives we'll be doing most things right and knocking on the door of the top six. And at that point the buzz and lift Rooney will give all the players will propel us higher. 

It's a marathon not a sprint. 

We need a fingers crossed emoji.

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12 hours ago, BathRam72 said:

As you can work out that he is using the same word for both, this would suggest you fully understand him.

Ergo,,,,,, no confusion. ?

Oh no... sorry... I meant it could be confusing for others... for lesser mortals, if I may be so bold!

Absolutely no confusion on my part... I understood every single syllable wot woz writted by the poetically gifted ancient pitman fella.  Why, I'd even dare to say that we are intellectually intertwined! 

... And if you must address me as Igor, at least try to spell it corektly!  

 

 

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1 hour ago, Mucker1884 said:

Oh no... sorry... I meant it could be confusing for others... for lesser mortals, if I may be so bold!

Absolutely no confusion on my part... I understood every single syllable wot woz writted by the poetically gifted ancient pitman fella.  Why, I'd even dare to say that we are intellectually intertwined! 

... And if you must address me as Igor, at least try to spell it corektly!  

 

 

No. I meant Ergo. Just as spelt 

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At the start of the season quite a few fans were giving it the ‘I don’t mind a season of transition as long as we’re trying to bring through some youth players and improving as the season goes on’ and you just know that they’re the same ones now complaining that we’re not flying at the top of the division. 

 

 

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10 hours ago, JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta said:

Farke had a poor first season as Norwich manager and now they are in the Premier League beating Man City 3-2. Have a bit of patience fellas.

I agree with the Farke optimism and patience statement. Cocu needs transfer windows and a proper preseason. However Farke was left to his own devices. He didn’t have an ageing record goal scorer thrust on to him by a pushy interfering owner.

I’m with you @Owd miner we’re in the minority pal. Cocu will be looking over his shoulder if by January things haven’t improved during this so called transition season (yet again). Sadly for Cocu when push comes to shove I think Mel will listen more to Rooney than Cocu if the knifes come out post January. 

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1 minute ago, Remy the hare said:

I agree with the Farke optimism and patience statement. Cocu needs transfer windows and a proper preseason. However Farke was left to his own devices. He didn’t have an ageing record goal scorer thrust on to him by a pushy interfering owner.

I’m with you @Owd miner we’re in the minority pal. Cocu will be looking over his shoulder if by January things haven’t improved during this so called transition season (yet again). Sadly for Cocu when push comes to shove I think Mel will listen more to Rooney than Cocu if the knifes come out post January. 

On what basis do you reckon Cocu didn't want Rooney  - I've not seen any interview he's given which suggests that's the case?

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6 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

Love that Philip Cocu is our manager. Finally someone with a brain and long-term strategy that will allow the club to benefit from its excellent academy and build a team that includes many of our talented youngsters. It was great to hear Pat Lyons raving about Sibley after the U23 game against Liverpool. 

I will happily give Cocu 2 seasons now. We may not be, but I suspect that by the time Rooney arrives we'll be doing most things right and knocking on the door of the top six. And at that point the buzz and lift Rooney will give all the players will propel us higher. 

It's a marathon not a sprint. 

Totally agree but dreading the leads game?

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14 hours ago, atherstoneram said:

Now i am not really a big fan of Rooney but have nothing against him, i certainly think he will have more of an impetus than Rosenior is having, i can't see what he has brought into the club.

What has Rosenior been tasked with and how are you measuring on how he has delivered against this?

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I've not been a fan of the Rooney deal from the very start, and as time goes on, it looks worse and worse.

Rooney joined us because in the last 5 years we have been a competitive Championship club. That's the attraction. He wants to be a part of something where there is a tangible end-goal. The play offs, promotion to the Premier League, etc.

I'm sure he doesn't want his career swansong to be the battle for 12th. Think of it in the same way that Terry joined Villa. Did he join simply to play football? Or did he join with the expectation that the club would be seriously pushing for promotion?

The early signs are that we will struggle to compete for promotion, so how wise is the Rooney deal looking right now? 

Of course, we could and should improve. But if we do not, I think we are going to look back and wonder if we could have done things differently.

If Rooney was only ever going to join in January, was it wise to invest so much of our time, energy and resources into getting the Rooney deal over the line in August? Efforts to strengthen other areas of the squad more immediately looked like an afterthought and half-hearted in the extreme. 

Cocu is a professional. I imagine he would have taken the whole Rooney sideshow in his stride. The only way I can see it being an issue for Cocu is if he was promised some quality signings to come straight in during the August transfer window and in the end he felt short changed. In which case, his issue would be with the club, not Rooney.

If Cocu has been undermined in any way, it's by the club and the club only. The Rooney sideshow could have rolled into town in November when Cocu had his feet under the table and the club had appeared to be fully recovered and moved on from the original sideshow - Lampard.

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Problem most whingeing Derby fans have is they all say in the summer they are happy for a season of transition, for a manager to come in, take time to build properly and create a team capable of getting promotion, but when it actually shows signs of happening they jump off a cliff and we end up with threads like this. 

 I'm very happy with Cocu, I'm very happy with Rooney. The squad could be better but there are players there who are not yet playing to their potential for a number of reasons. We've shown we can compete with the best teams in the division. It's a slow start, that's all. 

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2 hours ago, VulcanRam said:

Problem most whingeing Derby fans have is they all say in the summer they are happy for a season of transition, for a manager to come in, take time to build properly and create a team capable of getting promotion, but when it actually shows signs of happening they jump off a cliff and we end up with threads like this. 

 I'm very happy with Cocu, I'm very happy with Rooney. The squad could be better but there are players there who are not yet playing to their potential for a number of reasons. We've shown we can compete with the best teams in the division. It's a slow start, that's all. 

you know when you say not playing to their potential mi owd dunt you feel a bit cheated?? these people are on serious life changing wages ... they will earn more in  a year or two than most of us watching will earn in a life time... Dunt that make you  feel a bit sick.... if i rocked up on  building site ta do sum plastering and wa crap and  i said ta gaffer "  dunt worry pal im not up ta mi full potential yet "  .....what do ya reckon he would say?

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13 minutes ago, Owd miner said:

if i rocked up on  building site ta do sum plastering and wa crap and  i said ta gaffer "  dunt worry pal im not up ta mi full potential yet "  .....what do ya reckon he would say?

"Okay - Make sure you pick it up as quick as you can please otherwise we'll have to get someone else" - Precisely what they say to footballers

You seem to be annoyed that the players get paid crazy wages - That's just market forces at work - Just cos they're paid a lot doesn't mean they're any smarter or able to learn any quicker than anyone else - In fact a lot of the time the subtle changes they're asked to make by coaches are lost on them for a while because they don't always understand what's required of them right away - PLUS they have to deal with trying to learn a system of play with 10 other guys

The equivalent in you analogy would be turning up to a building site and the gaffer asking you to do some plastering, but he wants you to use a new technique you've never used before and he also wants you to do it whilst tied with ropes to your wrists to 10 other plasterers all working on the same wall

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Too early yet, let Cocu have the time he needs.  We had a shiite pre-season.  We lost PL quality loan signings which we simply haven't (dare I say, couldn't) replace.  We've had a number of key injuries (Marriott, Bogle).  We're starting to utilise promising youngsters (Sibley, Buchanan etc) but they need time.  We still retain a few players IMO we ought to move on as not good, or consistent enough (Bennett, Lawrence).  But things are happening. The signs of the team gelling and improving are there. It needs time.  Time possibly even for the likes of Martin to rediscover his Billy Wizz boots.

I don't go with the transition theory.  For me a new manager equals transition comments as they reshape.  We've had too many changes in that department.  I think Cocu will succeed but he needs time and our patience.  Difficult I know as we expect and want so much.  Personally I am excited about Rooney joining.  Not because he'll score a sackful (if he does awesome) but because he'll bring so much invaluable experience at a time we historically slump. 

Yes I want, even need wins, but we need to give this guy some time....unless of course we end up in the bottom 3 then I'll be clamouring for his removal and everything I just said counts for nowt ?

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