RadioactiveWaste Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 46 minutes ago, GenBr said: It reeks of desperation to me. Gibson ****** up when they got relegated by appointing Tony Pulis and then allowing him to piddle away millions of pounds in parachute payments on crap players and high wages. They failed to get back to the Prem and now they are about to lose their parachute payments, but still have all their extra costs to cover. The only thing he has done so far to cut costs was to get rid of half the people on minimum wage that work at the club. I also assume the appointment of Woodgate was a cost cutting exercise as well. I reckon they are very close to breaching FFP and he is desperately scratching around for alternative sources of revenue to try and fix his **** up. Didn't he appoint Gary "totally legitimate agent relationship" Monk and let him sign Cyrus Christie prior to Pulis? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenBr Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 29 minutes ago, AdamRam said: I wasn’t aware the review of the sustainability rules were included so thanks for that. Clubs will still look to exploit them though when there is so much at risk for breaking them, we only have to look at parliament to see no matter what rules are in place, people will always look to bend them. https://www.efl.com/news/2019/september/efl-announces-financial-and-sustainability-review/ Any changes still have to be approved at the next EFL general meeting in 2020 though, so we will have to wait for the results to see if anything is going to change. FFP is not fit for purpose and does not work when teams have such large parachute payments - hopefully something will change. The stadium loophole is the EFL's fault in the first place - they removed the regulation that prevented it happening previously. Just now, RadioactiveWaste said: Didn't he appoint Gary "totally legitimate agent relationship" Monk and let him sign Cyrus Christie prior to Pulis? Don't forget Ryan Shotton as well. Personally I don't think Karanka was that great a managerial appointment either even though he got them promoted - very boring to watch and was never going to be able to keep them up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 There was a recent article on the wealth of EFL owners and Gibson was quite low down. Something like a net worth of 100 million, so this is probably getting his goat too. On the article some EFL owners were worth Billions. Make our Mel look a pauper. This demonstrates what is wrong with FFP or whatever you want to call it. If I am worth 2 billion quid, and buy Burton or Whomever, why shouldnt i be able to put 500 million in if I want provided its structured in a way that it doesnt impact the club in a negative way financially. Its not the fact Mel found a loophole thats the issue, the issue is he should have been able to pump 80 million quid in if he so desired without anyone questioning it. FFP is holding clubs back., Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archram Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 I like that FFP is not Fit For Purpose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimmu Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 Have to say I feel for their fans. Gibson's personal vendetta (I'd love to know what the real motives are) against DCFC/Mel is getting so ridiculous it's making their whole club bit of a laughing stock. Gibosn vs EFL is bit like Leeds vs notts forest. I want both of them to lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 Perhaps a really enterprising lawyer is just going to Gibson "Hey Steve, you could sue Derby County, you could sue the EFL, you could sue.........." "Have you been involved in a failed promotion challenge that wasn't your fault, call Spurious Litigation Partners" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 I missed this bit 'Earlier this summer, it was reported some Premier League clubs wanted the apparent loophole closed.' No doubt they do. Probably just be better for them to make the PL a closed shop and have done with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamworthram Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 49 minutes ago, Dimmu said: Have to say I feel for their fans. Gibson's personal vendetta (I'd love to know what the real motives are) against DCFC/Mel is getting so ridiculous it's making their whole club bit of a laughing stock. Gibosn vs EFL is bit like Leeds vs notts forest. I want both of them to lose. I would suspect there is no personal vendetta against Derby. It just so happens that we pipped them to the play offs and if the EFL had docked us points, as he seems to think they should have done, then Middlesborough would have got their instead. . I'm sure if Bristol had finished 6th instead of us and done the same as us in terms of selling their stadium then his case would be against them not us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 5 minutes ago, Paul71 said: I missed this bit 'Earlier this summer, it was reported some Premier League clubs wanted the apparent loophole closed.' No doubt they do. Probably just be better for them to make the PL a closed shop and have done with it. The Premier league would love to scrap relegation or mitigate it to being a none issue where only 6-8 clubs ever yoyo and the championship is so weak recent PL teams will always come back. its one of the ironys that clubs in competitive leagues dearly wish they'd be less competitive so they could have things their own way (no one really believes the old firm would be happy if Aberdeen, the Dundee clubs and Edinburgh clubs were serious challenges for the league....) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coneheadjohn Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 1 hour ago, RadioactiveWaste said: Didn't he appoint Gary "totally legitimate agent relationship" Monk and let him sign Cyrus Christie prior to Pulis? Ahh yes,Gary ‘ethical’Monk. Nice fit at Wednesday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 1 minute ago, RadioactiveWaste said: The Premier league would love to scrap relegation or mitigate it to being a none issue where only 6-8 clubs ever yoyo and the championship is so weak recent PL teams will always come back. its one of the ironys that clubs in competitive leagues dearly wish they'd be less competitive so they could have things their own way (no one really believes the old firm would be happy if Aberdeen, the Dundee clubs and Edinburgh clubs were serious challenges for the league....) Agree - I bet Celtic have loved having the league to themselves while Rangers had their issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 12 hours ago, Ambitious said: I’ve just had a look: our wage bill was £40.5m and theirs was £49m. £9m a year is over £170k more a week. It’s over 20% higher than ours. FFP? The only way it ever works is if there’s is a wage cap for all teams. We’ve literally got a team spending substantially more on wages telling us we’re braking the rules for overspending. The irony isn’t lost on me and just goes to show why these regulations aren’t fit for purpose. Been saying this for years. Only fair way to sort it. No percentage of turnover, as that only benefits the bigger clubs, a base amount agreed on before the season starts. Parity... Also, that's when scouting systems & academies come into their own. Everyone would be more willing to take a punt on lesser known players in the hope they come good while costing them peanuts, compared to higher value players. As for Gibson. Mel's got his feet up in the 10 bedroom mansion, he's renting inside his head, and has been for months ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 5 minutes ago, ramsbottom said: Been saying this for years. Only fair way to sort it. No percentage of turnover, as that only benefits the bigger clubs, a base amount agreed on before the season starts. Parity... Also, that's when scouting systems & academies come into their own. Everyone would be more willing to take a punt on lesser known players in the hope they come good while costing them peanuts, compared to higher value players. As for Gibson. Mel's got his feet up in the 10 bedroom mansion, he's renting inside his head, and has been for months ??? I dont agree with a wage cap. I get the idea but dont think what people earn is anyone elses business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 3 minutes ago, Paul71 said: I dont agree with a wage cap. I get the idea but dont think what people earn is anyone elses business. You wouldn't have to declare everyone's wage like they do in the NFL/NBA etc. Plus when you sign a player who's been offered the same amount by a number of clubs, you know he's actually wants to play for you, instead of just going where the money is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 11 minutes ago, Paul71 said: I dont agree with a wage cap. I get the idea but dont think what people earn is anyone elses business. I agree, but like the NFL it allows teams to distribute the wealth accordingly. If you want a top striker, you have to make cuts elsewhere. It also tempers wage expectation, which this division badly needs. The issue I have with the current system, based on turnover, is that a good proportion of teams get substantial head start. Now, from a business point of view this makes sense because that is income the club has earned. No problem with that. The problem is that, based on the current structure, teams who don't have the luxury of those payments and can't enhance their income through a TV deal, which lets face it is the money pit, mean they can't protect themselves. If everyone lives by their means then this solution happens: Club A sign John Doe for £1m and £10k-a-week. They spent within their means. John Doe has a great season. Club B gets relegated and wants a striker, starts talking to the guy's agent about £30-40k-a-week. Now, Club A can't afford that without going out of their means. Club B's parachute payment means they can spend that in keep within their means. John Doe kicks up a fuss. If you had a wage cap, Club A would be allowed to secure that asset if they wanted. The current system means that without creative accounting then they don't have a chance. It's just my opinion, but that's how I see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncanjwitham Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 The reason the wage cap works in the NFL is that it's basically a closed eco-system designed to keep the league competitive. The wage-cap, the structure of player contracts, the roster limits, the draft, waivers etc all feed into this. Football has none of that, at least in part because it's spread across so many different countries, with different standards of living and levels of pay. If we introduced a wage-cap in England, the top players would all just go and play in Spain and Italy. There are no real other competing American Football teams outside of the NFL, either in wage terms or stature, for players to go and play for (yeah there's CFL, but it's nowhere near the same level). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said: The reason the wage cap works in the NFL is that it's basically a closed eco-system designed to keep the league competitive. The wage-cap, the structure of player contracts, the roster limits, the draft, waivers etc all feed into this. Football has none of that, at least in part because it's spread across so many different countries, with different standards of living and levels of pay. If we introduced a wage-cap in England, the top players would all just go and play in Spain and Italy. There are no real other competing American Football teams outside of the NFL, either in wage terms or stature, for players to go and play for (yeah there's CFL, but it's nowhere near the same level). Can anyone imagine FiFA, UEFA, all top leagues, all other associations trying to agree to something like that? I'd invest in a Manila envelope making company the abount of bungs that's go round.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Paul71 said: I missed this bit 'Earlier this summer, it was reported some Premier League clubs wanted the apparent loophole closed.' No doubt they do. Probably just be better for them to make the PL a closed shop and have done with it. also known as the "Gartside Gambit" after the eponymous Bolton owner........? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 2 hours ago, Dimmu said: Have to say I feel for their fans. Gibson's personal vendetta (I'd love to know what the real motives are) against DCFC/Mel is getting so ridiculous it's making their whole club bit of a laughing stock. Gibosn vs EFL is bit like Leeds vs notts forest. I want both of them to lose. A few verdicts going one way or the other, reversals of those decisions on appeal etc and you may get your wish. The only problem with that is that the only winners then would be lawyers, and as someone who subscribes to the sentiments of the old joke... Q: "What do you call a hundred lawyers lying at the bottom of the ocean?" A: "A good start" I would like them to lose too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted September 13, 2019 Share Posted September 13, 2019 Does this move imply any progress in his action against DCFC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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