v Swansea City (H) Match Thread

[FindernRam]

3 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

Hey - I'm the mood hoover round here......?

Ive got the handle and everything

Oi that's my job! Anyway I'm abdicating that particular crown. Where team is concerned I'm going to be Mr Happy Clappy- We'll see how long that lasts.

Anyway my ears have stopped ringing from the prematch sound system so I'm happy now!

[Duracell]

1 hour ago, Ellafella said:

Yes we were defensively sound. But everywhere else we were very pedestrian. Pedestrian is the word. Slow ponderous and very reminiscent of the Paul Clement days. In sharp contrast to Monday night against Huddersfield where we were sharp and incisive. We don’t have the balance right in midfield. We need a player who has vision and drive and who can inject some pace and hunger. We need Holmes back and hopefully Bielik will give us that cutting edge.

Swansea are a good side who will be top 8 but we made it way too comfortable for them. They cantered to a 0-0 and hardly broke sweat. It was a dull forgettable game and it says a lot when your 18 year old full-back carried your most attacking threat. 

I suspect Cocu will be desperate for Bielik to get fit. Personally I would have thrown a wild card in yesterday and I can’t see Why Josefzoon is getting such a long run of chances. For me, he just doesn’t have the requisite football brain for Championship football. 

Not a disaster but we looked leaden legged against an average-good opponent. 

Would you be making such sweeping statements if this the 42nd game of the season rather than the 2nd game of the season?

The problem with the early few games is that we over-analyse every moment.

After Huddersfield, the first half was 50% of our entire season so far. Gave us an over-inflated view of where we are.

Yesterday it didn’t come off. But now unless Bielik comes in, it’s heading the same way as Clement?

 

[dcfcfan1]

1 minute ago, Duracell said:

Would you be making such sweeping statements if this the 42nd game of the season rather than the 2nd game of the season?

The problem with the early few games is that we over-analyse every moment.

After Huddersfield, the first half was 50% of our entire season so far. Gave us an over-inflated view of where we are.

Yesterday it didn’t come off. But now unless Bielik comes in, it’s heading the same way as Clement?

 

See what you are saying, and I agree that this is inaccurate as we are defensively better than we were under clement. But its clear we lack a box to box CM to get further forward and create us another option into the box. Evans and Huddlestone dont have the engine to do so. Shinnie, think is a DM also. Holmes could do, but is never fit, and dowell is our source of creativity. 

[Zag zig]

2 hours ago, Ambitious said:

I’m not entirely sure why everyone is down about the performance yesterday, personally I thought we played well and it just wasn’t our day in front of goal. It happens. 

I thought we had good control of the ball, good outlets when playing out from the back and got into good positions quite comfortably and quickly. Defensively, I didn’t feel like we were ever troubled. It’s a very good foundation for pushing on. 

My main gripe yesterday was essentially playing Huddlestone and Evans both sitting, we lacked spark first half through the middle. Paterson at least provided that, as would a fit Holmes. It was like having 2 CDM’s for a home game and slowed us down.

Other than creating more chances by ironing out rusty passing, getting better movement it was ok (and better than last seasons opener at home anyway).

[Duracell]

1 minute ago, dcfcfan1 said:

See what you are saying, and I agree that this is inaccurate as we are defensively better than we were under clement. But its clear we lack a box to box CM to get further forward and create us another option into the box. Evans and Huddlestone dont have the engine to do so. Shinnie, think is a DM also. Holmes could do, but is never fit, and dowell is our source of creativity. 

That’s unfair on Holmes - once in the team last season, he wasn’t out again until his injury in the play-off semi which still hasn’t really gone away. He’ll have a big part to play this season.

The performance is only worrying if Cocu point blank refuses to change anything - otherwise it’s a performance symptomatic of teething issues. We’ll quickly become predictable and easy to snuff out if things don’t change, but I don’t think 4-2-3-1 will last long in its present format, nor will the current starting XI.

[Duracell]

Just now, Zag zig said:

My main gripe yesterday was essentially playing Huddlestone and Evans both sitting, we lacked spark first half through the middle. Paterson at least provided that, as would a fit Holmes. It was like having 2 CDM’s for a home game and slowed us down.

Other than creating more chances by ironing out rusty passing, getting better movement it was ok (and better than last seasons opener at home anyway).

Encouraging we changed at the first opportunity though, no?

[admira]

Well at least we can say that yesterday went better than Frank’s first home game 

[Zag zig]

5 minutes ago, Duracell said:

Encouraging we changed at the first opportunity though, no?

Absolutely, should have added that.

[Sparkle]

3 minutes ago, Duracell said:

That’s unfair on Holmes - once in the team last season, he wasn’t out again until his injury in the play-off semi which still hasn’t really gone away. He’ll have a big part to play this season.

The performance is only worrying if Cocu point blank refuses to change anything - otherwise it’s a performance symptomatic of teething issues. We’ll quickly become predictable and easy to snuff out if things don’t change, but I don’t think 4-2-3-1 will last long in its present format, nor will the current starting XI.

I agree but we may well see 2 defensive midfielders away from home frequently 

to get Marriott in the team we will need to play 442 or basically 2 up front together or if it has to be 433 with Marriott he would need Waghorn and Bennett  on both flanks 

[Ramos]

2 hours ago, dcfcfan1 said:

Cant bank on holmes playing 30-40 games a season, the lad is injury prone. More of a bonus luxury player to me

Hmm maybe so, but fingers crossed he can get fit cause i think he's our most talented player on the ball. 

[Ellafella]

57 minutes ago, Duracell said:

Would you be making such sweeping statements if this the 42nd game of the season rather than the 2nd game of the season?

The problem with the early few games is that we over-analyse every moment.

After Huddersfield, the first half was 50% of our entire season so far. Gave us an over-inflated view of where we are.

Yesterday it didn’t come off. But now unless Bielik comes in, it’s heading the same way as Clement?

 

I’m just telling it how I saw it @Duracell. I’m not making any forecasts & if you look at my other posts you’ll see I’ve always maintained we’re a work in progress. Very early days but midfield remains a problem to be sorted. 

[Woodley Ram]

3 hours ago, 1977 Ram Raider said:

We’ll sign who we want, We’ll sign who we want, We’re Derby County, We’ll sign who we want.

That was a great chant, also enjoyed the South Stand boxing Swansea in a corner so that they could sing England England England awesome , good banter between the two sets of supporters 

[Marriot Ram99]

2 hours ago, Tyler Durden said:

I don't think that that there will be a direct correlation between the % reduction in the matchday ticket price and the realised % increase in attendance, more a law of diminishing returns.

You may get a few more casual floaters in but not enough to offset the drop in revenue from lowering the ticket prices 

 

As someone who did Economics I realise that , but my thinking was more it might worth the trade-off if the revenue isn't affected much and there is maybe another 1000  fans coming each week who may come to more game if tickets were about 10% cheaper in the cheaper areas to specifically get people who might not be able to afford to go to many games, for example there is always lot of empty seats in the eastern part of the North Stand near the screen.

[Comrade 86]

4 hours ago, Marriott Ram99 said:

It wasn't dire but that was hardly playing well, on the ball we were ponderous and slow,  fullbacks were our only outlet and that is not a viable strategy for creating chances when you have Malone left back and not someone like Alba or Marcelo. Wingers were very ineffective, transition play very poor and predictable huddlestone and Dowell needed to show for the ball more and the whole shape of the midfield was completely off. Defensively we were OK but should have conceded if not for very poor finishing from their sub striker. 

Not true and even if it were, isn't that the modern game. Are fullbacks not a go to option these days with them expected to support and overlap their wingers. Also, Malone is very much an attacking fullback - if I had a gripe with him at all, it's npt that he's slow or unattacking, it would be that he can get caught out in defence. To me, in the modern game, wingers and their respective fullbacks are almost interchangeable and need to share both attacking and defensive duties. I've really no problem with that to be fair.

Likewise trhe 'ponderous and slow' comment - did you not see how Swansea set up. Was their whole game pan not to stay sold and cut out passing options? Would you rather we lump moved the ball forward whether there's a sensible out-ball or not? If so you are in for a very long season my friend as that is not the Cocu way. 

You've also had a sideways dig at the defence, but they restricted Swansea to one really good chance across the 90 minutes. You seem to suggest we were lucky for their missed chance without acknowledging we had half a dozen and on a different day might have netted several times. Malone's issues late in the game aside, I think our defence looks better than it has in a good long while and that in Keogh and Clarke, we now have one of the strongest CH pairing potentially flanked by two outstanding young FBs, injuries notwithstanding.

All in all I find your analysis not only overly picky but wholly unreflective of the game I watched. Sorry! If that game was played 10 times, we'd probably win 7 or 8 of them and I'm staggered that you think otherwise.

[ramboy63]

20 hours ago, DJFern94 said:

Wisdom and Anya? I agree, not on the same level as Bogle, but they are cover. 

Wisdom is injured also and Anya! Really

[jono]

If the pen had gone in that would have been an entirely different game. They will be happy with a point, If we had been one up they would have come for us and made space. That save changed the game, and it was a save not a miss. A Mac side or a Clement side could easily have conceded a late one. I am encouraged, especially as we have some legs waiting to join the team to off set our slightly cruise mode midfield

[angieram]

32 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said:

Not true and even if it were, isn't that the modern game. Are fullbacks not a go to option these days with them expected to support and overlap their wingers. Also, Malone is very much an attacking fullback - if I had a gripe with him at all, it's npt that he's slow or unattacking, it would be that he can get caught out in defence. To me, in the modern game, wingers and their respective fullbacks are almost interchangeable and need to share both attacking and defensive duties. I've really no problem with that to be fair.

Likewise trhe 'ponderous and slow' comment - did you not see how Swansea set up. Was their whole game pan not to stay sold and cut out passing options? Would you rather we lump moved the ball forward whether there's a sensible out-ball or not? If so you are in for a very long season my friend as that is not the Cocu way. 

You've also had a sideways dig at the defence, but they restricted Swansea to one really good chance across the 90 minutes. You seem to suggest we were lucky for their missed chance without acknowledging we had half a dozen and on a different day might have netted several times. Malone's issues late in the game aside, I think our defence looks better than it has in a good long while and that in Keogh and Clarke, we now have one of the strongest CH pairing potentially flanked by two outstanding young FBs, injuries notwithstanding.

All in all I find your analysis not only overly picky but wholly unreflective of the game I watched. Sorry! If that game was played 10 times, we'd probably win 7 or 8 of them and I'm staggered that you think otherwise.

Just watched the Championship highlights. Amazing how many goals come from lucky defensive deflections that just fell to a free striker. 

Swansea were so compact in their box it was hard enough to find any space, let alone when the ball isn't going for you. 

[Ramos]

Classic championship tbh. Start the season with an extremely positive display against Huddersfield and follow it up with a lacklustre display against a well organised team. We should be use to this by now. Look at Leeds, ripped Bristol city apart and then had to settle for a point against what was a poor forest side against West Brom (not sure if they looked better yesterday). Seen more than enough positive signs in the first two games to know we are building towards something. Potentially 2 or 3 players from the side that could go for top 2. Defensively very sound, just lacked a little imagination yesterday in the final third. Give cocu 2 more transfer windows and I think he will build a very promising side.

[Marriot Ram99]

1 hour ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said:

Not true and even if it were, isn't that the modern game. Are fullbacks not a go to option these days with them expected to support and overlap their wingers. Also, Malone is very much an attacking fullback - if I had a gripe with him at all, it's npt that he's slow or unattacking, it would be that he can get caught out in defence. To me, in the modern game, wingers and their respective fullbacks are almost interchangeable and need to share both attacking and defensive duties. I've really no problem with that to be fair.

Likewise trhe 'ponderous and slow' comment - did you not see how Swansea set up. Was their whole game pan not to stay sold and cut out passing options? Would you rather we lump moved the ball forward whether there's a sensible out-ball or not? If so you are in for a very long season my friend as that is not the Cocu way. 

You've also had a sideways dig at the defence, but they restricted Swansea to one really good chance across the 90 minutes. You seem to suggest we were lucky for their missed chance without acknowledging we had half a dozen and on a different day might have netted several times. Malone's issues late in the game aside, I think our defence looks better than it has in a good long while and that in Keogh and Clarke, we now have one of the strongest CH pairing potentially flanked by two outstanding young FBs, injuries notwithstanding.

All in all I find your analysis not only overly picky but wholly unreflective of the game I watched. Sorry! If that game was played 10 times, we'd probably win 7 or 8 of them and I'm staggered that you think otherwise.

1. I said its not a viable strategy if its your only outlet and one of your fullbacks has bad end product- which is true Malone cant cross for his life and isn't fast.  If we had more options it would be ok to use our fullbacks for width.

2.They sat deep so what?, everyone sits deep vs Leeds and all good teams at this level, doesn't mean its not possible to pass quickly through the lines with quick inter change to create chances, but are midfield is  too pedestrian and our wingers do duck all for most of the match, Lawrence needs to show wide and provide some crosses into the box, constantly drifting infield into traffic doesn't work unless you are some top world class player.  

3.Not a sideways dig- Just it was sloppy and we could have lost vs a better team becuase of a few errors showing that although are defence are good, most games we will concede 1 goal atleast so if our attack isn't on it we will come away with nothing.

4. I don't buy that- from the 70th minute mark It was obvious we wouldn't score, yes we could have easily won and it wasn't a crap performance but if we play like that all season we will finish midtable, we need to be more sharp and incisive in the final third, hopefully Marriott will come into the team and Beilik will add some energy into the midfield to drive us forward.  That performance wasn't just down to bad luck apart from the pen and the odd run and cross from Bogle we rarely looked like scoring and it was a snooze fest . I'm sure Cocu will realise that wasn't good enough, we should take Jozefoon out ,and Waghorn out for Scunthorpe and if Marriott and Paterson play well give them a start vs Stoke.

[Comrade 86]

34 minutes ago, Marriott Ram99 said:

1. I said its not a viable strategy if its your only outlet and one of your fullbacks has bad end product- which is true Malone cant cross for his life and isn't fast.  If we had more options it would be ok to use our fullbacks for width.

2.They sat deep so what?, everyone sits deep vs Leeds and all good teams at this level, doesn't mean its not possible to pass quickly through the lines with quick inter change to create chances, but are midfield is  too pedestrian and our wingers do duck all for most of the match, Lawrence needs to show wide and provide some crosses into the box, constantly drifting infield into traffic doesn't work unless you are some top world class player.  

3.Not a sideways dig- Just it was sloppy and we could have lost vs a better team becuase of a few errors showing that although are defence are good, most games we will concede 1 goal atleast so if our attack isn't on it we will come away with nothing.

4. I don't buy that- from the 70th minute mark It was obvious we wouldn't score, yes we could have easily won and it wasn't a crap performance but if we play like that all season we will finish midtable, we need to be more sharp and incisive in the final third, hopefully Marriott will come into the team and Beilik will add some energy into the midfield to drive us forward.  That performance wasn't just down to bad luck apart from the pen and the odd run and cross from Bogle we rarely looked like scoring and it was a snooze fest . I'm sure Cocu will realise that wasn't good enough, we should take Jozefoon out ,and Waghorn out for Scunthorpe and if Marriott and Paterson play well give them a start vs Stoke.

Sorry mate - don't agree with a single word of that save for players to return improving the starting 11. I guess it's all about expectations and mine is that with new players and a new coach who've really not had much time together, a squad weakened by absentees and injuries and the fact it's only our second run out, there's far more positives to derive than you'd have us believe. Far worse teams than Swansea will set out to strangle games and if you really think it's that easy to break them down then we'll just have to agree to disagree. I am a world-class happy-clapper though so what do I know!