Sexydadbod Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 5 minutes ago, brady1993 said: Whilst true this was less to do with individual players and more to do with not consistently being able to build and apply pressure. Which was partially tactical and partially to do with missing a few pieces i.e. a good fit at DM and a linking midfielder (Although Holmes was growing into this). In a strange way Bielik might be crucial in this by quickly snuffing counter attacks and immediately getting us on the front foot we can keep teams penned in better leading to more opportunities. The bottom part would be true if we had natural pace on the counter, but we don’t in my opinion. Lawrence and Jozefzoon tend to slow the play down quite a bit through overdribbling. I agree with your other point though, Bielik will help get it forward quicker and more accurately, George Thorne esc. We have a nice blend in defence and midfield through recent signings, I just don’t think our widemen are quite good enough presently. I get the feeling that Cocu actually encourages individual wide players to express themselves. Looking at history, he likes his widemen to contribute by scoring lots of goals, namely Depay and Lozano. Someone like Ince or Wilson would have done well under Cocu by this same token. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brady1993 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 3 minutes ago, McLovin said: Dowell did well at forest but he only scored 2 last season for a free flowing sheff Utd side, it remains to be seen how effective he will be for us, good talent though. Wilson scored 15 in the league for us last season, then we need to factor in that I highly doubt Waghorn and Marriott will play together like Frank did at times, Frank played Waghorn on rw to fit Waghorn and Marriott in the same side which probably took the pressure off both of them as their movement stretched the game for each other. We can assume that only one of them will play at one given time listening to Cocu so there will be pressure on one of them to score more goals, at the same time meaning theyd be easier to mark for opposition teams if only one of them are on the pitch. Waghorn did well at times as a lone forward, then at other times struggled badly. Am I right in saying his best form throughout his career is when he’s part of a front 2? I’d see your point if Lawrence and Jozefzoon were ‘assist’ wide men as Waghorn would get more chances. However, they don’t really get assists or create many scoring chances, I can see Waghorn getting a bit frustrated actually playing with them two long term because they tend to dribble, or should I say try to dribble a lot and they don’t get it into the box early like Waghorn wants. A striker is only as good as their service. If I remember rightly Dowell didn't get much game time for Sheff United and came in part way through the season where here we are lining up as a first choice so I think his time at forest is more comparable. On Waghorn most of Waghorns goals came when he was actually up front and I can't really remember him struggling up front on his own. As to playing his best football as a two I'm not sure if I'm honest but from what I've seen I think he will do well as a lone forward. You are right though that we will likely be leaving one of Mariott and Waghorn out but that doesn't mean the other won't chip in. My point on the whole is that the only goals we are "losing" is going to be Wilson's. Which I think will be covered with a combination of a new RW, Waghorn scoring more and the team scoring more through better coaching and have more suited personal (see my point about Bielik). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nogbad van 50 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 14 minutes ago, sage said: Come on Mel...sign up Ramselaar and Ibe (loan) and we look top 6 again. Doubtful as Bournemouth have just lost Brookes for three months! ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brady1993 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 5 minutes ago, McLovin said: The bottom part would be true if we had natural pace on the counter, but we don’t in my opinion. Lawrence and Jozefzoon tend to slow the play down quite a bit through overdribbling. I agree with your other point though, Bielik will help get it forward quicker and more accurately, George Thorne esc. We have a nice blend in defence and midfield through recent signings, I just don’t think our widemen are quite good enough presently. I get the feeling that Cocu actually encourages individual wide players to express themselves. Looking at history, he likes his widemen to contribute by scoring lots of goals, namely Depay and Lozano. Someone like Ince or Wilson would have done well under Cocu by this same token. Sorry I should have been clearer on what I mean with the bit in bold. I'm specifically referring to a situation that would happen a lot last year which was we would attack, the attack would break down, the opposition would counter, cut easily through the midfield, run the ball deep into our half and completely relieve the pressure they were under by their early attack. If you watch back to us under McClaren or Wassell Eustace/Thorne would snuff out counter attacks before they began and therefore the pressure on the opposition never gets released. They would wknthe ball high up the pitch and quickly turn it over with our side still in attacking positions. Also the stuff you aluded to about having a DM move the ball quickly will help a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brady1993 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 27 minutes ago, sage said: Come on Mel...sign up Ramselaar and Ibe (loan) and we look top 6 again. I genuinely think if we did that we'd make a serious challenge at top 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuwtfly Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 Any early whispers on who this number 7 might be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKRam Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 Well I’m drinking lots of real ale in Halifax and from all the hyperbole (have I spelt that right?) I’d say we’re doing better than Halifax Town, happy days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gee SCREAMER !! Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 46 minutes ago, HantsRam said: If only Gibson had been prepared to meet Gibsons asking price for the Riverside! Needs to learn from Mel the master......? my mate believes part of the ground was council funded and therefore they can't go down this route . Never mind eh. Tell you what Forest have a first team squad of 40 players this season . Squad cost about 30 million and wages must be huge . That's not including all the loan fee's . Knock Knock. Who's there ? The FFP Police ya nobbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab a dab doo Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 You can see the structured way in which Mr Cocu and his staff work. They have quietly assess the strength and weakness of team given everyone a fair chance to show what they can do. Then seeing what the deficiencies of the squad are, set about addressing them. He has far more structured and thoughtful approach to management gained by both his experiences as top class player and as a successful manager. This where he will score over Frank. When things begin to go wrong or not as planned he has shown to be more able and capable of reacting and adapting to situations to rectify matters. At times Frank appeared lost and indecisive (as at Wembley) and the 'moment' was lost. This think i will lead to us being far more consistent in both our performances and hopefully results. If not this year then certainly in the mid-term we will be developed into a team feared by our opponents. This we all hope will then lead us to 'the promised land' where we ultimately belong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCFC27 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 I would imagine one of these players will be a keeper, if we could tempt Forster to come on loan I would say we could have the best defense in the championship with depth too. GK Forster/Roos CB - Keogh & Clarke - Davies/Evans RB - Bogle/Wisdom LB - Malone/Fozzy/Lowe CDM - Beilik/Huddlestone Obviously Forster would be a long shot and I doubt we have even looked at him with his wages but if we could tempt a top championship goalkeeper to our squad with the defense we now have we will make top 6. Obviously we need some more going forward but a strong defense can take you into the top two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard246 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 Harry Wilson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedSox Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 17 minutes ago, Richard246 said: Harry Wilson Harry Wilson what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wignall12 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 53 minutes ago, Richard246 said: Harry Wilson As Keeper ? .....don't be daft !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard246 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 is Harry coming back let's see Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyinLiverpool Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 24 minutes ago, Richard246 said: is Harry coming back let's see no, he's not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plymouthram Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 8 hours ago, AdamRam said: Old news this one, I read we were in for him but had lost out but this was last week. Browne played for Boro at Luton tonight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plymouthram Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 4 hours ago, Rab a dab doo said: You can see the structured way in which Mr Cocu and his staff work. They have quietly assess the strength and weakness of team given everyone a fair chance to show what they can do. Then seeing what the deficiencies of the squad are, set about addressing them. He has far more structured and thoughtful approach to management gained by both his experiences as top class player and as a successful manager. This where he will score over Frank. When things begin to go wrong or not as planned he has shown to be more able and capable of reacting and adapting to situations to rectify matters. At times Frank appeared lost and indecisive (as at Wembley) and the 'moment' was lost. This think i will lead to us being far more consistent in both our performances and hopefully results. If not this year then certainly in the mid-term we will be developed into a team feared by our opponents. This we all hope will then lead us to 'the promised land' where we ultimately belong. Hope you are right on this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bald Eagle's Barmy Army Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 34 minutes ago, plymouthram said: Browne played for Boro at Luton tonight Does that mean he’s cup tied? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richinspain Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 13 hours ago, Rab a dab doo said: You can see the structured way in which Mr Cocu and his staff work. They have quietly assess the strength and weakness of team given everyone a fair chance to show what they can do. Then seeing what the deficiencies of the squad are, set about addressing them. He has far more structured and thoughtful approach to management gained by both his experiences as top class player and as a successful manager. This where he will score over Frank. When things begin to go wrong or not as planned he has shown to be more able and capable of reacting and adapting to situations to rectify matters. At times Frank appeared lost and indecisive (as at Wembley) and the 'moment' was lost. This think i will lead to us being far more consistent in both our performances and hopefully results. If not this year then certainly in the mid-term we will be developed into a team feared by our opponents. This we all hope will then lead us to 'the promised land' where we ultimately belong. Quoting you @Rab a dab doo because your's is the most recent. I agree entirely that Frank at times made some very "inexperienced" decisions, however it was his first year in management. Hopefully Cocu with the experience he has already gained will be able many of the problems Championship football throws at you, but Frank also may have learned many lessons and been able to react better this season. As for the signings, yes Cocu has had a very systematic approach but he has the advantage of picking up a squad assembled for the style he is expected to play. Frank had a hell of a lot of deadwood floating around which he either had to get rid of, or cast to one side. He'd done most of the hard work with many more players leaving this summer and surely must have known the players, or at least the type of players, that he wanted to bring in. I would imagine that much of his business would have been carried out weeks ago, probably even before going to America. Cocu would have received lots of advice from people still at the club regarding problem positions, but I'm glad that he has taken his time to assess fully the players at his disposal including those thrown on the scrap heap by various previous managers. His signings look very good on paper, hopefully he knows how to make it work on grass. However Frank may also have been able to do the same, we'll never know. All of this being said, I do believe that we have brought in a manager who is at least 3 or 4 years "better" and will be able to, get the better results out of his players. Only time will tell which of the two will have the better overall managerial career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaftesbury Street Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 15 hours ago, Nuwtfly said: Any early whispers on who this number 7 might be? Nothing, the only winger we have been linked too that hasn't gone to a rival team is Diangana. Can't see it being Wilson, we would have enquired but he'll likely go to a prem team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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