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Four new signings before the window closes


David

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5 minutes ago, brady1993 said:

Whilst true this was less to do with individual players and more to do with not consistently being able to build and apply pressure. Which was partially tactical and partially to do with missing a few pieces i.e. a good fit at DM and a linking midfielder (Although Holmes was growing into this). In a strange way Bielik might be crucial in this by quickly snuffing counter attacks and immediately getting us on the front foot we can keep teams penned in better leading to more opportunities.

The bottom part would be true if we had natural pace on the counter, but we don’t in my opinion. Lawrence and Jozefzoon tend to slow the play down quite a bit through overdribbling. I agree with your other point though, Bielik will help get it forward quicker and more accurately, George Thorne esc. We have a nice blend in defence and midfield through recent signings, I just don’t think our widemen are quite good enough presently. I get the feeling that Cocu actually encourages individual wide players to express themselves. Looking at history, he likes his widemen to contribute by scoring lots of goals, namely Depay and Lozano. Someone like Ince or Wilson would have done well under Cocu by this same token. 

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3 minutes ago, McLovin said:

Dowell did well at forest but he only scored 2 last season for a free flowing sheff Utd side, it remains to be seen how effective he will be for us, good talent though. Wilson scored 15 in the league for us last season, then we need to factor in that I highly doubt Waghorn and Marriott will play together like Frank did at times, Frank played Waghorn on rw to fit Waghorn and Marriott in the same side which probably took the pressure off both of them as their movement stretched the game for each other. We can assume that only one of them will play at one given time listening to Cocu so there will be pressure on one of them to score more goals, at the same time meaning theyd be easier to mark for opposition teams if only one of them are on the pitch. Waghorn did well at times as a lone forward, then at other times struggled badly. Am I right in saying his best form throughout his career is when he’s part of a front 2?

I’d see your point if Lawrence and Jozefzoon were ‘assist’ wide men as Waghorn would get more chances. However, they don’t really get assists or create many scoring chances, I can see Waghorn getting a bit frustrated actually playing with them two long term because they tend to dribble, or should I say try to dribble a lot and they don’t get it into the box early like Waghorn wants. A striker is only as good as their service.

If I remember rightly Dowell didn't get much game time for Sheff United and came in part way through the season where  here we are lining up as a first choice so I think his time at forest is more comparable.

On Waghorn most of Waghorns goals came when he was actually up front and I can't really remember him struggling up front on his own. As to playing his best football as a two I'm  not sure if I'm honest but from what I've seen I think he will do well as a lone forward. You are right though that we will likely be leaving one of Mariott and Waghorn out but that doesn't mean the other won't chip in.

My point on the whole is that the only goals we are "losing" is going to be Wilson's. Which I think will be covered with a combination of a new RW, Waghorn scoring more and the team scoring more through better coaching and have more suited personal (see my point about Bielik).

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5 minutes ago, McLovin said:

The bottom part would be true if we had natural pace on the counter, but we don’t in my opinion. Lawrence and Jozefzoon tend to slow the play down quite a bit through overdribbling. I agree with your other point though, Bielik will help get it forward quicker and more accurately, George Thorne esc. We have a nice blend in defence and midfield through recent signings, I just don’t think our widemen are quite good enough presently. I get the feeling that Cocu actually encourages individual wide players to express themselves. Looking at history, he likes his widemen to contribute by scoring lots of goals, namely Depay and Lozano. Someone like Ince or Wilson would have done well under Cocu by this same token. 

Sorry I should have been clearer on what I mean with the bit in bold.

I'm specifically referring to a situation that would happen a lot last year which was we would attack, the attack would break down, the opposition would counter, cut easily through the midfield, run the ball deep into our half and completely relieve the pressure they were under by their early attack. 

If you watch back to us under McClaren or Wassell Eustace/Thorne would snuff out counter attacks before they began and therefore the pressure on the opposition never gets released. They would wknthe ball high up the pitch and  quickly turn it over with our side still in attacking positions.

Also the stuff you aluded to about having a DM move the ball quickly will help a lot.

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46 minutes ago, HantsRam said:

If only Gibson had been prepared to meet Gibsons asking price for the Riverside!

Needs to learn from Mel the master......?

my mate believes part of the ground was council funded and therefore they can't go down this route . Never mind eh.   Tell you what Forest have a first team squad of 40 players this season .  Squad cost about 30 million and wages must be huge . That's not including all the loan fee's . Knock Knock. Who's there ? The FFP Police ya nobbers.

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You can see the structured way in which Mr Cocu and his staff work. They have quietly assess the strength and weakness of team given  everyone a fair chance to show what they can do. Then seeing what the deficiencies of the squad are, set about addressing them. 

He has far more structured and thoughtful approach to management gained by both his experiences as top class player and as a successful manager. This where he will score over Frank. When things begin to go wrong or not as planned he has shown to be more able and capable of reacting and adapting to situations to rectify matters. At times Frank appeared lost and indecisive (as at Wembley)  and the 'moment' was lost. 

This think i will lead to us being far more consistent in both our performances and hopefully results. If not this year then certainly in the mid-term we will be developed into a team feared by our opponents. This we all hope will then lead us to 'the promised land' where we ultimately belong.

 

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I would imagine one of these players will be a keeper, if we could tempt Forster to come on loan I would say we could have the best defense in the championship with depth too. 

 

GK Forster/Roos

CB - Keogh & Clarke - Davies/Evans 

RB - Bogle/Wisdom 

LB - Malone/Fozzy/Lowe

CDM - Beilik/Huddlestone 

 

Obviously Forster would be a long shot and I doubt we have even looked at him with his wages but if we could tempt a top championship goalkeeper to our squad with the defense we now have we will make top 6. Obviously we need some more going forward but a strong defense can take you into the top two.  

 

 

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4 hours ago, Rab a dab doo said:

You can see the structured way in which Mr Cocu and his staff work. They have quietly assess the strength and weakness of team given  everyone a fair chance to show what they can do. Then seeing what the deficiencies of the squad are, set about addressing them. 

He has far more structured and thoughtful approach to management gained by both his experiences as top class player and as a successful manager. This where he will score over Frank. When things begin to go wrong or not as planned he has shown to be more able and capable of reacting and adapting to situations to rectify matters. At times Frank appeared lost and indecisive (as at Wembley)  and the 'moment' was lost. 

This think i will lead to us being far more consistent in both our performances and hopefully results. If not this year then certainly in the mid-term we will be developed into a team feared by our opponents. This we all hope will then lead us to 'the promised land' where we ultimately belong.

 

Hope you are right on this

 

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13 hours ago, Rab a dab doo said:

You can see the structured way in which Mr Cocu and his staff work. They have quietly assess the strength and weakness of team given  everyone a fair chance to show what they can do. Then seeing what the deficiencies of the squad are, set about addressing them. 

He has far more structured and thoughtful approach to management gained by both his experiences as top class player and as a successful manager. This where he will score over Frank. When things begin to go wrong or not as planned he has shown to be more able and capable of reacting and adapting to situations to rectify matters. At times Frank appeared lost and indecisive (as at Wembley)  and the 'moment' was lost. 

This think i will lead to us being far more consistent in both our performances and hopefully results. If not this year then certainly in the mid-term we will be developed into a team feared by our opponents. This we all hope will then lead us to 'the promised land' where we ultimately belong.

 

Quoting you @Rab a dab doo because your's is the most recent. I agree entirely that Frank at times made some very "inexperienced" decisions, however it was his first year in management. Hopefully Cocu with the experience he has already gained will be able many of the problems Championship football throws at you, but Frank also may have learned many lessons and been able to react better this season. As for the signings, yes Cocu has had a very systematic approach but he has the advantage of picking up a squad assembled for the style he is expected to play. Frank had a hell of a lot of deadwood floating around which he either had to get rid of, or cast to one side. He'd done most of the hard work with many more players leaving this summer and surely must have known the players, or at least the type of players, that he wanted to bring in. I would imagine that much of his business would have been carried out weeks ago, probably even before going to America. Cocu would have received lots of advice from people still at the club regarding problem positions, but I'm glad that he has taken his time to assess fully the players at his disposal including those thrown on the scrap heap by various previous managers. His signings look very good on paper, hopefully he knows how to make it work on grass. However Frank may also have been able to do the same, we'll never know. All of this being said, I do believe that we have brought in a manager who is at least 3 or 4 years "better" and will be able to, get the better results out of his players. Only time will tell which of the two will have the better overall managerial career.

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