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BagRam

Kieran Dowell - Signed on season long loan & he hates Forest

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8 hours ago, EraniosSocks said:

 

Drinking in Sheffield later today, I’ll have some Derby clothing on so I’ll test this tune out when I’ve had ten pints or so.....hic 

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6 minutes ago, SKRam said:

Drinking in Sheffield later today, I’ll have some Derby clothing on so I’ll test this tune out when I’ve had ten pints or so.....hic 

I predict the United fans will join in while the Wednesday fans claim they came up with it and chastise you for stealing it

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A bit underwhelmed by this.

If we are aiming for top 6 and beyond again, Dowell will be a good squad player - someone who can be a rotation option or make an impact coming off the bench.

If he has been earmarked as a key player, then it’s a little worrying because I don’t think he is the answer. He certainly would be a downgrade on the likes of Mount and Wilson.

From the little that I’ve seen, I don’t think he’s a bad player by any stretch of the imagination, but is his overall game any better than Holmes, for example?

I just wouldn’t be building the side with Dowell as a key player. We need solid foundations and to think long term.

I just don’t see where he fits in personally. If we play him in midfield, he’s potentially going to create more problems than he solves because he’s lightweight, not very tenacious and seemingly mercurial. And if we play him out wide, it’s at the expense of more explosive players like Jozefzoon, Bennett and Lawrence.

To be honest, the only player that we’ve been linked with so far that excites me is Cavaleiro.

But hey, there’s more to come. I am sure Cocu still has a few aces up his sleeve.

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Happy if he is as good as said, but it did get me to wondering, is our academy that good if we keep having players on loan? Are they at the top purely because the prem clubs loan out all of their talent? If so maybe thats why we dont get the big bucks for them why until Bogle not that many (I know Hughes and Hendrick came through) get in the first team?

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42 minutes ago, Woodley Ram said:

Happy if he is as good as said, but it did get me to wondering, is our academy that good if we keep having players on loan? Are they at the top purely because the prem clubs loan out all of their talent? If so maybe thats why we dont get the big bucks for them why until Bogle not that many (I know Hughes and Hendrick came through) get in the first team?

Dowell is 22 in October, it was our under 18s that won the league and where our biggest prospects are.

even we tend to loan out most of our best under 23 players (Thomas, McAllister, Lowe) and you can play over age players, so under 23 league position doesn’t mean so much.

 

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5 hours ago, Jourdan said:

A bit underwhelmed by this.

If we are aiming for top 6 and beyond again, Dowell will be a good squad player - someone who can be a rotation option or make an impact coming off the bench.

If he has been earmarked as a key player, then it’s a little worrying because I don’t think he is the answer. He certainly would be a downgrade on the likes of Mount and Wilson.

From the little that I’ve seen, I don’t think he’s a bad player by any stretch of the imagination, but is his overall game any better than Holmes, for example?

I just wouldn’t be building the side with Dowell as a key player. We need solid foundations and to think long term.

I just don’t see where he fits in personally. If we play him in midfield, he’s potentially going to create more problems than he solves because he’s lightweight, not very tenacious and seemingly mercurial. And if we play him out wide, it’s at the expense of more explosive players like Jozefzoon, Bennett and Lawrence.

To be honest, the only player that we’ve been linked with so far that excites me is Cavaleiro.

But hey, there’s more to come. I am sure Cocu still has a few aces up his sleeve.

Like you’ve said, you’ve seen very little of him. So how can you comment???

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Posted (edited)

Opinion of a Sheff Utd fan (replying to an Everton fans message to me) on another forum.

couple of things that interested me, seems Everton don’t think the last 2 loans got the best out of him, and think Derby is the place that can.

And the sheff Utd fan rating him a lot higher than I expected given some of the comments I’ve read on here suggesting he didn’t do well there.

D7AFAF42-D88C-4796-9107-A0EFD36298FD.png

Edited by jimbo jones

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43 minutes ago, Woodley Ram said:

Happy if he is as good as said, but it did get me to wondering, is our academy that good if we keep having players on loan? Are they at the top purely because the prem clubs loan out all of their talent? If so maybe thats why we dont get the big bucks for them why until Bogle not that many (I know Hughes and Hendrick came through) get in the first team?

Mel said on Radio Derby that we use the loan system to protect our youngsters. Bloating the squad with big money signings on 4/5 year deals blocks their path to the first team. Arguably, that's what's been happening for years now.

Also, it takes time with academies, and you can't say because we don't get 3 or 4 top players a season, it's not producing. Bogle and Lowe have graduated out of the academy and could be good news in the next year or two. Not to mention Bird, Mitchell-Lawson, Sibley, Buchanan, MacDonald etc. who are also making waves and could have their breakthrough season the way Bogle did.

Of the 7 players named there, we will be lucky if one or two make the grade. But they're all around the same age. So if each generation produces a decent amount of prospects, we'll start seeing a few of those break through.

But we will see a lot more not make it, that's just how it is for all academies

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Also had a Sheff Utd friend tell me they think he’s a lot better than what he showed there. Apparently Duffy kept him out the side and he didn’t really get a good run in the side. 

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39 minutes ago, Tombo said:

Mel said on Radio Derby that we use the loan system to protect our youngsters. Bloating the squad with big money signings on 4/5 year deals blocks their path to the first team. Arguably, that's what's been happening for years now.

Also, it takes time with academies, and you can't say because we don't get 3 or 4 top players a season, it's not producing. Bogle and Lowe have graduated out of the academy and could be good news in the next year or two. Not to mention Bird, Mitchell-Lawson, Sibley, Buchanan, MacDonald etc. who are also making waves and could have their breakthrough season the way Bogle did.

Of the 7 players named there, we will be lucky if one or two make the grade. But they're all around the same age. So if each generation produces a decent amount of prospects, we'll start seeing a few of those break through.

But we will see a lot more not make it, that's just how it is for all academies

Also, Dowell is 21, not an u18 like our crop of youngsters who did so well. Dowell also type of player you could go and sign after the season if you wanted to.

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Smart signing. Good quality on the ball, we were desperately needing an attacking centre midfielder. If he can chip in 10 goals that'd be fantastic. Think some folk are forgetting Marriott will most like play more games this season and he'll easily score 20 goals plus this season. Don't think scoring goals will be an issue this season, sorting out midfield is the main priority. A wide man will be next on Cocu's shopping list :)

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10 hours ago, REDCAR said:

Is it just me..... he looks a completely different person in our pic to that pic wearing an England shirt.... did we sign the right lad?

People seem to choose publicity shots where you can't tell that he's mostly ginger

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The whole reason for bringing in Cocu was to allow us to develop talented players and help them achieve the next level. In Dowell, we have a player who has an enormous amount of ability but for whatever reason lacks other parts of his game. The key is that he’s got ability. He’s proven himself to be a match winner in this league. Cocu should be delighted to have such a player to develop and I’m sure that’s why we went so keen on him. 

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1 hour ago, CHCDerby said:

Like you’ve said, you’ve seen very little of him. So how can you comment???

Now if we were talking about Shinnie, then yes I would totally agree. But you’ll notice that I haven’t commented on Shinnie anywhere on the forum, because I don’t watch Scottish football at all.

But Dowell is a pretty well known player having played in the Championship for the last two seasons.

If we are saying you can’t comment unless you have seen X amount of games played by a certain player, we might as well as close all of these transfer threads in that case, because no-one will have a clue.

Everyone will have an opinion on a signing, good or bad, informed or otherwise, right or wrong.

Last season I thought Jozefzoon was going to be a revelation. In 2013, I thought Martin was a useless signing.

So what’s to say Dowell won’t come in and smash it with 15 goals and 15 assists?

Of course, I hope he comes in and does a great job for us. But it’s just my gut feeling that it’s not a signing that will bear much fruit.

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9 minutes ago, Ambitious said:

The whole reason for bringing in Cocu was to allow us to develop talented players and help them achieve the next level. In Dowell, we have a player who has an enormous amount of ability but for whatever reason lacks other parts of his game. The key is that he’s got ability. He’s proven himself to be a match winner in this league. Cocu should be delighted to have such a player to develop and I’m sure that’s why we went so keen on him. 

Are you implying that Cocu is Ambitious?

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8 hours ago, Jourdan said:

A bit underwhelmed by this.

If we are aiming for top 6 and beyond again, Dowell will be a good squad player - someone who can be a rotation option or make an impact coming off the bench.

If he has been earmarked as a key player, then it’s a little worrying because I don’t think he is the answer. He certainly would be a downgrade on the likes of Mount and Wilson.

From the little that I’ve seen, I don’t think he’s a bad player by any stretch of the imagination, but is his overall game any better than Holmes, for example?

I just wouldn’t be building the side with Dowell as a key player. We need solid foundations and to think long term.

I just don’t see where he fits in personally. If we play him in midfield, he’s potentially going to create more problems than he solves because he’s lightweight, not very tenacious and seemingly mercurial. And if we play him out wide, it’s at the expense of more explosive players like Jozefzoon, Bennett and Lawrence.

To be honest, the only player that we’ve been linked with so far that excites me is Cavaleiro.

But hey, there’s more to come. I am sure Cocu still has a few aces up his sleeve.

Not really sure where to start with this.

He's an England U21 international who's just had only his second loan spell at a club for half a season. That club was promoted and their fans wanted him back. But you think we should be signing better players if we are aiming for the top 6? 

Mount and Wilson are far too good for this division, Mount definitely is. So we're never gonna replace them with better, higher quality players. But this lad can play. 8 goals in 38 apps for Forest is a good return. Only struggled there when they changed their manager half way through the season.

"I don't see where he fits in" We barely have a midfield at the minute. Surely he'd just gonna fit in where Mount was?  Don't see how signing a midfieder affects Jozefzoon, Bennett or Lawrence. 

Why does he need to be better than Holmes? Can't they play together? Plus I'd imagine he probably is technically better than Holmes anyway.

You're underwhelmed by a player you've "seen little of"? Give him a chance in a Derby shirt.

And referring to Lawrence, Jozefzoon and Bennett as "explosive"? Jesus.

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