Ghost of Clough Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 Wassall took our (soon to be) first team manager with him to the awards ceremony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfie20 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said: Wassall took our (soon to be) first team manager with him to the awards ceremony Don't know much about him but probably a better choice than Wassall or Big Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramslayer Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 Domenico Tedesco would love to see this bloke in the hot seat next Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnero Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 31 minutes ago, Wolfie20 said: Don't know much about him but probably a better choice than Wassall or Big Dave He was very good alongside Frank Skinner a few years back. Do we really want another Chelsea rent boy though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 Has anyone mentioned Dennis Bergamp? Bergamp's philosophy is that young players need to be given freedom to evolve rather than being lobotomised by over coaching. Unfortunately this is what is happwning to will hughes at watford. Watch his performance in the cup final? Will is such a good lad he will do exactly what he is told to do. Gone was the impish, creative genius. Instead there was a player who everytime watford lost the ball, he immediately ran backwards to take up a position in central defence. If there was ever a lesson to be learnt from recent events at this club, it is surely to move away from the over coached, mechanical performance of a rowett or a van gaal, or a watford will hughes, towards encouraging young players to go out to play and fulfill their potential. Thats what frank began. We need to continue to follow that philosophy and try to play without fear. unfortunately in the play off final frank didn't quite have the courage of his own convictions. Get bergkamp and we might pick up players like danny crowley and see them blossom into our own equivalents of mason mount and harry wilson. We need a strong philosophy, not a bog standard journeyman plucked from amongst the championship flotsom and jetsom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Mick L White Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 But Denis can’t fly - might be an issue when we get into Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 P.s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilkleyram Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 45 minutes ago, RamNut said: Has anyone mentioned Dennis Bergamp? Bergamp's philosophy is that young players need to be given freedom to evolve rather than being lobotomised by over coaching. Unfortunately this is what is happwning to will hughes at watford. Watch his performance in the cup final? Will is such a good lad he will do exactly what he is told to do. Gone was the impish, creative genius. Instead there was a player who everytime watford lost the ball, he immediately ran backwards to take up a position in central defence. If there was ever a lesson to be learnt from recent events at this club, it is surely to move away from the over coached, mechanical performance of a rowett or a van gaal, or a watford will hughes, towards encouraging young players to go out to play and fulfill their potential. Thats what frank began. We need to continue to follow that philosophy and try to play without fear. unfortunately in the play off final frank didn't quite have the courage of his own convictions. Get bergkamp and we might pick up players like danny crowley and see them blossom into our own equivalents of mason mount and harry wilson. We need a strong philosophy, not a bog standard journeyman plucked from amongst the championship flotsom and jetsom. Is the bit about Will Hughes your opinion Ramnut or a quote from Bergkamp himself? Either way I agree entirely. I've only watched bits of our William's performances last season though all of the Cup Final and although there have been glimpses of what he can do largely his performances have been underwhelming, mostly because, it seems to me, of what he has been asked to do. At times he's looked lost and I never thought I would write that about him of all players. He's becoming ordinary. It's interesting that his name now is never/very rarely linked with England squads even though he's playing regularly in the EPL. I know football is littered with players that get U21 caps and then no more but I've always thought that he was better than that. Perhaps he needs to move to Everton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsnip Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 50 minutes ago, RamNut said: , towards encouraging young players to go out to play and fulfill their potential. Thats what frank began. Thats when Derby were at their best last season. With that attacking gung ho element. If if we'd have just carried that through to the final, with our £50m worth of loans last games - we'd be in the prem now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 8 hours ago, Mr. Mick L White said: But Denis can’t fly - might be an issue when we get into Europe. Wouldn’t be attending the pre season in the USA either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BramcoteRam84 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 18 hours ago, doheochai said: Just posting my tuppence worth - Chris Hughton is a very under-rated manager (just as he was a player). He was coveted as a first team coach when at Spurs and after he was let go when Spurs decided on a clear-out when they sacked Jol. He did a terrific job at Newcastle first as coach and then as manager taking them from the Championship to the PL and then got sacked when they were in the top 10 because Ashley wanted a 'world-class' manager - hiring Alan Pardew. It is rumoured that Hughton had more than a dozen job offers as assistant manager in the PL after he was sacked by Newcastle. Instead he took his time and became Birmingham manager - with no money and in the Championship - he got the team to the group stages of the Europa League and 4th in the Championship. He was then appointed manager of Norwich and in his first season they finished 11th in the PL. The following season Norwich struggled. In April the Norwich board panicked after a defeat to WBA and sacked Hughton when Norwich were five points above relegation with five games to play. Norwich got 1 point from the last five games and were relegated. Hughton was adamant that he would have kept Norwich up, He took over at Brighton in December 2015 when they were 22nd in the Championship. The following season he led them to 3rd and then a year later to 2nd and automatic promotion. Brighton finished 15th in the PL and then 17th last season as well as an FA cup semi-final (Brighton were in a worse situation than Norwich last season and Hughton got them out of it). In five seasons in the PL Hughton has not been relegated as manager - in five (full or part) seasons in the Championship he has saved a club from relegation and finished 1st (with 102 points), 4th, 3rd and 2nd, winning two automatic promotions. The step up from Championship to PL is massive - it takes years for a promoted club to build a squad capable of sustaining PL status - Bournemouth, Burnley and Watford have taken years (with a few hiccups and relegations along the way). These days a promoted club needs to spend up to £100million a year on transfers just to stand still and hope to consolidate. Like all promoted teams - Brighton struggled for want of a striker - you cannot rely on a 35 year old to score enough goals. But Brighton did not buy well last off-season and Hughton did not have control over player transfers - the Brighton brain-trust using Bloom's gambling metrics invested in players they thought could develop and sell-on for big money. Hughton did what he had to do to prevent relegation - and he succeeded. The average lifespan for a PL manager since 1992 is 91 games (and this figure is grossly distorted by Ferguson, Wenger and Redknapp). Hughton has managed for 164 PL games. More than 60% of all PL managers only ever manage one club in the PL - Hughton has managed 3 clubs in the PL. There is an utter misconception that Hughton is a defensively minded coach who parks the bus - this is false - a look at his teams at Newcastle and his teams in the Championship who have all played attacking free-flowing football. Hughton was able to do this in the PL with Newcastle because he had the players at his disposal. But, as I said, the step-up from the Championship is massive - and getting bigger every season. Hughton's job was to get Brighton promoted and to keep them there - he succeeded in doing so for two full seasons. Often owners and fans develop unrealistic expectations about their club when they get promoted - not realising that it is a massive job just to stand still and avoid relegation. This has happened at Brighton - the assumption that you can make incremental progress in the second season in the PL (when it is actually a very dangerous season for promoted clubs) and thereafter - and that you can play expansive attacking football. To survive you need speed and you need at least one goalscorer who can net 15+ goals and a second one that can get 10. I think Brighton made a massive blunder in sacking Hughton. Potter might work out for them - but in my view he has an inflated reputation (particularly from his time in Sweden). If Potter attempts to play the football he played at Swansea then Brighton will get destroyed in the PL next season - then it comes down to whether Potter knows how to grind out results. Hughton is probably the top available option for Derby and Derby should gab him if they get the chance - the real question is whether he would want the job. He's 60 now and spent 4 1/2 years getting Brighton to the PL and keeping them there. Would he want to go through that process again only for an owner to get an inflated view of where the club is at and sack him. It is likely that 2-3 manager will be sacked during the next PL season and all of the clubs will probably give Hughton a call knowing that he can grind out results and keep teams from being relegated. He would then get another shot at a full season in the PL with PL standard players in the squad and money to buy players. Got to be Hughton after reading that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 7 hours ago, ilkleyram said: Is the bit about Will Hughes your opinion Ramnut or a quote from Bergkamp himself? Either way I agree entirely. I've only watched bits of our William's performances last season though all of the Cup Final and although there have been glimpses of what he can do largely his performances have been underwhelming, mostly because, it seems to me, of what he has been asked to do. At times he's looked lost and I never thought I would write that about him of all players. He's becoming ordinary. It's interesting that his name now is never/very rarely linked with England squads even though he's playing regularly in the EPL. I know football is littered with players that get U21 caps and then no more but I've always thought that he was better than that. Perhaps he needs to move to Everton. It was my observation. I felt sorry for him. We'd heard stories about how he was developing under expert coacing, but i beg to differ. That is what over coaching and the tactics of fear can do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BramcoteRam84 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 If not Hughton or the names mentioned, I’m warming to the idea of a foreign manager. Bruno Labbadia has been mentioned by some since the baggies link, he seems to have had an excellent career and could be a good choice!! And we might......just might........get a German Centre Back!!!! But proceed with caution going foreign, they must know the league and pedigree is irrelevant. Felix Magath at Fulham anyone?! Montanier also had good record - didn’t work out well and the gumps as he nearly made our dreams come true in taking them down! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 18 minutes ago, BramcoteRam84 said: Got to be Hughton after reading that! You want to watch your team trying to "grind out results"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 8 hours ago, ilkleyram said: Is the bit about Will Hughes your opinion Ramnut or a quote from Bergkamp himself? Either way I agree entirely. I've only watched bits of our William's performances last season though all of the Cup Final and although there have been glimpses of what he can do largely his performances have been underwhelming, mostly because, it seems to me, of what he has been asked to do. At times he's looked lost and I never thought I would write that about him of all players. He's becoming ordinary. It's interesting that his name now is never/very rarely linked with England squads even though he's playing regularly in the EPL. I know football is littered with players that get U21 caps and then no more but I've always thought that he was better than that. Perhaps he needs to move to Everton. Watford play him wide in midfield so his full ability is not seen but it also hides some of his weaknesses such as heading and body strength- but at least he starts regularly- and I hope that it’s not because he is classed as English Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PastRAMi Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 48 minutes ago, RamNut said: It was my observation. I felt sorry for him. We'd heard stories about how he was developing under expert coacing, but i beg to differ. That is what over coaching and the tactics of fear can do. Interestingly I thought he had his best season last year. Played regularly and was mentioned in the national press for his good performances. I reckon this could be a big season for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampant Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 I've read Chelsea fans suggesting that the reason for the delay in announcing Lampard as manager (or not) is due to their club awaiting news on their appeal. The result of which would determine the type of offer made to Lampard (or someone else). If he goes - and I think he will fwiw - then I'd be more excited by a Van Bronkhurst, Arteta or a Bergkamp than I would a Hughton or a Monk. In the middle ground I'd put Wassall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 https://www.90min.com/posts/5067873-tottenham-target-reveals-what-he-learned-from-ajax-arsenal-legend-dennis-bergkamp https://www.reuters.com/article/soccer-england-ars-tot-eriksen/soccer-eriksen-hails-bergkamp-influence-in-formative-years-idINKBN1DF0WE https://www.newstalk.com/off-the-ball/david-winner-on-bergkamp-cruyff-and-the-ajax-revolution-709263 http://www.football-oranje.com/dolberg-dennis-bergkamp-taught-lot/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 Good thread this on twitter, think it lays bare how snobbish we have become and how high expectations are now. Wassall would be a decent appointment. Like the cut of this guys jib. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 1 hour ago, RamNut said: https://www.90min.com/posts/5067873-tottenham-target-reveals-what-he-learned-from-ajax-arsenal-legend-dennis-bergkamp https://www.reuters.com/article/soccer-england-ars-tot-eriksen/soccer-eriksen-hails-bergkamp-influence-in-formative-years-idINKBN1DF0WE https://www.newstalk.com/off-the-ball/david-winner-on-bergkamp-cruyff-and-the-ajax-revolution-709263 http://www.football-oranje.com/dolberg-dennis-bergkamp-taught-lot/ Curtains is that you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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