The Politics Thread 2019

[Uptherams]

2 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said:

OK so an IPO is an initial public offering of shares in a company. It is not 'benchmark of a company that is for sale'. The NHS is not a company, nor is anyone suggesting that the Tories intend to float it on the stock market.

As such, there is no scope nor need for any form of underwriting so I have absolutely no idea why you keep banging on about it. It's as if you're having a debate with yourself, which, come to think of it, might well be preferable.

So the NHS is not for sale. Good. Please don't be as naive to also conflate PFI's with up for sale either. 

[Comrade 86]

1 hour ago, G STAR RAM said:

I wasnt suggesting it was simple, I simply didnt know the mechanics for selling drugs to the NHS hence why I asked the question.

Even with the explanation given above, I dont quite understand how that prevents private American companies from selling at higher prices to the UK market but accept that you obviously know more about that than me!

Can't think of a different way to explain it to my last 2 or 3 efforts so I'll have some dinner and rest my overheating brain instead. 

[Comrade 86]

7 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

So the NHS is not for sale. Good. Please don't be as naive to also conflate PFI's with up for sale either. 

The NHS is not going to be floated on the stock market is what I've actually stated but do feel free to just make up some more inane shizzle if it floats your boat. You've been doing all day already so why stop now?

[maxjam]

Interesting article here;

https://www.politico.eu/article/luxembourg-leads-charge-against-eu-tax-dodging-bill/

Luxembourg on Thursday successfully spearheaded an effort to block a draft bill that would force multinational companies to publish where they pay taxes and make profits.

The new reporting rules were proposed three years ago to crack down on tax dodging after the Panama Papers scandal broke.

Tax-dodging companies deprive national coffers of between €50 billion and €70 billion a year, the European Commission said when laying out the so-called public country-by-country reporting directive (CBCR), which would target companies with global revenues exceeding €750 million a year.

Why would you vote to block this?  Who creates the laws that benefit international business and who benefits from these laws apart from big business?  Its seems to me like the only people being hurt by this are the plebs such as  you and I.

Not really having a Brexit argument as regardless of where the power is held, it corrupts.  I was kinda hoping that apart from leaving the EU the fallout over Brexit would lead to a revamped fairer political system but it seems that over the past 3 years they have done enough to whip people up in their respective camps to hate those on the other side of the argument which has led both main parties straying further from the middle.  Whoever wins the upcoming election will believe the system works and plough on regardless. 

There really should be a groundswell of support for reform imo not endorsing a system that produces equally bad parties with equally bad leaders and equally bad policies. 

Rant Over!  Not voting next week, don't care who wins ?

[Tamworthram]

2 hours ago, SchtivePesley said:

?

 

Just goes to show how published selective data can create a potentially false impression.

 

Mean age of members: Conservatives 57 years old. Labour 53 years old.

percentage of members in social classes ABC1: Conservatives 83% Labour 77%.

Not that party membership is necessarily a fair reflection of party support. In 2019, the total membership of the Conservatives, Labour and the Liberal Democrats combined amounted to only 1.7% of the electorate.

                     

[G STAR RAM]

So now Donald Trump has confirmed that the NHS is not up for sale in any trade deal, I assume there are going to be quite a few angry people calling out Jeremy Corbyns lies?

[Uptherams]

23 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said:

The NHS is not going to be floated on the stock market is what I've actually stated 

Got it. The NHS is not up for sale. 

[Stive Pesley]

7 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

Just goes to show how published selective data can create a potentially false impression.

Mean age of members: Conservatives 57 years old. Labour 53 years old.

percentage of members in social classes ABC1: Conservatives 83% Labour 77%.

Not that party membership is necessarily a fair reflection of party support. In 2019, the total membership of the Conservatives, Labour and the Liberal Democrats combined amounted to only 1.7% of the electorate.                     

Well - given that I was posting the graphs in jest at the poster here who tried to claim that the Tories support was diverse - that was all. I mean - as diverse as a bunch of white middle-aged blokes can be I suppose

But he was also saying that  Labour are apparently too diverse and full of warring identarians. You pointing out that actually their membership is similarly un-diverse makes him look even more foolish. Not that it will stop him

[GboroRam]

2 hours ago, Uptherams said:

They don't have any...

Hurrah! Long may it continue! 

[Uptherams]

3 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

Well - given that I was posting the graphs in jest at the poster here who tried to claim that the Tories support was diverse - that was all. I mean - as diverse as a bunch of white middle-aged blokes can be I suppose

But he was also saying that  Labour are apparently too diverse and full of warring identarians. You pointing out that actually their membership is similarly un-diverse makes him look even more foolish. Not that it will stop him

It's like you can't read. Go back and read it all again. For starters I was talking about voters not members. 

Honestly. 

[Uptherams]

3 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

Hurrah! Long may it continue! 

I agree. Because that means Brexit is being delivered ?

[GboroRam]

9 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

I agree. Because that means Brexit is being delivered ?

Or, the Brexit party is a busted flush. 

[Comrade 86]

13 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

Got it. The NHS is not up for sale. 

I'm delighted that you have finally grasped that the NHS will not be floated. Of course there's the small matter that nobody save yourself said it would be, but let's not concern ourselves with such trifles, eh!

Also delighted that you've finally grasped the difference between a sale and an initial public offering. It's taken quite some time for you to grasp the fundamentals but you've got there in the end and I think that's really quite commendable.

If there's anything else I can help you with, do feel free to ask, but failing that, have a wonderful evening.

[AdamRam]

2 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Not sure if they said the easiest thing in UK history but yes they said the trade deal would be easy. And it should have been.

We already trade within the EU so already have default terms, it is not like we are setting up a trade deal from scratch.

What evidence do you have that setting up a trade deal with the EU is not going to be easy?

As far as I am aware talks have not even taken place until the Withdrawal Agreement is agreed.

Note: Happy to be corrected if the above is incorrect, that is just my understanding. 

Re the second paragraph:-

Could I please have some examples of these 'promises'?

Ie; who has promised it, when the promise was made and how the promise has been broken?

Couple  of examples below, for me it’s a very naive view to believe that we don’t know more from both sides of the argument compared to when the vote was held. The government hasn’t been able to negotiate the deal it wanted and has had to comprise on this. I’m not saying that the vote shouldn’t stand or agree with anything but leaving, as that was the result by the majority of the country.

If you think that the statements that were made in the run up to vote would still be applicable now then that’s fair enough and Im  not inclined to disagree because all you will get in return is where the quotes etc...etc.

Michael Grove “the day we choose to leave, we hold all the cards and choose the path we want”

“we would be able to immediately start to negotiate trade deals” yet the EU have said nope you have to sort out the deal first.

 

 

[Rev]

4 hours ago, Uptherams said:

Labour's position is completely ridiculous though. It's not even clear what kind of deal they would put in front of the EU. They can't enact most of their big spending plans and reforms while we are part of the EU. It's utterly farcical. People who are about to vote for Labour need to ask themselves this question. Do I want to remain in the EU or do I want us to go ahead with re-nationalisation. If the answer is re-nationalisation, then they need to play the long game and accept that is only something they can actually vote for at a future general election. 

What specific parts of the Labour manifesto can they not action while remaining in the EU?

[Comrade 86]

50 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

So now Donald Trump has confirmed that the NHS is not up for sale in any trade deal, I assume there are going to be quite a few angry people calling out Jeremy Corbyns lies?

Yes I'm sure Donny's latest ramblings will have put everyone's minds at rest.

Incidentally, hasn't he also stated today that he doesn't know Prince Andrew? 

[Uptherams]

32 minutes ago, reverendo de duivel said:

What specific parts of the Labour manifesto can they not action while remaining in the EU?

https://www.ft.com/content/c00d8684-788c-11e9-bbad-7c18c0ea0201

[Uptherams]

41 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said:

I'm delighted that you have finally grasped that the NHS will not be floated. Of course there's the small matter that nobody save yourself said it would be, but let's not concern ourselves with such trifles, eh!

Also delighted that you've finally grasped the difference between a sale and an initial public offering. It's taken quite some time for you to grasp the fundamentals but you've got there in the end and I think that's really quite commendable.

If there's anything else I can help you with, do feel free to ask, but failing that, have a wonderful evening.

Yeah funny one aren't you. Yet anyone with an ounce of sense recognises your tone is due to the fact that you had to research what an IPO stood for and is and what the role of an underwriter would be. 

So the NHS is not for sale. 

 

 

[Comrade 86]

2 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

Yeah funny one aren't you. Yet anyone with an ounce of sense recognises your tone is due to the fact that you had to research what an IPO stood for and is and what the role of an underwriter would be. 

So the NHS is not for sale. 

No old bean. Quite familiar with the term. Have been paid out bonuses twice on tech companies at point of IPO.

Anyone with an ounce of sense is bored to death of you posting the same rubbish again and again too. Give it a rest.

 

[G STAR RAM]

25 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said:

Yes I'm sure Donny's latest ramblings will have put everyone's minds at rest.

Incidentally, hasn't he also stated today that he doesn't know Prince Andrew? 

Do you know everyone that you have stood next to in you line of work?

I've worked with literally hundreds of people through the years that I do not know.