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The Politics Thread 2019


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2 hours ago, Van Wolfie said:

Happy Love You GIF by Daddy's Home

 

My prediction -

We tumble out of the UK on 31st October because one of our Westminster geniuses forgot (or 'forgot') to fill a form in ...

Benn Act quietly killed in court, and after the departure, it's seen as irrelevant anyway

There is a lot of initial chaos - we run out of tomatoes - but the sky does not fall in

Boris softens his approach between 1/11 and 1/1/20 … the pound rallies

The Duchess of Sussex announces she is pregnant again …. aaaaah

Spring GE … The sky has not fallen in … Boris seen as the man who did the impossible ….. 

Massive Tory win … Boris in for at least the next 10 yrs 

Labour self destructs when Jezza won't quit

Strangely, down the line, the lives of people in Stoke are still ****.

(But maybe that's just living in Stoke)?️????

 

 

 

 

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33 minutes ago, WhiteHorseRam said:

My prediction -

We tumble out of the UK on 31st October because one of our Westminster geniuses forgot (or 'forgot') to fill a form in ...

Benn Act quietly killed in court, and after the departure, it's seen as irrelevant anyway

There is a lot of initial chaos - we run out of tomatoes - but the sky does not fall in

Boris softens his approach between 1/11 and 1/1/20 … the pound rallies

The Duchess of Sussex announces she is pregnant again …. aaaaah

Spring GE … The sky has not fallen in … Boris seen as the man who did the impossible ….. 

Massive Tory win … Boris in for at least the next 10 yrs 

Labour self destructs when Jezza won't quit

Strangely, down the line, the lives of people in Stoke are still ****.

(But maybe that's just living in Stoke)?️????

 

 

 

 

That one's a cert. The UK will start to fragment within 5 years as moves for a united Ireland and an independent Scotland accelerate - even Wales will walk away from Borisland, leaving the English Nationalists turning stones over, looking for somebody else to blame.

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58 minutes ago, WhiteHorseRam said:

My prediction -

We tumble out of the UK on 31st October because one of our Westminster geniuses forgot (or 'forgot') to fill a form in ...

Benn Act quietly killed in court, and after the departure, it's seen as irrelevant anyway

There is a lot of initial chaos - we run out of tomatoes - but the sky does not fall in

Boris softens his approach between 1/11 and 1/1/20 … the pound rallies

The Duchess of Sussex announces she is pregnant again …. aaaaah

Spring GE … The sky has not fallen in … Boris seen as the man who did the impossible ….. 

Massive Tory win … Boris in for at least the next 10 yrs 

Labour self destructs when Jezza won't quit

Strangely, down the line, the lives of people in Stoke are still ****.

(But maybe that's just living in Stoke)?️????

 

 

 

 

Sorry .. I meant EU ,,,there's that faulty form filling in 

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1 hour ago, ariotofmyown said:

Ah good point, I've always liked reading you more balanced opinions on this.

As the only 'voice of the silent majority' on here would you vote remain if you could go back in time knowing what you do now?

If there was another referendum and these options were available, would you now choose

No Deal

May style deal

Very soft Brexit

Remain

Be careful what you choose, you are representing around half* of the original Leaver voters!

*made up stat

OK, no pressure....understood.??

As a moderate Leave voter, this is what I reckon:

No Deal - Economic shock just too damaging short/medium term. Even if we knew for sure that the perceived longer term benefits would be realised.

May style deal - My preferred option - IF the NI border thing can be agreed.

Very soft Brexit - We'd be better off just Remaining as we'd lose any influence over EU policy or direction

Remain - Yes, if a May type deal can't be agreed.

 

 

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3 hours ago, McRamFan said:

Promised in March 2018, yet to be delivered.  PM's and Health Sec's have changed.

Here are the facts

https://fullfact.org/health/nhs-pay-deal-staff-missing-out/

https://www.fgsolicitors.co.uk/news/sports-direct-the-use-of-zero-hours-contracts-a-business-model-with-exploitation-at-its-heart/

But hey, it's only a solicitor, must be made up.  Zero hours contracts are great, if used correctly.  Unfortunately some companies like to exploit them.

So your whole argument is based on zero hours contracts and that means that workers rights are worse now than back then. Zero hour contracts do suit some people. Like I said things are not perfect but certainly better than they were before.. 

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5 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

@uttoxram75 have to say my vision for the future is based upon hope rather than indicators from past performance!

I just feel as though the last years politics have woken a sleeping giant (the public).

For years politicians have trampled all over us without a thing being said. I think that with what has been happening politicians all of a sudden are going to be a lot more accountable to the electorate and that can only be a good thing for us.

That works for both sides of the political divide.. Not sure what Labour will bring to the table that will be the deliver all you want. It’s easy to oppose, say what you want without not really having to deliver anything.. Where has this perfect Labour Party, been in the past? Until they come to the middle, they are unelectable.. They will then have to try and deliver (and pay for) some of those ridiculous statements at their conference.. 

I agree the public are awake. The next GE will see a cull of the blockers in this process. Liars, 99% of them..

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9 minutes ago, JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta said:

I truly hope we are on the verge of something different. An end to the Conservative/Labour two party dominance would be great. Something new is needed to shake Parliament up.

We need to get rid of first-past-the-post. With more fragmentation in politcs nowadays, it's not right that a partly could get a stonking great majority in parliament with about 35% of the votes cast.

I realise that means coalitions but I don't see that as a bad thing. It seems to work OK for most countries.

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one thing that still puzzles me about the ardent hard brexiteers - not the disaster capitalists who will be laughing either way, but that vox pop man in the street who claims (in the face of all evidence that it will be pretty disastrous for quite some time) that  we just "get on with it" and "get Brexit done". Typically invoking the "blitz spirit"  and that no matter how hard it gets - "we're British dammit and we'll get through it" etc

Yet you never see them extend that same optimism to a Corbyn-led government which would arguably be just as transformative and certainly no more risky than a hard brexit.

Go figure

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2 minutes ago, Van Wolfie said:

I realise that means coalitions but I don't see that as a bad thing. It seems to work OK for most countries.

Seems to be going OK in Portugal having an anti-austerity socialist PM leading a coalition. Dare to dream kids. We could actually turn this around

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3 hours ago, WhiteHorseRam said:

My prediction -

We tumble out of the UK on 31st October because one of our Westminster geniuses forgot (or 'forgot') to fill a form in ...

Benn Act quietly killed in court, and after the departure, it's seen as irrelevant anyway

There is a lot of initial chaos - we run out of tomatoes - but the sky does not fall in

Boris softens his approach between 1/11 and 1/1/20 … the pound rallies

The Duchess of Sussex announces she is pregnant again …. aaaaah

Spring GE … The sky has not fallen in … Boris seen as the man who did the impossible ….. 

Massive Tory win … Boris in for at least the next 10 yrs 

Labour self destructs when Jezza won't quit

Strangely, down the line, the lives of people in Stoke are still ****.

(But maybe that's just living in Stoke)?️????

 

 

 

 

Reading in between the lines and with his alleged track record you wouldn't bet against him 

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12 minutes ago, Van Wolfie said:

We need to get rid of first-past-the-post. With more fragmentation in politcs nowadays, it's not right that a partly could get a stonking great majority in parliament with about 35% of the votes cast.

I realise that means coalitions but I don't see that as a bad thing. It seems to work OK for most countries.

FPTP is awful. Due to where I live my vote is pretty much irrelevant.

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10 minutes ago, Van Wolfie said:

We need to get rid of first-past-the-post. With more fragmentation in politcs nowadays, it's not right that a partly could get a stonking great majority in parliament with about 35% of the votes cast.

I realise that means coalitions but I don't see that as a bad thing. It seems to work OK for most countries.

Coalitions just mean nothing gets done, unless the parties involved are basically shades of centrist. Here all parties apart from the Liberals (no idea what they are) are fairly extreme in their beliefs. So you just spend time arguing. Look at the Remainers in government, can't agree the time of day.

Any business man will tell you the more parties involved in a decision the less likely it will happen quickly and be the right one.

52% voted leave, 426 constituencies voted leave, yet we're still mucking about, because too many politicians think they know best.

Benign Dictatorship (ie agrees with MY views) sounds great to me.

I see Italy is reducing its Parliament by about a third. Sounds a brilliant idea. when the EU calls the shots whats the point of hundreds of politicians drawing pay and expenses.

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30 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

one thing that still puzzles me about the ardent hard brexiteers - not the disaster capitalists who will be laughing either way, but that vox pop man in the street who claims (in the face of all evidence that it will be pretty disastrous for quite some time) that  we just "get on with it" and "get Brexit done". Typically invoking the "blitz spirit"  and that no matter how hard it gets - "we're British dammit and we'll get through it" etc

Yet you never see them extend that same optimism to a Corbyn-led government which would arguably be just as transformative and certainly no more risky than a hard brexit.

Go figure

Corbyn and his cabinet have suggested that they'll force landlords to sell their properties to renters at cut price rates. Likely resulting in a property crash as landlords desperately hoof out tenants and sell their properties before having them nicked by the state. 

Disregard any immigration controls whatsoever, and give anyone who happens to find their way to the UK an equal vote to someone born here and who have paid into the system their entire lives. 

Abolish private education to 'redistribute their funds', forcing hundreds of thousands of private school kids into an already overcrowded public education system. 

I'm not even going to start on his shambolic attitude towards the security services and armed forces. 

He would bankrupt the country both financially and morally within only a few years. He's far more dangerous than leaving the EU on WTO terms. 

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31 minutes ago, Van Wolfie said:

We need to get rid of first-past-the-post. With more fragmentation in politcs nowadays, it's not right that a partly could get a stonking great majority in parliament with about 35% of the votes cast.

I realise that means coalitions but I don't see that as a bad thing. It seems to work OK for most countries.

The argument against this system has been that it produces "weak" governments and it gives undue weight to nutters and the lunatic fringe.

 

So now lets test that against the political system our first past the post system has produced..............ok............hmmmm..............?

 

May as well give it a go then! But don't forget we were given a referendum on this a few years ago and the idea got thrown out. Presumably because it didn't have Farage behind it.......... 

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23 minutes ago, Red_Dawn said:

Corbyn and his cabinet have suggested that they'll force landlords to sell their properties to renters at cut price rates. Likely resulting in a property crash as landlords desperately hoof out tenants and sell their properties before having them nicked by the state. 

Disregard any immigration controls whatsoever, and give anyone who happens to find their way to the UK an equal vote to someone born here and who have paid into the system their entire lives. 

Abolish private education to 'redistribute their funds', forcing hundreds of thousands of private school kids into an already overcrowded public education system. 

I'm not even going to start on his shambolic attitude towards the security services and armed forces. 

He would bankrupt the country both financially and morally within only a few years. He's far more dangerous than leaving the EU on WTO terms. 

Project Fear!

 

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30 minutes ago, Red_Dawn said:

Corbyn and his cabinet have suggested that they'll force landlords to sell their properties to renters at cut price rates. Likely resulting in a property crash as landlords desperately hoof out tenants and sell their properties before having them nicked by the state. 

Disregard any immigration controls whatsoever, and give anyone who happens to find their way to the UK an equal vote to someone born here and who have paid into the system their entire lives. 

Abolish private education to 'redistribute their funds', forcing hundreds of thousands of private school kids into an already overcrowded public education system. 

I'm not even going to start on his shambolic attitude towards the security services and armed forces. 

He would bankrupt the country both financially and morally within only a few years. He's far more dangerous than leaving the EU on WTO terms. 

When the Tories forced councils to sell their houses, was that a bad thing too?

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33 minutes ago, FindernRam said:

Coalitions just mean nothing gets done

I would say the Con-Lib coalition 2010-15 was pretty successful - especially given that it was a right wing & centre-left coalition. Austerity would have been deeper if the Lib Dems hadn't moderated the Tories IMO.

Of course the LD's then got wiped out at the next election but I think that was down to LD voters not understanding that coalition is all about compromise and because they had a minor stake in the government, they had an unequal say in what happened.

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