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The Politics Thread 2019

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2 hours ago, WhiteHorseRam said:

I said that it would be done on the understanding that this was the last call, and as both sides reckon they will win - time to put their money where there mouth is.

In truth BREXIT is the miserable gift that will just keep giving ….

If Remain had won the first Ref would the Leave folks just shut up and gone away? - No. 

The Remainers obviously haven't accepted the result since 2016 and actually seem to be getting stronger.

There are no winners here.

But a GE now would be a bastardized second Ref  - so I say let's just have a 2nd Ref. Winners takes all. 

 

We've already had a vote -Leave won  .   Perhaps if we get to Wembley and win on penalty's we should replay if Roos steps of his line when the other team misses.  That would go down well.   perhaps if we had had another referendum, only those who voted in the first one should be allowed to vote .  Thousands who have turned voting age won't be allowed to poll but who cares about a democratic vote anyway .  We can also include all those who originally voted who aren't here anymore .   Perhaps we can get dogs to vote - one bark for stay , two for leave .  This whole thing is laughable .

 

 

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49 minutes ago, cstand said:

Let's go no deal as per referendum result and uphold our democracy then go for a pint. 

I fear you will die of thirst first.

 

(Just out of interest, it was never a no deal referendum) Perhaps the choices should have been, vote should to remain, go with a deal and go with out. We probably wouldn't be in this mess now

Edited by BathRam72

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12 minutes ago, Gee SCREAMER !! said:

We've already had a vote -Leave won  .   Perhaps if we get to Wembley and win on penalty's we should replay if Roos steps of his line when the other team misses.  That would go down well.   perhaps if we had had another referendum, only those who voted in the first one should be allowed to vote .  Thousands who have turned voting age won't be allowed to poll but who cares about a democratic vote anyway .  We can also include all those who originally voted who aren't here anymore .   Perhaps we can get dogs to vote - one bark for stay , two for leave .  This whole thing is laughable .

 

 

Yeh and while we're at it, let's not bother with any more GEs. Tories won the last one so what's the point? 

Also to add: The Play-off final analogy doesn't really work. First: Nobody is voting on anything. Second: There's a play-off final every year, so there's always the chance "to set the matter right" next year. Apples and oranges and all that. 

Edited by Ramshankered

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1 minute ago, Ramshankered said:

Yeh and while we're at it, let's not bother with any more GEs. Tories won the last one so what's the point? 

That makes sense.  To my knowledge if Conservatives get into power the term is served as per the democratic process.  Likewise Labour .  Don't believe we have left the E.U yet.

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6 minutes ago, Ramshankered said:

eh and while we're at it, let's not bother with any more GEs. Tories won the last one so what's the point? 

Well with a GE, we actually get the result put into place. With Brexit, we're still yet to leave. So how can we have another yet?

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6 minutes ago, Ramshankered said:

Yeh and while we're at it, let's not bother with any more GEs. Tories won the last one so what's the point? 

Also to add: The Play-off final analogy doesn't really work. First: Nobody is voting on anything. Second: There's a play-off final every year, so there's always the chance "to set the matter right" next year. Apples and oranges and all that. 

It does work, perfectly well.  But cheers for adding the additional point . 

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6 hours ago, Van Wolfie said:

Ah yes, the good old days of 30% inflation, Humiliating IMF bailout, massive industrial decline, strikes, power cuts & brown Austin Allegros.

Plus the three day week, petrol rationing, devaluation of the pound and a shocking paint job on my Cortina 1600E

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10 minutes ago, Gee SCREAMER !! said:

That makes sense.  To my knowledge if Conservatives get into power the term is served as per the democratic process.  Likewise Labour .  Don't believe we have left the E.U yet.

Conservatives go into power when they win (and vice versa for Labour) because there's an established process for the parties to follow when they win.

There is no process for exiting the EU. There are also several different ways to "leave" which a) wasn't clear in the original referendum and b) no one seems able to agree on. Hence the current deadlock. Obviously, just my opinion, but a People's Vote with clear boundaries would be the best way to resolve the crisis. 

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3 hours ago, WhiteHorseRam said:

What I'm saying is a GE is the wrong route to take. We are stuck, and need to revisit the question.

If you broke your arm - you want it put in a cast (Ref 2) - drinking a smoothie and having a foot rub won't help (GE).

17.4 million people will count again.

How can more democracy be a bad thing? And its back to the people - no MPs involved.

No, it's absolutely the right route. Just because the outcome isn't something you don't like. 

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9 minutes ago, Ramshankered said:

Conservatives go into power when they win (and vice versa for Labour) because there's an established process for the parties to follow when they win.

There is no process for exiting the EU. There are also several different ways to "leave" which a) wasn't clear in the original referendum and b) no one seems able to agree on. Hence the current deadlock. Obviously, just my opinion, but a People's Vote with clear boundaries would be the best way to resolve the crisis. 

No such thing as clear boundaries. Something new will always come up. Look at this thread .   I guarantee the E.U will tell you there's something on the list we voted on we can't have. Back round we go again.

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8 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

No, it's absolutely the right route. Just because the outcome isn't something you don't like. 

Eh? Have we had the outcome of a possible GE yet?

 

Do you have the Euro Millions numbers for the weekend?

 

Are you Doctor Who in disguise?

 

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If there was to be a second Ref., then presumably the only options which should be on the paper will be leave options (i.e. one or more options based on likely deals plus one option for no deal). As there has already been a ref which concluded that we should leave, the option to remain should NOT appear on the second ref paper. If remain is allowed as one of the options, then a multiple choice leave option merely waters down the leave vote leading to a likely remain outcome. Or am I being stupid.........!?

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1 hour ago, ariotofmyown said:

We both share a house. You own all of it and I just rent one bedroom, but use all the facilities in other rooms. I also act like I own the place.

I want to move out of your house and buy your damp and cold garage at the bottom of the garden. But at least it would be mine and I can live in it how I wish without you nagging me.

You offer me 10k for the garage and I can still use the facilities in the house for a large reduction in rent.

I say I'll give you 1k and want the usage of facilities for free.

You say you can't do that as the other tenants would want similar discounts.

I say if you don't accept then I will sleep on the street and be homeless and you'll lose both the 1k for the garage sale and the rent for facilities usage.

You say fine. I live on the street and get ill. I eventually knock on your door and ask for my own room back. You say yes at double the rent. I accept. 

You could always just rent somewhere else, accept that you might have to pay a bit more but not have to put up with the landlord.

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22 minutes ago, WharfedaleRam said:

If there was to be a second Ref., then presumably the only options which should be on the paper will be leave options (i.e. one or more options based on likely deals plus one option for no deal). As there has already been a ref which concluded that we should leave, the option to remain should NOT appear on the second ref paper. If remain is allowed as one of the options, then a multiple choice leave option merely waters down the leave vote leading to a likely remain outcome. Or am I being stupid.........!?

Tbh if there had been a proper process after the result of the first vote, that might well have been the next logical step: a public vote on how we leave. It might've helped heal the rift somewhat if we (as in the UK public) had been given a say on things. 

In the current climate I can't see it happening without a remain option. Both sides are far too polarised. 

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