The Politics Thread 2019

[GboroRam]

7 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

So the UK are heading to death but just a little nick for the EU?

Perhaps you can explain who will be replacing the UK contributions and explain how the EU will overcome the loss of trade with us?

No, you said it will be OK because both sides will feel pain. I'm pointing out that it doesn't necessarily stand like that, and disproportionate impact will occur on both sides. 

[G STAR RAM]

59 minutes ago, alexxxxx said:

The EU will just reduce its capital grants to make up for it. Considerable sums are transferred to the poorer areas of the EU for infrastructure so I guess this money will just fall. Its not going to stop the EU from functioning as its operational budget is quite small. 

The EU wont lose any trade with the UK as the UK said they wouldn't put tarrifs up (!). 

The EU is expanding its internal market with growing economies in Eastern Europe and has recently signed new trade arrangements with Canada, Japan and South America.

So the EU are going to make the poor suffer for their arrogance? Cant even begin to imagine the outrage we will see from some posters then.

You seriously think if we leave without a deal that the EU wouldnt lose any trade with the EU?

Fair points raised in the last paragraph. 

[G STAR RAM]

58 minutes ago, GboroRam said:

No, you said it will be OK because both sides will feel pain. I'm pointing out that it doesn't necessarily stand like that, and disproportionate impact will occur on both sides. 

Your analogy wasnt really like that though was it.

Can you quantify this disproportionate impact for us then please?

[G STAR RAM]

5 hours ago, SchtivePesley said:

Maybe when you explain your dodgy comment about Rotherham?

Dodgy comment?

What was dodgy about it?

Was just questioning whether it was a coincidence that yet more child grooming convictions were announced on the same day as something as big as what happened. 

I could also ask if it's a coincidence that the person most likely to report on the case was imprisoned just prior to the start of it?

Quite weird that if I question the motives of our government its classed as a dodgy comment but it's fine when you do it on a nearly daily basis it's fine!

[McRamFan]

22 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Dodgy comment?

What was dodgy about it?

Was just questioning whether it was a coincidence that yet more child grooming convictions were announced on the same day as something as big as what happened. 

I could also ask if it's a coincidence that the person most likely to report on the case was imprisoned just prior to the start of it?

Quite weird that if I question the motives of our government its classed as a dodgy comment but it's fine when you do it on a nearly daily basis it's fine!

Wrong, trail started 3rd July, your mate, Stephen, was jailed 11th.  He was jailed over his illegal reporting of an entirely different, however related, trails, yes the moron did it twice.  To this date there has been 4 trails that the details have been released to the press, after convictions have been delivered.  To this date we, the general public, either do not know or are not allowed to discuss, if any other trails or investigations are ongoing.

I think you will find it has been widely reported, both from the left and right media.  You should stop using google and try a better search engine, or stop making stuff up.

[1967Ram]

The latest YouGov poll (August 29th , 8.00am) is interesting. It indicates that no deal is the least popular choice (only 22% view it as a good option) and a soft brexit (alternative deal including single market and customs union) is the least divisive option.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2019/08/29/search-median-voter-brexit

 

[BaaLocks]

10 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

And guess what...the UK can reciprocate, not a single German car over our borders until a deal is agreed. Wonder how long the EU would hold their position? I imagine Germany are already going to be picking up the tab for us leaving, wonder if they would be happy losing our trade too?

• 79% of food in supermarkets comes from the EU
• Britain imports £30.3bn worth of food from the EU each year, yet exports £12.3bn
• £400m of tomatoes, mainly from the Netherlands, 99% of frozen potatoes (chips) are from the EU
• 98% of all lamb produced in the UK is exported to the EU. In the event of a no-deal Brexit that would, overnight, face a 40% tariff
• The Royal Pharmaceutical Society has already warned that they are stretched to stockpile on anti-depressants and painkillers
• We import more than we export from Germany, Netherlands, Spain, France, Belgium and Italy
• Germany sells about one in seven of all cars it makes in the UK, though it does export more to the UK than any other single country

But you keep telling yourself that old and tired story that the inability for BMW to not sell all their cars on November 1st is going to panic them into submission within days. And nobody, here or elsewhere, is able to confirm whether or not the EU would willingly trade with a non-EU partner that has a porous border with one of it's neighours.

Look, I get that we are a big country - no sensible body, even the EU and all that it is, will burn every bridge out of sheer spite. But we are proposing to enter into a no deal scenario willingly and of our own unilateral volition. In that case it isn't the EU that is to blame, we will have done this to ourselves.

[Wolfie]

3 minutes ago, BaaLocks said:

• 79% of food in supermarkets comes from the EU
• Britain imports £30.3bn worth of food from the EU each year, yet exports £12.3bn
• £400m of tomatoes, mainly from the Netherlands, 99% of frozen potatoes (chips) are from the EU
• 98% of all lamb produced in the UK is exported to the EU. In the event of a no-deal Brexit that would, overnight, face a 40% tariff
• The Royal Pharmaceutical Society has already warned that they are stretched to stockpile on anti-depressants and painkillers
• We import more than we export from Germany, Netherlands, Spain, France, Belgium and Italy
• Germany sells about one in seven of all cars it makes in the UK, though it does export more to the UK than any other single country

But you keep telling yourself that old and tired story that the inability for BMW to not sell all their cars on November 1st is going to panic them into submission within days. And nobody, here or elsewhere, is able to confirm whether or not the EU would willingly trade with a non-EU partner that has a porous border with one of it's neighours.

Look, I get that we are a big country - no sensible body, even the EU and all that it is, will burn every bridge out of sheer spite. But we are proposing to enter into a no deal scenario willingly and of our own unilateral volition. In that case it isn't the EU that is to blame, we will have done this to ourselves.

One thing that could work in our favour is the poor state of most of the big EU economies at the moment & they're not going to want another economic shock with Germany heading for recession; France growth stalling and Italy's being a basket case.

It's no surprise that Angela Merkel has been making the most friendly noises toward agreeing a deal. Her government is as precarious (majority-wise) as ours and they are expected to go into recession this quarter.

[Eddie]

11 minutes ago, Van Wolfie said:

It's no surprise that Angela Merkel has been making the most friendly noises toward agreeing a deal. Her government is as precarious (majority-wise) as ours and they are expected to go into recession this quarter.

So is the UK

[G STAR RAM]

54 minutes ago, McRamFan said:

Wrong, trail started 3rd July, your mate, Stephen, was jailed 11th.  He was jailed over his illegal reporting of an entirely different, however related, trails, yes the moron did it twice.  To this date there has been 4 trails that the details have been released to the press, after convictions have been delivered.  To this date we, the general public, either do not know or are not allowed to discuss, if any other trails or investigations are ongoing.

I think you will find it has been widely reported, both from the left and right media.  You should stop using google and try a better search engine, or stop making stuff up.

Stopped reading at 'your mate Stephen'. 

Boring.

[Wolfie]

10 minutes ago, Montgolfier said:

So is the UK

Doesn't change the fact that the major EU economies are going to want to avoid another shock.

I'm just making the point that if the EU was growing strongly, then they would be much more likely to give us the finger - and after 3 years, who could blame them.

[Stive Pesley]

1 hour ago, G STAR RAM said:

Dodgy comment?

What was dodgy about it?

Was just questioning whether it was a coincidence that yet more child grooming convictions were announced on the same day as something as big as what happened.

I just don't understand where you're coming from. They were convicted. That's good right? Why would that be deliberately under-reported?

More likely that it just seemed under-reported because of the enormity of other events - but even so, what's the problem? They were convicted. What difference would it have made if the news story had been more prominent? Would they have been more convicted?

[G STAR RAM]

1 hour ago, SchtivePesley said:

I just don't understand where you're coming from. They were convicted. That's good right? Why would that be deliberately under-reported?

More likely that it just seemed under-reported because of the enormity of other events - but even so, what's the problem? They were convicted. What difference would it have made if the news story had been more prominent? Would they have been more convicted?

I think it's an important issue that needs more prominence rather than being glossed over.

[Uptherams]

14 hours ago, BaaLocks said:

Oh but they do in the grand scheme of things. They are voters who will choose their next leader at the next general election. If they feel Brexit was not handled in the way they can tolerate then good luck BoJoke on getting re-elected - irrespective of whether they voted Leave, Remain or sat on their BWA on June 23rd.

Of course, and it saddens me to say it, the question they will then have to ask is whether Corbyn is a realistic alternative - but my point still stands that, now, their vote in the next general election is the one that matters more than what they did in the referendum.

Sorry that's not accurate. What i stated was. We can all pretend who and what people who didn't vote, support. 

[McRamFan]

2 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Stopped reading at 'your mate Stephen'. 

Boring.

Yeap, we all get it, that you get bored by actual facts.

[BaaLocks]

26 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

Sorry that's not accurate. What i stated was. We can all pretend who and what people who didn't vote, support. 

I'm not quite sure I understood but I think, reading the above, you are saying that we can all put words in other peoples mouths to support the argument we might want to put forward? Correct.

My point, apologies if it crossed over in any way, was that it matters not one jot now how people voted in the referendum but it will matter a hell of a lot how they vote in the next election. And they will vote for or against Boris based on how he handles the next few months. Bully his way through, and fail to listen to / understand the point of those who might not think they are getting what they thought they would (remain, second referendum, soft, hard, ultra hard, Norway +, extension, hard border, no border, let it burn etc) and he will be looking for a new job pretty soon. Deliver Brexit, with the EU bending at the last moment, and Britain getting through this relatively unscathed and he'll be lauded as a hero.

If I give Boris one single jot of credit it is that he has taken the high risk option, to lead through this period now. If I have one reason I won't vote for Corbyn it is because he has done exactly the opposite.

[AndyinLiverpool]

53 minutes ago, Uptherams said:

Sorry that's not accurate. What i stated was. We can all pretend who and what people who didn't vote, support. 

Indeed. People who didn’t vote should be left to wrestle with their own consciences. 

[G STAR RAM]

1 hour ago, McRamFan said:

Yeap, we all get it, that you get bored by actual facts.

Yes because every link that you post is obviously fact.

Maybe you could post us all a list of which media sites post facts and which ones are fake news?

[Stive Pesley]

4 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Yes because every link that you post is obviously fact.

Maybe you could post us all a list of which media sites post facts and which ones are fake news?

"Fake news" is an interesting concept isn't it.

I mean, it obviously exists to a degree - some news is 100% fabricated, but in common parlance it seems to have become a byword for "news I don't want to agree with"

 

[G STAR RAM]

9 minutes ago, SchtivePesley said:

"Fake news" is an interesting concept isn't it.

I mean, it obviously exists to a degree - some news is 100% fabricated, but in common parlance it seems to have become a byword for "news I don't want to agree with"

Hence why I very rarely post links to things.

If I read something I will post it and am always happy for it to be challenged if people have evidence to the contrary.

However, on the whole, most challenges just tend to be articles from a different point of view that are dressed up as fact by certain posters.