The Politics Thread 2019

[1967Ram]

9 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

I dont really know the statistics to know if he is preaching hatred or just relaying facts to the public.

As far as I am aware Trump is trying to sort the perceived problem by legitimate means rather than inciting violence. 

From what I see it is only the left that seems to be encouraging violence. Maybe I do have a biased opinion though.

It seems to me that Trump is using immigration from Mexico for his own political means. The evidence doesn't seem to warrant what he's saying IMO:

 

 

 

 

 

As the President of the United States of America he should IMO be acting very differently to how he is. He speaks about the dangers of social media and the Internet, yet he's tweeting stuff constantly. Almost all that he tweets is for self-promotion or to try to belittle or rubbish others.

Shouldn't the President of the USA be trying to unite, not further divide his country? Shouldn't he be setting a good example for how world leaders should behave? IMO he's making no attempt to do either and is, through his actions, making the World less safe.

Trump is in it for Trump IMO. If he isn't how can you explain his completely inappropriate actions in El Paso recently? There's just been a mass shooting yet he's grinning with his thumb up and making comments about the fact that he drew a larger crowd than O'Rourke. 

 

[G STAR RAM]

3 minutes ago, 1967Ram said:

It seems to me that Trump is using immigration from Mexico for his own political means. The evidence doesn't seem to warrant what he's saying IMO:

 

 

 

 

 

As the President of the United States of America he should IMO be acting very differently to how he is. He speaks about the dangers of social media and the Internet, yet he's tweeting stuff constantly. Almost all that he tweets is for self-promotion or to try to belittle or rubbish others.

Shouldn't the President of the USA be trying to unite, not further divide his country? Shouldn't he be setting a good example for how world leaders should behave? IMO he's making no attempt to do either and is, through his actions, making the World less safe.

Trump is in it for Trump IMO. If he isn't how can you explain his completely inappropriate actions in El Paso recently? There's just been a mass shooting yet he's grinning with his thumb up and making comments about the fact that he drew a larger crowd than O'Rourke. 

Doesn't the evidence show he is achieving what he set out to do and is trying to deliver on what he told the electorate he would do.

In what way is he making the world less safe? 

[McRamFan]

16 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

It was in the previous article you linked us to

 

Hmm, that was said by a spokesperson for Trump, holds as much water as a sieve.  However I am not surprised you take the thinnest thread to try and flip the facts.

Then there is the problem of a Commander in Chief whose rhetoric appears to mirror, validate and potentially inspire that of far-right extremists. The screed posted by the suspected terrorist in El Paso said he was motivated by a perceived “Hispanic invasion of Texas.” President Trump’s campaign has run some 2,200 Facebook ads warning of an “invasion” at the border, according to a CNN analysis. It’s a term he regularly uses in tweets and interviews. “People hate the word invasion, but that’s what it is,” he said in the Oval Office in March. “It’s an invasion of drugs and criminals and people.” (The El Paso shooter said his actions were unconnected to Trump. A senior Administration official told TIME that the criticism linking the President’s rhetoric to violence was “unfortunate, unreasonable and obviously politically motivated.”)

[Van der MoodHoover]

11 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

I dont really know the statistics to know if he is preaching hatred or just relaying facts to the public.

As far as I am aware Trump is trying to sort the perceived problem by legitimate means rather than inciting violence. 

From what I see it is only the left that seems to be encouraging violence. Maybe I do have a biased opinion though.

Do you think Trump knows what these are? ?

[G STAR RAM]

35 minutes ago, McRamFan said:

Hmm, that was said by a spokesperson for Trump, holds as much water as a sieve.  However I am not surprised you take the thinnest thread to try and flip the facts.

Then there is the problem of a Commander in Chief whose rhetoric appears to mirror, validate and potentially inspire that of far-right extremists. The screed posted by the suspected terrorist in El Paso said he was motivated by a perceived “Hispanic invasion of Texas.” President Trump’s campaign has run some 2,200 Facebook ads warning of an “invasion” at the border, according to a CNN analysis. It’s a term he regularly uses in tweets and interviews. “People hate the word invasion, but that’s what it is,” he said in the Oval Office in March. “It’s an invasion of drugs and criminals and people.” (The El Paso shooter said his actions were unconnected to Trump. A senior Administration official told TIME that the criticism linking the President’s rhetoric to violence was “unfortunate, unreasonable and obviously politically motivated.”)

Strange that you would link us to an article and then accuse me of trying to flip facts when I quote from it.

For those of us unfortunate enough to see your post last week though, nothing will come as a surprise anymore.

[G STAR RAM]

31 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

Do you think Trump knows what these are? ?

Yes I'd imagine he would have better access to official facts and figures rather than the ones we are fed by the MSM.

[1of4]

2 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Doesn't the evidence show he is achieving what he set out to do and is trying to deliver on what he told the electorate he would do.

In what way is he making the world less safe? 

No. The evidence shows that the number of  Mexicans entering the USA had started declining ten years before Trump entered office. So Trump and his build the wall chant as no bearing on the number of Mexicans crossing the border.

 

As for making the world a less save place. I could go to the effort of of giving you facts on what he's said and the action he as taken that is not only affecting the lives of individuals but also the environment. But as you have clearly stated your opinions are bias and you appear to not want to or can't understand facts that are contrary to them when they are presented to you, there no point in doing so.

[EtoileSportiveDeDerby]

44 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

Do you think Trump knows what these are? ?

 

12 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Yes I'd imagine he would have better access to official facts and figures rather than the ones we are fed by the MSM.

Is it a question of knowing or access ?

I think it's more to do with does he like it, reflects well on him or does it help him in any way ? If it does it is fact or a good plan (usually his), if not it is fake news.

 

[McRamFan]

32 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Strange that you would link us to an article and then accuse me of trying to flip facts when I quote from it.

For those of us unfortunate enough to see your post last week though, nothing will come as a surprise anymore.

Quoting out of context, again, it's your MO, and plenty have called you out on it. 

[G STAR RAM]

24 minutes ago, McRamFan said:

Quoting out of context, again, it's your MO, and plenty have called you out on it. 

Quoting out of context ?

I'd advise reading your links rather than just blindly posting mainstream media tripe if you dont want to get pulled up on things contained within it.

As for me being called out on it,that's fine, I have no problem being challenged on my views.

I go to sleep at night knowing that I dont incite, promote or celebrate hatred, violence or death...

[G STAR RAM]

51 minutes ago, 1of4 said:

No. The evidence shows that the number of  Mexicans entering the USA had started declining ten years before Trump entered office. So Trump and his build the wall chant as no bearing on the number of Mexicans crossing the border.

As for making the world a less save place. I could go to the effort of of giving you facts on what he's said and the action he as taken that is not only affecting the lives of individuals but also the environment. But as you have clearly stated your opinions are bias and you appear to not want to or can't understand facts that are contrary to them when they are presented to you, there no point in doing so.

See this is how the narrative goes.

Anything that potentially puts Trump in a good light, or shows that he is delivering on his campaign promises, is attributed to previous Presidents.

Anything bad that has been going on for years is attributed solely to Trump.

Remember a couple of years ago when Trump's actions with North Korea were going to take us to World War III?

Believe it or not I actually read pretty much all of the views and links posted in this topic and do try to keep an open mind about things. 

I'm aware that Trump has controversial views and makes rash decisions but I also think he has brought a much needed kick up the arse for modern politics. 

[G STAR RAM]

44 minutes ago, EtoileSportiveDeDerby said:

Is it a question of knowing or access ?

I think it's more to do with does he like it, reflects well on him or does it help him in any way ? If it does it is fact or a good plan (usually his), if not it is fake news.

Good question and one that I suspect none of us will ever know the answer to.

The second paragraph is common in every walk of life. Ever wrote a cv and put all of your bad points on it? Not a good comparison I know but sure you know what I mean.

[Uptherams]

12 hours ago, 1967Ram said:

It seems to me that Trump is using immigration from Mexico for his own political means. The evidence doesn't seem to warrant what he's saying IMO:

 

 

 

 

 

As the President of the United States of America he should IMO be acting very differently to how he is. He speaks about the dangers of social media and the Internet, yet he's tweeting stuff constantly. Almost all that he tweets is for self-promotion or to try to belittle or rubbish others.

Shouldn't the President of the USA be trying to unite, not further divide his country? Shouldn't he be setting a good example for how world leaders should behave? IMO he's making no attempt to do either and is, through his actions, making the World less safe.

Trump is in it for Trump IMO. If he isn't how can you explain his completely inappropriate actions in El Paso recently? There's just been a mass shooting yet he's grinning with his thumb up and making comments about the fact that he drew a larger crowd than O'Rourke. 

 

I'm curious as to what you think those charts highlight beyond what they just highlight. 

[Comrade 86]

On 09/08/2019 at 14:28, G STAR RAM said:

But the media dont point out that the white supremacists dont represent the views of white people.

I've never heard anyone say Islamic jihadists represent every Muslims views, just that they seem to follow certain teachings of their holy book, unfortunately that discussion gets shut straight down.

Perhaps the reason they make a point about the Jihadis is to try and stop reprisals against ordinary Muslims? There are no such reprisals against white Americans after white supremacist attacks.

[G STAR RAM]

6 hours ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said:

Perhaps the reason they make a point about the Jihadis is to try and stop reprisals against ordinary Muslims? There are no such reprisals against white Americans after white supremacist attacks.

Yes, fair comment.

[McRamFan]

Trump, and his views on shooting immigrants, however as its MSM, probably not true.  Instead of rejecting the shout out to 'shoot them' he finds it funny.  Anyone supporting him, is themselves, supporting racism, violence and hatred.

Rated left of center:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-shooting-migrants-video-rally-el-paso-a9038961.html

Here is one of many analysis of Trumps MO.

Rated as unbiased:

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2019/08/09/trump-racial-rhetoric-keeps-base-mobilized-through-repetition-column/1923279001/

Would post something from the right, it's either bonkers or just ignores it.

[G STAR RAM]

1 hour ago, McRamFan said:

Trump, and his views on shooting immigrants, however as its MSM, probably not true.  Instead of rejecting the shout out to 'shoot them' he finds it funny.  Anyone supporting him, is themselves, supporting racism, violence and hatred.

Rated left of center:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-shooting-migrants-video-rally-el-paso-a9038961.html

Here is one of many analysis of Trumps MO.

Rated as unbiased:

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2019/08/09/trump-racial-rhetoric-keeps-base-mobilized-through-repetition-column/1923279001/

Would post something from the right, it's either bonkers or just ignores it.

For once I'm with you.

Condoning or joking about people being shot dead is indefensible. 

[GboroRam]

3 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

For once I'm with you.

Condoning or joking about people being shot dead is indefensible. 

I think no matter where you stand on the issues of the day, all sides could do more. The arguments start around the perceptions of scale of importance and urgency. 

[Comrade 86]

4 hours ago, McRamFan said:

Trump, and his views on shooting immigrants, however as its MSM, probably not true.  Instead of rejecting the shout out to 'shoot them' he finds it funny.  Anyone supporting him, is themselves, supporting racism, violence and hatred.

Rated left of center:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-shooting-migrants-video-rally-el-paso-a9038961.html

Here is one of many analysis of Trumps MO.

Rated as unbiased:

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2019/08/09/trump-racial-rhetoric-keeps-base-mobilized-through-repetition-column/1923279001/

Would post something from the right, it's either bonkers or just ignores it.

I despise Trump, it's not really any big secret. Not because his political leanings do not match my own but becasue time and time again he shows himself to be a pretty despicable human being. Some folk are blinded by short-term 'improvements' in the US with unemployment rates down right now and other stats that seem to show an upward curve but his trade war will undo all these benefits and his promise to eradicate the federal debt seems laughable now with the an increase in excess of $2.3 trillion (the highest figure ever recorded) and were he to secure a second term, the cost of his policies are projected to see that figure rise to $29 trillion. He's simply robbing Peter to pay Paul and the MAGA nuts lap it all up without a single thought for the what the future holds.

Maybe they just don't understand basic economics. Maybe they don't understand that the trade war with China will end up in huge job losses and will actually damage US manufacturing industries, not help them. Maybe they don't even know about the federal debt or lack the understanding of how it will impact the economy down the road. Or maybe they are just hateful egotists like Trump himself and revel in his glow which allows them to express hate without fear of reproach. I don't believe that the odious underbelly that has been expsed under Trump is something new. I think it's always been there lurking in the shadows and while I don't suggest Trum has legitimised it, he's certainly created an environment where these hateful individuals feel less afraid. For that, he must shoulder some blame.

I'm really passed caring these days as my greatest fear that his poison would seep well beyond US borders has already happened, so us maniacal lefties will just have to sit back now and watch the whole shitshow play out as it's a juggernaut that for now, is unstoppable. I took issue, even with left wing friends and family, back in the day as they laughed at Trump's rise to power as it it was some sort of sick, satyrical sideshow that they seemed unable to envision impacting their own lives and environments. They're not laughing anymore ?

[cstand]

On 08/08/2019 at 10:02, McRamFan said:

Hmm...you really expect Farage and his cronies to give up free money?

Emperors new clothes.

No idea what you are on about any pension earned is payable when you leave as with any other job. 

He has campaigned to leave the EU which means he gets LESS money.

Farage has highlighted millions wasted by the EU over the years with staff retiring early on full pay and moving the European parliament from Brussels to Strasbourg which costs €100,000,000 a year. This saving would pay for his pension many times over and others plus change for good causes but the EU decided to ignore him and waste all that money but that is the madness of the EU.