jono Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 1 hour ago, StivePesley said: There is a lot wrong with the EU as an institution, but very little wrong with it as a concept. Remain and reform was always the best way forward. The most democratic way forward in fact. There is enough political will across the EU27 to make that happen, but we clever British souls decided we'd rather leave (even though we had no idea how to leave) Now all the brexiteers have done is stuffed the EU parliament with a bunch of dummies who won't even turn up. How's that for unaccountable? And now Farage is claiming that the £450k he was gifted by Arran Banks was a purely private matter and "nothing to do with politics". Seriously? Who just gives someone that sort of money without expecting something for it? I hope both these slimeballs go down for corruption Spot on Stiv. Absolutely the EU and its unelected officials, Commissioner’s and a whole bunch of fat self serving hangers on are dreadful. The concept however is magical. We Europe, who share history and culture who have developed together, have similar ethics and laws, trade happily and understand each other’s modus vivendi are a great counter balance to the other great powers of China and the US. We don’t exactly have much clout as a post industrial nation of 70 million brits. The costs of the EU and some of the ridiculous micro managing of laws and regulations are frankly dire and irrelavent yet they keep a lot of over paid bureaucrats in jobs. Wrong wrong wrong but We should be in it to sort this out not going off to sulk in a corner with our own pitiful one nation toy box Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 On 25/06/2019 at 15:06, GboroRam said: That was a bit of a sly move from the Brexit supporters. They said the technology exists, which it does. It's called computers. Unfortunately there is no software that does what they want it to, or any workable method that can be described to a developer in terms they could make it do what it needs to. I think I have also read that whilst technology can assist in Customs checks away from borders, there is not one single land border in the world that relis only on this method for Customs checks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 Dun dun dun, another one bites the dust (if we leave with no deal) https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-48790657 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 Let’s talk about Chris Williamson ! Got off the hook by his mates it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 3 minutes ago, jono said: Let’s talk about Chris Williamson ! Got off the hook by his mates it seems. Utterly ridiculous situation, and of course fence-sitter Corbyn is now saying that it wasn't his decision to reinstate him. Coupled with Bumbling Boris now seemingly distancing himself from his previous television-induced announcement that he is in favour of an inquiry into Islamophobia within the Conservative Party, it is a sad day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 3 hours ago, jono said: Let’s talk about Chris Williamson ! Got off the hook by his mates it seems. Certainly an interesting one. He's my MP, I voted for him and in very minor dealings with him as a constituent he was very good. However I do believe that he was utterly stupid to open his gob on anti-semitism the way that he did, in the current environment where every little word on the subject is scrutinised by the media, and the anti-Corbyn brigade will pile in on anyone for the slightest thing. He effectively kicked the hornet's nest clean over. He was suspended and reprimanded with a formal warning - and he wrote a long and thoughtful apology recognising his errors. Do we live in a world where no one is allowed to be forgiven? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 27 minutes ago, StivePesley said: He was suspended and reprimanded with a formal warning - and he wrote a long and thoughtful apology recognising his errors. Do we live in a world where no one is allowed to be forgiven? Answers on the back of a postcard to Danny Baker... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 6 hours ago, maxjam said: Answers on the back of a postcard to Danny Baker... Or jo brand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 14 hours ago, jono said: Let’s talk about Chris Williamson ! Got off the hook by his mates it seems. Backlash, even from the loon's of momentum https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48790803 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 13 minutes ago, McRamFan said: Backlash, even from the loon's of momentum https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48790803 I can't quite put my finger on what doesn't feel right about the constant anti-semitism rows in the Labour Party. I mean, not so long ago, Tom Watson was having a go at Corbyn for interfering with the disciplinary proceedings - so they set up an independent panel to review cases. Now that panel makes a decision and Watson is calling on Corbyn to intervene because he disputes the decision.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 14 minutes ago, StivePesley said: I can't quite put my finger on what doesn't feel right about the constant anti-semitism rows in the Labour Party. I mean, not so long ago, Tom Watson was having a go at Corbyn for interfering with the disciplinary proceedings - so they set up an independent panel to review cases. Now that panel makes a decision and Watson is calling on Corbyn to intervene because he disputes the decision.... True enough but when the “independent” committee meeting is cancelled because a member with the “correct” attitude can’t attend it tells you all you need to know about who and what is running the party and how it operates to achieve its agenda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 19 minutes ago, jono said: True enough but when the “independent” committee meeting is cancelled because a member with the “correct” attitude can’t attend it tells you all you need to know about who and what is running the party and how it operates to achieve its agenda. Also true - although this just sounds like standard political party behaviour from local councils through to national government. Reminds me of the old adage that the people most likely to want to become politicians are the people least suited to the job. Roll on fully automated direct democracy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 Well seeing as there is a tech company in the US who appointed an AI algorithm onto its board of directors, perhaps the next tech development could be to elect a bot as an MP.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1967Ram Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 2 hours ago, HantsRam said: Well seeing as there is a tech company in the US who appointed an AI algorithm onto its board of directors, perhaps the next tech development could be to elect a bot as an MP.... We're going to have one as PM soon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 1 minute ago, 1967Ram said: We're going to have one as PM soon? No I think we're getting an a**e aren't we? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 2 hours ago, 1967Ram said: We're going to have one as PM soon? That's 'twot', not 'bot'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 10 hours ago, StivePesley said: I can't quite put my finger on what doesn't feel right about the constant anti-semitism rows in the Labour Party. I mean, not so long ago, Tom Watson was having a go at Corbyn for interfering with the disciplinary proceedings - so they set up an independent panel to review cases. Now that panel makes a decision and Watson is calling on Corbyn to intervene because he disputes the decision.... I agree it's strange. I don't think I've ever heard an anti-Semitic comment in my life, yet I hear racist ones on a regular basis. If I was a conspiracy theorist, I'd say after many attempts at undermining the party leadership, the opposition to Corbyn has finally chanced upon a stick to beat him with that resonates with his opponents inside and outside of the party. As a Labour member, I'm beginning to despair at his leadership, and those who advise him on this particular issue, controversy should be the easiest thing to avoid, yet he can't or won't address it. It's so easily avoidable, yet he seems to blunder into the traps set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i-Ram Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 7 minutes ago, reveldevil said: I agree it's strange. I don't think I've ever heard an anti-Semitic comment in my life, yet I hear racist ones on a regular basis. If I was a conspiracy theorist, I'd say after many attempts at undermining the party leadership, the opposition to Corbyn has finally chanced upon a stick to beat him with that resonates with his opponents inside and outside of the party. As a Labour member, I'm beginning to despair at his leadership, and those who advise him on this particular issue, controversy should be the easiest thing to avoid, yet he can't or won't address it. It's so easily avoidable, yet he seems to blunder into the traps set. Corbyn is totally incompetent Rev. He doesn’t have a weakness on a single issue, he is weak on every issue. We have had one of the worst Governments in many a decade, and he hasn’t been able to lay a glove on them. Over the last 3 years his performance has been risible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 9 minutes ago, i-Ram said: Corbyn is totally incompetent Rev. He doesn’t have a weakness on a single issue, he is weak on every issue. We have had one of the worst Governments in many a decade, and he hasn’t been able to lay a glove on them. Over the last 3 years his performance has been risible. Nonsense. Only last week he won bronze at the annual Islington allotment show for his prize Cucumber. It would have been gold, but a last minute dirty dew derailed his shot at glory. At least I think that's what he said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted June 28, 2019 Share Posted June 28, 2019 I don't know much about what is going on in the Labour Party with regards to antisemitism. It's a topic I feel like I'm probably on a line, maybe over a line, on. I don't know. I don't agree with the state of Israel existing, but it does and to argue for its destruction seems unreasonable and divisive. However it also seems there are some who see any criticism of the state of Israel as an antisemitic act. Does my position of not agreeing with the state of Israel mean I am antisemitic? I believe some would see it that way. I can see why some people want to see the end of the Israeli state. Are they all antisemitic? I'd like to think it is possible to say that without being accused of a hate crime. I know it seems hypocritical when compared to my views on Islam, but is it? I support the rights of people to follow the religion of their choice, as long as it doesn't affect the rights of everyone else. A religion which takes ownership of a stretch of land based on an alleged holy book saying it was promised to them, or a historic claim so old it loses all relevance, isn't managing to not affect others' rights, which is my main claim. The persecution of the Jews was very real and the antisemitism of history is so far removed from the arguments around the Labour Party, it feels like an engineered outrage rather than a legitimate concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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