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David

NFL 2019 Season

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3 minutes ago, Srg said:

Not entirely sure what the answer is for this

Link it to time played on the field, job done. Mahomes has another 2 years remaining doesn't he? Which is daft when he's clearly the starting QB. Play 80% of a season and you have to get pushed on to a big boy contract.

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2 minutes ago, David said:

Link it to time played on the field, job done. Mahomes has another 2 years remaining doesn't he? Which is daft when he's clearly the starting QB. Play 80% of a season and you have to get pushed on to a big boy contract.

3 technically, because anyone who gets picked in round 1 has an option of a year extension after year 4 - often the reason teams trade back into the first round to select a player, like we did with Jackson, because that extra year is so valuable from a contract stand point.

Edited by Srg

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It's tricky with Rookie contracts cos its not that uncommon for a rookie, especially a QB, to be great for a year or two and then completely fall off a cliff.

I guess pay-as-you-play wouldn't have risk in that regard, but if they were the backup and the team was forced to play them due to an injury to the starting QB, would they suddenly get starting QB money despite maybe not being good enough? There are challenges.

The real solution is for teams to stop overvaluing and/or agreeing to crazy terms demanded by mediocre (and worse) QBs. Then it wouldn't be SUCH an advantage to have a good QB on a rookie salary.

Edited by SaintRam

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35 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

Rookie contracts are the most important type of contract. Having pro-bowl level players on tiny (relative to the rest of the league) salaries is absolutely necessary to compete.

We've drafted incredibly well of late (primarily, 2 and 3 years ago), and we managed to get them all on to pretty long term contracts; but when Alvin Kamara, Michael Thomas, Marshon Lattimore, Ryan Ramczyk and Sheldon Rankins (who are all comfortably among our top 10 players) come out of their rookie contracts - either Drew Brees won't be with us and we'll draft a rookie QB, or this team is going to be torn apart.

All 5 of those players will be looking to be among the best paid players at their position in the NFL.

 

Michael Thomas and Alvin Kamara were 2nd and 3rd round drafts respectively as well, which means right now they're on barely any money. Going to be a huge hit paying those guys.

Thomas is getting $1.1m a year, and Kamara is on about $900k a year.

Drafting has been a bit of a disaster for the Vikings the last 3 years. You take Thomas in round 2 after we take Laquon Treadwell in round 1 🤦‍♂️ Going in early on Daniel Carlson because we want a quality kicker and then waivering him after 3/4 games 🤦‍♂️ After settling in at the Raiders he doesn’t miss now.

and when we do get a good one, they get injured after and handful of games....Dalvin Cook & Mike Hughes.

we really need a change of fortunes in the draft this year.

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7 minutes ago, jimbo jones said:

Drafting has been a bit of a disaster for the Vikings the last 3 years. You take Thomas in round 2 after we take Laquon Treadwell in round 1 🤦‍♂️ Going in early on Daniel Carlson because we want a quality kicker and then waivering him after 3/4 games 🤦‍♂️ After settling in at the Raiders he doesn’t miss now.

and when we do get a good one, they get injured after and handful of games....Dalvin Cook & Mike Hughes.

we really need a change of fortunes in the draft this year.

Cutting Daniel Carson wasn't bad luck, that was a properly stupid decision.

The rest were unlucky though, granted.

Also, Michael Thomas's hands would be useful anywhere but not every system is as perfect for a big, average paced, physical receiver. Sean Payton's always had one. Used to be Marques Colston, Thomas was his replacement. I doubt he looks as elite in some systems.

I do hope your fortunes improve though. Good drafts are a big portion of the enjoyment of football 😄 as long as it doesn't come at the Saint's cost.

Edited by SaintRam

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12 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

It's tricky with Rookie contracts cos its not that uncommon for a rookie, especially a QB, to be great for a year or two and then completely fall off a cliff.

I guess pay-as-you-play wouldn't have risk in that regard, but if they were the backup and the team was forced to play them due to an injury to the starting QB, would they suddenly get starting QB money despite maybe not being good enough? There are challenges.

The real solution is for teams to stop overvaluing and/or agreeing to crazy terms demanded by mediocre (and worse) QBs. Then it wouldn't be SUCH an advantage to have a good QB on a rookie salary.

Can't do a pay-as-you-play because the team needs to be either under/over the salary cap by the time the final 53 man roster is set - so you can't have a player you don't know how much you're going to pay for the upcoming season, it just wouldn't work at all.

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Just now, Srg said:

Can't do a pay-as-you-play because the team needs to be either under/over the salary cap by the time the final 53 man roster is set - so you can't have a player you don't know how much you're going to pay for the upcoming season, it just wouldn't work at all.

Oh yeah no I wasn't implying there was any hope for it, but I assumed in a world where it existed there would be changes to how the cap worked too. It would only work in a world where everyone of the same position got paid the same amount , which would upset the elite players 😄 

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25% salary increase on rookie contracts for the following season after completing 70% of the season.

That's that one sorted, what would you like me to fix next?

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7 minutes ago, David said:

25% salary increase on rookie contracts for the following season after completing 70% of the season.

That's that one sorted, what would you like me to fix next?

And then they fall off a cliff next season and get overpaid? 

Its not that bad right now. THe only players outperforming their rookie contracts are elite players. When they come out of their contracts they get PAID, if they maintained the level of performance until the end of their contracts.

Its only an issue at the QB position because mediocre non-rookie QBs get paid so much of late. Used to be, the best QBs were the best paid, but thats changed of late. But then the team that suffers is the team that's spent huge money on a "meh" QB, so its their own fault.

Edited by SaintRam

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3 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

And then they fall off a cliff next season and get overpaid? 

Be at the end of their contract and you can chuck them off with no dead cap space. Might be difficult for your New York teams finding a cliff, but I'm sure a skyscraper would have the same splat effect on impact.

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51 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

Cutting Daniel Carson wasn't bad luck, that was a properly stupid decision.

The rest were unlucky though, granted.

Also, Michael Thomas's hands would be useful anywhere but not every system is as perfect for a big, average paced, physical receiver. Sean Payton's always had one. Used to be Marques Colston, Thomas was his replacement. I doubt he looks as elite in some systems.

I do hope your fortunes improve though. Good drafts are a big portion of the enjoyment of football 😄 as long as it doesn't come at the Saint's cost.

100 % agree on Carlson, looked stupid at the time, looked even worse as he started well for Oakland....and now Dan Bailey will be a free agent with no certainty he will return. So what are we going to do now, draft another rookie and give him 3 games 🤦‍♂️

Laquan Treadwell is best described as a big, average paced physical receiver...except he has cement hands and couldn’t catch a cold. Apparently the Raiders are showing an interest in a trade, so he probably goes there and looks like Michael Thomas #2

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4 minutes ago, jimbo jones said:

100 % agree on Carlson, looked stupid at the time, looked even worse as he started well for Oakland....and now Dan Bailey will be a free agent with no certainty he will return. So what are we going to do now, draft another rookie and give him 3 games 🤦‍♂️

Laquan Treadwell is best described as a big, average paced physical receiver...except he has cement hands and couldn’t catch a cold. Apparently the Raiders are showing an interest in a trade, so he probably goes there and looks like Michael Thomas #2

Haha - maybe. Although if he can't catch Cousins throws I doubt he'll do better with Carr throws. But he was scouted as the #1 WR in that draft (which looks absurd now), so there must be some ability in there.

Edited by SaintRam

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46 minutes ago, SaintRam said:

Haha - maybe. Although if he can't catch Cousins throws I doubt he'll do better with Carr throws. But he was scouted as the #1 WR in that draft (which looks absurd now), so there must be some ability in there.

He’s a useful blocker when your o line sucks 😂

I guess you can see the attributes people saw, but he repeatedly dropped relatively easy catches, and the second half of this season he was anonymous. He was left out for the Bears game despite being fully fit, so I’m pretty certain his time in minnesota has finished.

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