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Racism.


Coneheadjohn

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1 hour ago, coneheadjohn said:

The police have arrested him and are investigating him on suspicion of a racially aggravated public order offence.

I have no idea what their evidence is.

 

 

 

I missed that, the evening standard reported this 4/12 as follows

Mr Panteli said he regrets the incident and intends to plead guilty to throwing a missile on the pitch when he appears at Highbury Corner Magistrates Court on December 18.

The FA have dropped their probe into the incident after police ruled it was not racially aggravated.

has there been an update?

 

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27 minutes ago, coneheadjohn said:

That’s why I quoted the article.

The police had arrested him and are investigating him on suspicion of a racially aggravated assault.

They must have felt they had enough evidence to make that arrest.

I’ve no idea what the evidence is,it’s just an assumption that throwing a banana skin at a black man is racist in these circumstances.

And for me that's the problem that I mentioned in an earlier post, the automatic assumption where a non white person involved is that it must be racism.

 

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1 hour ago, G STAR RAM said:

Had the goalscorer been white and the perpetrator been black (or whatever the pc term is these days) what would they have had to throw for it to be deemed racist?

Still a banana skin, but from one of those individually wrapped organic fairtrade 'prefectly ripe' bananas from M&S.

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18 hours ago, maxjam said:

I think leftie's wait until everyone is comfortable with a term then change it suddenly so they can keep hitting people over the head with a big stick ?

Can't use that  term mate.......thats species-ist.

It's "multi-cellular organisms of the phylum chordata within the kingdom animalia" if you don't mind ?

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34 minutes ago, Paul71 said:

So it seems.

Im not saying don't ban him but lifetime seems ott.

Agree.

Anyone that throws an object onto a pitch should be charged under the same offence.  If the object has potential to injure or is racially motivated charge them with additional offences,

Life bans though?  Ignores potential for personal growth or genuine remorse - even murderers get let out eventually.

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On 04/12/2018 at 20:32, StringerBell said:

Still, I didn't know having a scrap at school was banned by the Geneva Convention. Are there any other war criminals on here?

Now you are just being very silly.

I was not saying that a scarp in school was banned, I was saying the act of water boarding has been banned and what that lad did was in my eyes a very similar act.

 

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5 minutes ago, BathRam72 said:

Now you are just being very silly.

I was not saying that a scarp in school was banned, I was saying the act of water boarding has been banned and what that lad did was in my eyes a very similar act.

 

I got into a scarp at school for wearing a scrave.

 

 

 

 

Yes I know it’s a serious subject - just trying to lighten it up!

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It seems Spurs were too hasty to condemn the incident as racist although it was right to be suspicious of racist intent and justified an investigation. 

I have witnessed racism at the game, from Derby fans as well as others, and I'm not just talking about the 70s, 80, or 90s. "Small town in Asia" was sung at Leicester City fans amongst others as recently as around 2010 in the South-East corner, though this seemed to dissipate with the move to the South Stand. I think football has done a reasonable job of putting a lid on racism and forcing it elsewhere and I have noticed quite a few more Asian people in the stands at PP than in the past. 

More widely on this debate, I would say that if a group has been previously discriminated against -and it is pretty hard to argue against that being the case in this instance - then to suddenly let them join in with the rest of society through equality of opportunity and expect immediate equal outcomes is naive. Be it with money, power, race, gender or anything else, privilege begets privilege.    

 

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22 hours ago, ronnieronalde said:

Probably my last post on the subject as well as it's going down a route I don't like.

First of all I think we're looking for racism so much that even in instances that may not be, it's dragged out.

The waterboarding comments are a good example of that. Waterboarding for goodness sakes, if that was waterboarding then there are a few premier league players who should be up in front of the geneva convention for their celebrations.  What have you seen that makes you honestly think it's waterboarding?

Secondly and perhaps more controversially, it's not meant to be, it's just me telling the truth as I see it, like always. 

It's not only white people who are racist. Racism exists everywhere across the world and it's all wrong.

People who are idiots are idiots whatever their skin colour.

If you are referring to the celebrations of Paul Gascoine or similar. They were done purely as that, a celebration of which was either planned or spontaneous. 

This act was forced upon some one who did not agree to it. Therefor it is bullying of the highest order. Pouring water directly into the throat and water getting potentially into the lungs can have serious consequences (If you don't believe me feel free to give it a go)

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1 hour ago, Dimmu said:

I don't get your question at all. For example, racism can be conscious or unconscious. Sometimes people disagree with their own unconscious mind and want it to change.

The beauty of science, you'll always find the opposite view. I didn't check the reliability of the test I linked, but most of them are based on a very reliable and valid one which was created in Harvard after millions of test uses. Usually, you're pretty safe with these big universities publishes, they have too much to lose not to check everything properly.

Theres no evidence you can change your unconscious mind and I don't like the dystopian sci-fi novel implications about that. By 'some people' you mean employers. 

No, the one from Harvard is mentioned in the article. It has a repeatability of 0.4. 0.8 is the required number for a diagnostic tool.  The inventor of the test admitted it couldn't really be used to identify people who discriminate. 

 

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On 06/12/2018 at 14:07, David said:

I think you would need to research and understand why some people use this forum, watch football and follow Derby.

It’s possible that some use this forum as an escape from the real world, a place to unwind after work after a chat about Derby and post a picture of their knee whilst out having a drink or close in shot of their duck and chips. Absolutely no interest in discussing anything heavy such as politics or religion.

I bet many of us know people that do vote but can’t be bothered to discuss it with friends or family as it causes arguments, or they are simply to thick to understand (in our opinions).

When we introduced the no politics rule, I’m sure you saw that some were happy as it allowed them to now venture into the off topic area.

Same may apply to issues such as racism, we could have black, mixed race or asian members right now reading this shaking their head and clicking away, not wanting to get involved.

Racism which could effect them in everyday life and this forum is a getaway from that, they would rather be anonymous and discuss how many points Carson has lost us this season where their skin colour is not an issue or silence their opinions.

Or it could just be a case of seeing Lambchop, Stringer, Stiv.....yeah can’t be bothered with this, which I hold my hand up to and leave it to the other moderators I have roped into this!

As I say, it was predictable who would be in this topic, the same group that have held many debates with you that I have seen refuse to apologise for being white males. Just wouldn’t jump to conclusions on the wider audience of the forum over debates with the 5% that engage with you in these topics.

Finally, I would argue that some subjects are better discussed away from keyboards and face to face over a pint, not that I’m asking you out on a date, but text on screen is not always read as intended. Not always easy getting your thoughts down in writing, conscious of the fact you are boring everyone reading with lengthy posts like now.

Pure speculation to justify your opinion/ agenda. From my perspective you have a very heavy bias/ slant on this forum towards particular viewpoints, and alternative views are ridiculed or shouted down. You do nothing to moderate this, probably because you don't even perceive it's happening. In fact, you're more likely to target individuals who 'cause friction' by speaking against it. 

It's a shame, because in many ways it's a varied and interesting forum, and I'm sure there are some great people on here, but for me it cannot be the community I hoped it would be while the situation I mention persists. I shall post in the predictions league, read about the football, and leave it at that. 

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5 hours ago, Lambchop said:

Pure speculation to justify your opinion/ agenda. From my perspective you have a very heavy bias/ slant on this forum towards particular viewpoints, and alternative views are ridiculed or shouted down. You do nothing to moderate this, probably because you don't even perceive it's happening. In fact, you're more likely to target individuals who 'cause friction' by speaking against it. 

It's a shame, because in many ways it's a varied and interesting forum, and I'm sure there are some great people on here, but for me it cannot be the community I hoped it would be while the situation I mention persists. I shall post in the predictions league, read about the football, and leave it at that. 

Come on @Lambchop know when you're beat. After all, what could any minority subject to hate, violence, bigotry or discrimination really want other than for white men to apologise for being white?  

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6 hours ago, Lambchop said:

Pure speculation to justify your opinion/ agenda. From my perspective you have a very heavy bias/ slant on this forum towards particular viewpoints, and alternative views are ridiculed or shouted down. You do nothing to moderate this, probably because you don't even perceive it's happening. In fact, you're more likely to target individuals who 'cause friction' by speaking against it. 

It's a shame, because in many ways it's a varied and interesting forum, and I'm sure there are some great people on here, but for me it cannot be the community I hoped it would be while the situation I mention persists. I shall post in the predictions league, read about the football, and leave it at that. 

 

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On 06/12/2018 at 11:57, ronnieronalde said:

Probably my last post on the subject as well as it's going down a route I don't like.

First of all I think we're looking for racism so much that even in instances that may not be, it's dragged out.

The waterboarding comments are a good example of that. Waterboarding for goodness sakes, if that was waterboarding then there are a few premier league players who should be up in front of the geneva convention for their celebrations.  What have you seen that makes you honestly think it's waterboarding?

Secondly and perhaps more controversially, it's not meant to be, it's just me telling the truth as I see it, like always. 

It's not only white people who are racist. Racism exists everywhere across the world and it's all wrong.

People who are idiots are idiots whatever their skin colour.

Ronnie, you've always seemed a thoroughly decent chap to me but there are elements of your post that are quite troubling. Firstly, a child being throat-slammed to the floor while his assailant screams, ‘I’m going to ducking drown you’ is not comparable with the Gazza dentist chair celebration. It does you no favours to suggest otherwise. It transpires that this has been going on for months now and his sister has also been regularly assaulted. As you point out, it’s not waterboarding per se, but it sure as fook ain’t mere jolly japes either. You may regard it as nothing serious, but I doubt the children in question feel the same way. Would you laugh it off so easily, I wonder, if it were your son or daughter being bullied like this?

Secondly, while it is true that pretty much all nationalities and creeds have racists amongst their number, and I readily concede that the English are nowhere near the worst offenders in this regard, where is it suggested that only white folk are racist? That is a straw man fallacy, right there. It’s quite ironic how outraged some are by minorities apparently ‘playing the race card’ when they seem totally oblivious to how often they do it themselves, even in their own countries. 

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6 hours ago, Lambchop said:

Pure speculation to justify your opinion/ agenda. From my perspective you have a very heavy bias/ slant on this forum towards particular viewpoints, and alternative views are ridiculed or shouted down. You do nothing to moderate this, probably because you don't even perceive it's happening. In fact, you're more likely to target individuals who 'cause friction' by speaking against it. 

Agreed, I regularly see you shouting down anybody that does not agree with you.

Basically, what your above post is saying, is that only your opinion is correct and should not be challenged, and everyone else's posts should be moderated accordingly. 

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