BathRam72 Posted May 25, 2018 Share Posted May 25, 2018 https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/derby-county-transfers-player-value-1589129 According to the telegraph on-line. This is the latest on how much our squad is worth. I am sure Vydra is worth a lot more now after his best ever season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted May 25, 2018 Share Posted May 25, 2018 1 minute ago, BathRam72 said: According to the telegraph on-line. They have pulled the numbers from Transfermarkt.co.uk (MV), Market Value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archied Posted May 25, 2018 Share Posted May 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, BathRam72 said: https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/derby-county-transfers-player-value-1589129 According to the telegraph on-line. This is the latest on how much our squad is worth. I am sure Vydra is worth a lot more now after his best ever season. Looks more like prices we paid for them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted May 25, 2018 Share Posted May 25, 2018 10 minutes ago, BathRam72 said: https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/derby-county-transfers-player-value-1589129 According to the telegraph on-line. This is the latest on how much our squad is worth. I am sure Vydra is worth a lot more now after his best ever season. Except for Vydra aren't they the sort of values we'd want to achieve if selling, cos we all know that we mostly can't sell them! Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1of4 Posted May 25, 2018 Share Posted May 25, 2018 If we could get 20 million for the first five on that list, I'd take it and let our new manager use it to buy some new young players. Hopefully it will also reduce the wage bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnero Posted May 25, 2018 Share Posted May 25, 2018 15 minutes ago, 1of4 said: If we could get 20 million for the first five on that list, I'd take it and let our new manager use it to buy some new young players. Hopefully it will also reduce the wage bill. If we could get 20 million for the whole squad I'd take it and start again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 25, 2018 Share Posted May 25, 2018 34 minutes ago, Carnero said: If we could get 20 million for the whole squad I'd take it and start again. ......with a book loss of £30m+......but I know you were only Joking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 4 hours ago, ramblur said: ......with a book loss of £30m+......but I know you were only Joking? Oh I don't know ramit. If you achieved those numbers (source: www.pullingnumbersfrommyarse.com) then we'd have some profits on Martin and huddlestone ledley and bryson. Pretty neutral on vydra jerome. And one mlosses on Johnson anya and butters. But overall not too horrendous? I added up those numbers and got more than the 30 odd million that I thought @ramblur said was the total residual value in the accounts. Need a sharp salesman type tho. With a sharp suit and reassuringly cockernee name......like frank for example ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loweman2 Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab a dab doo Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 Things and Players are worth only as much as anyone is willing to pay for them. Simples Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 6 hours ago, HantsRam said: Oh I don't know ramit. If you achieved those numbers (source: www.pullingnumbersfrommyarse.com) then we'd have some profits on Martin and huddlestone ledley and bryson. Pretty neutral on vydra jerome. And one mlosses on Johnson anya and butters. But overall not too horrendous? I added up those numbers and got more than the 30 odd million that I thought @ramblur said was the total residual value in the accounts. Need a sharp salesman type tho. With a sharp suit and reassuringly cockernee name......like frank for example ? I know it gets confusing, but RV is the figure you're amortising down to ( but you mightn't have got there yet), whereas net book value (carrying value) is total original cost less amortization to date, the figure I'm talking about, and used in P/L calculations. The total carrying value as at 30/6/17 was £42.565m. Since then, the departures of CC & JR probably reduced this by less than a £1m, but let's call it £1.565m, thus leaving £41m. You then have to add on fees for AW, CD, CJ and 2 Toms ( plus agents' fees and League Levy), which takes you well over £50m. If you were to sell for £20m now, the book loss would be over £30m, so I wasn't joking. I reckon this year's amortization will probably be in the £6.5m -£7m range, which would reduce the total carrying value by that amount this year, if no sales in June. However, if you sold the whole lot now, that amortization doesn't happen, but becomes part of the book loss. I start getting a bit worried when I see over £50m for the squad. Unless we get very lucky on sales, somewhere along the line there's going to be a nasty hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inglorius Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 Nick Blackman 1.8 million hahahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MackworthRamIsGod Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 3 hours ago, loweman2 said: I have it when people say that made me laugh out loud because you just know they are talking utter horse poo But that really did make me laugh out loud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenBr Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 19 minutes ago, Inglorius said: Nick Blackman 1.8 million hahahaha I can't believe Blackmans value was the first one that caught your eye. Jacob Butterfield - £2.7 million. I reckon £5 is the best we can do with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagerbob Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 On 25/05/2018 at 08:45, David said: They have pulled the numbers from Transfermarkt.co.uk (MV), Market Value. so wont be realistic at all then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 3 hours ago, Rab a dab doo said: Things and Players are worth only as much as anyone is willing to pay for them. Simples Spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 55 minutes ago, ramblur said: I know it gets confusing, but RV is the figure you're amortising down to ( but you mightn't have got there yet), whereas net book value (carrying value) is total original cost less amortization to date, the figure I'm talking about, and used in P/L calculations. The total carrying value as at 30/6/17 was £42.565m. Since then, the departures of CC & JR probably reduced this by less than a £1m, but let's call it £1.565m, thus leaving £41m. You then have to add on fees for AW, CD, CJ and 2 Toms ( plus agents' fees and League Levy), which takes you well over £50m. If you were to sell for £20m now, the book loss would be over £30m, so I wasn't joking. I reckon this year's amortization will probably be in the £6.5m -£7m range, which would reduce the total carrying value by that amount this year, if no sales in June. However, if you sold the whole lot now, that amortization doesn't happen, but becomes part of the book loss. I start getting a bit worried when I see over £50m for the squad. Unless we get very lucky on sales, somewhere along the line there's going to be a nasty hit. Hmm. I assumed that the RV and carrying value have to both converge to 0 by the end of the contract to avoid hits when you release players. Is that not necessarily the case? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 58 minutes ago, jagerbob said: so wont be realistic at all then. Well, if you take Bradley Johnson as an example, they show his MV to be £4m when we paid £8m for him. Now everyone will say we paid well over the odds, but if we paid it, isn't that the market value? Britt Assombalonga, MV £4.5m when he joined Boro for £15.4m Ollie Watkins, MV £135k when he joined Brentford for £1.8m It's not just unrealistic, it's utter balls, as will any list on the internet or video game that claims to know their value. Makes a story though I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagerbob Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 Surely its based on how much a player commands in wages, how much a club pays them in wages too being factored into it because purely as a value a club would pay to sign them... then that is absolute nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 1 hour ago, HantsRam said: Hmm. I assumed that the RV and carrying value have to both converge to 0 by the end of the contract to avoid hits when you release players. Is that not necessarily the case? Don't think so. I think the idea is that you try and extend the contract of a player you want to keep, probably in the penultimate year of the contract. If the player doesn't play ball you try and sell him before the contract expires, hopefully at a fee near to, or better than, the residual value you'd allocated at that point in time. Obviously, if you don't want a player, you're trying to flog him all the time, again at least around the RV. The problem arises when you can't sell a player, but in that case you should lower the RV to reflect this, thus introducing an impairment (i.e. the amortization charges that would have applied in prior years, had you amortised down to this lower RV from the outset). For what it's worth, this is an extract from the Club's accounts regarding intangibles/ players' regs :- " The costs associated with acquiring players' registrations,inclusive of EFL levies, or extending their contracts, including agent fees, are capitalized and amortised over the period of the respective players' contracts, after consideration of their residual values. Where a contract is renegotiated, the unamortised costs, together with the new costs relating to the contract extension,are amortised over the term of the new contract. Residual values are reviewed by the board on an ongoing basis over the course of the season by reference to active market values. The Company undertakes annual impairment reviews for player registrations." I'll admit there might seem to be a bit of ambiguity there. I once toyed with the idea that at the end of the year, after reviewing RVs, that the annual amortization charge for each player might be the current carrying value minus the current residual value allocated ( in other words, the total carrying values at the end of each year should reflect what you consider the total market value of such registrations to be, at that particular point in time). However, I can see 2 torpedoes speeding towards the hull of that particular theory :- 1) If that were the case, there'd be no need for the last sentence quoted, as there couldn't be any impairments. 2) As the total carrying value of the registrations as at 30/6/17 was over £40m, this theory would put the total market values at this figure (and it might be over £50m at the end of this year). In conclusion, I'll give an example of how I think it works:- You sign a player on a 4 year contract for an all in fee of £12m, and allocate an RV of £4m. The annual amortization would be (£12m -£4m) / 4 = £2m per year. If at the end of year 3 you decide that an RV of £2m better reflects current market value, then if that RV had been applied from the outset, the annual amortization would have been £2.5m, so you apply that figure in the 3rd year. However, because you'd only charged £4m in the 2 prior years, as opposed to £5m, an impairment of £1m also arises, giving a total charge against profits in that 3rd year of £3.5m. Headaches all round- I've already got mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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