Derby are so average

[North East Ram]

We are so drab, it's beyond disappointing. What the hell has happened? I really don't know. 

Can someone please explain why a team that was recently on the brink of promotion, is now just so ruddy tedious and inept?

Is it GR or is there a deeper malaise? For over 2 years the team has not progressed in any way, whether it be players, style or performance. And it's costing Mel a small fortune. If we finish higher than 7th, i'll be amazed. GR's long ball tactics aren't working and will never get us promoted. 

Answers on a postcard etc...

 

[GeneralRam]

As with quite a lot of clubs that spend money needlessly, you become s***.

After the playoff disappointment we just needed a few players and the squad slightly tweaking. We had a real identity, neutrals loved watching us and we did things the right way. Instead Mel got his feet under the table and chucked money at it when he didn't need to. 

This caused us to be like QPR, and like QPR when the s*** journeymen didn't give a rat's arse about the club and it began to falter, the owner tightens the purse strings and you get a squad that doesn't give a s*** and doesn't perform. The owner then realises it doesn't work, he's spunking a ton of cash and tries another way.

We are now in vicious cycle of expectation, disappointment and frustration. When Clough was here, we had no expectation which resulted in him getting time to sort out the mess.

 

[Adslegend]

I feel like it's from going from managers who play quality, attractive and attacking football to more defensive ? ? football. Even a quality footballer will look bad playing ? football (Hughes, Martin, Ince etc.)

[MackworthRamIsGod]

Generalram nailed it really.

We completely messed up spending all the money we did on Weimann, Johnson, Butterfield etc. 

For one transfer window (And one only) we were the bullies of the championship, signing who we wanted from where we wanted.

Only we bought crap for a lot of cash.

It is going to take a few transfer windows and a lot of patience to get us anywhere near a top 6 side, it's just whether we have the patience to watch Rowett football for a couple of years.

[David]

If you look back over the Championship we're not that different to other clubs. 

Slowly worked our way up the table, had a couple of cracks at promotion, didn't make it, now we have to take a couple of steps back to rebuild and go again.

No club consistently finishes top 6 season without going backwards, 6th, 5th, 4th, 3rd, 2nd....never been done.

Sheffield Wednesday 18th, 16th, 13th, 6th, 4th. If they don't finish top 6 this year they have gone backwards, expect Carvalhal to leave and a few of their high earners, drop down a few places to rebuild. 

You can't keep the same side with minor tweaks without going up, your better players want to move on (Hendrick, Hughes, Ince), others want pay rises that unsettles the dressing room as they all want to be top dog. 

Other clubs go from one extreme to the other each season, Reading 7th, 19th, 17th, 3rd, not got off to the best of starts this season, don't be surprised to see another season fighting at the wrong end again.

We're in our 2 steps back phase aka average.

[WhiteHorseRam]

I am just hoping we are average at the end of the season ... don't want to be above average in Div 1

[RoyMac5]

5 hours ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

Only we bought crap for a lot of cash.

It is going to take a few transfer windows and a lot of patience to get us anywhere near a top 6 side, it's just whether we have the patience to watch Rowett football for a couple of years.

I don't think it's necessarily the patience that is the problem it's what we'll have to watch develop while waiting. I mean seriously do we have to watch Pearson MkII, why can't we play attractive football? Is it like having to wear a hair shirt to atone for our overspending sins?

Why can't we find a manager with a 'real' knowledge of how to play football rather than just talk football?!

[GeneralRam]

4 hours ago, David said:

If you look back over the Championship we're not that different to other clubs. 

Slowly worked our way up the table, had a couple of cracks at promotion, didn't make it, now we have to take a couple of steps back to rebuild and go again.

No club consistently finishes top 6 season without going backwards, 6th, 5th, 4th, 3rd, 2nd....never been done.

Sheffield Wednesday 18th, 16th, 13th, 6th, 4th. If they don't finish top 6 this year they have gone backwards, expect Carvalhal to leave and a few of their high earners, drop down a few places to rebuild. 

You can't keep the same side with minor tweaks without going up, your better players want to move on (Hendrick, Hughes, Ince), others want pay rises that unsettles the dressing room as they all want to be top dog. 

Other clubs go from one extreme to the other each season, Reading 7th, 19th, 17th, 3rd, not got off to the best of starts this season, don't be surprised to see another season fighting at the wrong end again.

We're in our 2 steps back phase aka average.

West Brom? Cardiff before their Prem stint?

[David]

1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said:

Why can't we find a manager with a 'real' knowledge of how to play football rather than just talk football?!

Bit harsh, Rowett is a real manager not some chancer that found a lucky ticket in a Christmas cracker, for all the criticism Birmingham fans give him now they were pretty upset when he was sacked, as were a few of the players.

[RoyMac5]

Just now, David said:

... for all the criticism Birmingham fans give him now they were pretty upset when he was sacked, as were a few of the players.

Probably the same percent upset as Derby fans when Clough was sacked?

[David]

Just now, GeneralRam said:

West Brom? Cardiff before their Prem stint?

Cardiff 16th, 11th, 13th, 12th, 7th, 4th, 4th, 6th, 1st. 

West Brom only had 2 consecutive seasons before going up.

[David]

4 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Probably the same percent upset as Derby fans when Clough was sacked?

Can only go by online reactions, must have seen the fallout after Birmingham sacked him, players pretty much downed tools under Zola for whatever reason.

Clough was a weird one, felt like many had just given up hope of promotion, transfer windows rolling round holding hope of a Shaun Barker fee player, never materialised and went back to meh, football, whatever. The minute he is sacked so many were outraged, couldn't believe we could sack him.

Not saying the entire fanbase reacted this way, just memories of that time online.

[RoyMac5]

10 minutes ago, David said:

Can only go by online reactions, must have seen the fallout after Birmingham sacked him, players pretty much downed tools under Zola for whatever reason.

Could that be that Zola's rubbish?  I don't know how Brum were going pre-Rowett but for him to be lauded as he was makes me wonder. I think if we hadn't suffered such a 'long' period of football going nowhere then more would be happy to see GR waste time for longer.

[Sith Happens]

25 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Probably the same percent upset as Derby fans when Clough was sacked?

 

17 minutes ago, David said:

Can only go by online reactions, must have seen the fallout after Birmingham sacked him, players pretty much downed tools under Zola for whatever reason.

Clough was a weird one, felt like many had just given up hope of promotion, transfer windows rolling round holding hope of a Shaun Barker fee player, never materialised and went back to meh, football, whatever. The minute he is sacked so many were outraged, couldn't believe we could sack him.

Not saying the entire fanbase reacted this way, just memories of that time online.

More people were upset with Clough being sacked than any other manager in recent memory, or at least thats the impression i got.

I think despite sometimes the football not being great people recognised that he was slowly building a decent team on limited funds. The mess he took over after Billy and Jewell was incredible, Rowett is in a much more priviledged position than clough ever was. Afterall how many of our other recent managers got sacked and a sizable portion of the crowd give a round of applause for in the following game?

 

[David]

1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said:

Could that be that Zola's rubbish?  I don't know how Brum were going pre-Rowett but for him to be lauded as he was makes me wonder. I think if we hadn't suffered such a 'long' period of football going nowhere then more would be happy to see GR waste time for longer.

Well he's only had 8 games so he's not wasted that much of our time. 

Arrived last season I know but when all play off hopes quickly faded, pretty much admitted he was done with the season, identified the problems and wanted to get to work in the transfer window.

Can't remember many seasons where Derby have started well, the hard done by Clement had a dodgy start, only came alive if you can call it that after the international break. 8 games in we were on 11 points. Win yesterday would have seen us 1 point behind where we were that season after 9. Fine margins.

Wasn't given time enough time remember yet he we are questioning Rowett already. 

Seen this start compared to Pearson's which shows how short memories are, only 5pts better off but 9 games in we were 22nd, W1 D3 L5 and the most shocking stat of all was 3 goals scored. 

[David]

3 minutes ago, Paul71 said:

More people were upset with Clough being sacked than any other manager in recent memory, or at least thats the impression i got.

I think despite sometimes the football not being great people recognised that he was slowly building a decent team on limited funds. The mess he took over after Billy and Jewell was incredible, Rowett is in a much more priviledged position than clough ever was. Afterall how many of our other recent managers got sacked and a sizable portion of the crowd give a round of applause for in the following game?

Yet season on season more fans were staying away, not going to games, so we were content with the slow building but refused to go and watch it. 

Dare I say his surname and the timing of the sacking played a bigger part in the outrage, many believed he deserved better than that and to some extent he did, I can appreciate the job he did whilst not enjoying the football. I look back though and that 4-4 with Ipswich really was the start of a new era and what followed showed what this team was capable of doing right then, not sometime in the future.

If's buts and maybes but I find it hard to believe we would have seen anything remotely like that under Nigel.

[RoyMac5]

2 minutes ago, David said:

Well he's only had 8 games so he's not wasted that much of our time. 

Arrived last season I know but when all play off hopes quickly faded, pretty much admitted he was done with the season, identified the problems and wanted to get to work in the transfer window.

Not impressed with him saying he was done with the season. He's had end of last season to suss out those wanting to work hard and impress with nothing to play for. He also had chance to see our areas of weakness. He had all summer to rectify the main weak areas and in doing so say we were good enough for Top 2.

We've ended up already looking inconsistent and somewhat clueless, there seems to be some disharmony again and we're only eight games in to this season - so plenty of time for a more positive footballing approach from a new manager to start to work in time for Jan window!  

[Sith Happens]

2 minutes ago, David said:

Yet season on season more fans were staying away, not going to games, so we were content with the slow building but refused to go and watch it. 

Dare I say his surname and the timing of the sacking played a bigger part in the outrage, many believed he deserved better than that and to some extent he did, I can appreciate the job he did whilst not enjoying the football. I look back though and that 4-4 with Ipswich really was the start of a new era and what followed showed what this team was capable of doing right then, not sometime in the future.

If's buts and maybes but I find it hard to believe we would have seen anything remotely like that under Nigel.

Yeah I get all of that I was just pointing out that a lot of people were upset.

[GeneralRam]

35 minutes ago, David said:

Can only go by online reactions, must have seen the fallout after Birmingham sacked him, players pretty much downed tools under Zola for whatever reason.

Clough was a weird one, felt like many had just given up hope of promotion, transfer windows rolling round holding hope of a Shaun Barker fee player, never materialised and went back to meh, football, whatever. The minute he is sacked so many were outraged, couldn't believe we could sack him.

Not saying the entire fanbase reacted this way, just memories of that time online.

The thing that got me was that we were improving every season. It might have been slow, it might have been underwhelming but the bloke took 10 years to get Burton where they are now and it's entirely down to him they got there in the first place.

Build the team too quickly and you get a Jenga tower where one block goes it comes crashing down. If the foundations are built slow and the block goes, the tower stays.

[David]

1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said:

Not impressed with him saying he was done with the season. He's had end of last season to suss out those wanting to work hard and impress with nothing to play for. He also had chance to see our areas of weakness. He had all summer to rectify the main weak areas and in doing so say we were good enough for Top 2.

We've ended up already looking inconsistent and somewhat clueless, there seems to be some disharmony again and we're only eight games in to this season - so plenty of time for a more positive footballing approach from a new manager to start to work in time for Jan window!  

Comes back to the believing it's easy to move players on, maybe he has sussed out those players but was unable to move them on?

You can't keep signing without selling, nor can we free transfer them, pay them off.