Bristol City v Derby County

[GenBr]

3 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Fair points but I would hardly say he's had to work to some stringent budget.

The income from Hughes and Ince gave him sufficient funds to strengthen the squad.

Time will tell if he's managed it or not.

If he's doesn't manage I personally don't think he will have the budget to hide behind, in terms of transfer fees and wages he has luxuries that many in this division would dream of.

You assume that he had all the funds from the Ince and Hughes sales as part of his transfer budget. Whilst I don't know the intricacies of the situation my understanding is we had to sell due to FFP constraints - if that was the case then Rowett certainly wouldn't have had all that money for transfers.

Let's be honest though money isn't everything - Cardiff spent roughly £4 mill this year and still look miles ahead of us at the moment. Shef utd only spent a couple of million and still battered us. 

[NottsRam77]

Stuck in f and b in brizzle waiting for food with the little one and mrs so thought id give my two penneth

went today...

quite simply we were beaten by the better side.

out manoevered and at times out classed

watching it i was thinking to myself this bristol side is probably in terms of style the sort of thing that rowett is trying to move us towards

Raw power and pace up top , graft and mobility in midfield and then plenty of pace and trickery on the flanks - leko absolutely destroyed us all afternoon, was simply excellent, all held together by a couple of no nonesense centre halves at the back

is it lee johnson there in charge? Done a very good job.... but it hasnt happend overnight has it.

rowett needs time and a window or two where he isnt hamstrung by having to move players out to bring others in.

i read somewhere this summer 10 players are out of contract ... thats when i expect to see big changes

[Millenniumram]

4 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

You need to read the ops original post and get some context..he suggested we needed a forward who could hold the ball up...hence my reply.

 

And your point is, that's exactly what I was commenting on! Right now holding the ball up ain't the problem, it's getting the bloody thing! Wasn't just a comment at you, also at the post you replied to. Nugent ain't bad at holding the ball up if the midfield ain't static and the striker behind him isn't injured. Mind you given the result martin will start next game, so let's hope we actually get the ball for him to use!

[RoyMac5]

6 minutes ago, rammieib said:

He can't coach it. Players ignored his boot it long tactic at times v Hull and we scored.

The club is a mess but has been for years. Migrates into different stages of mess. We now lack identity in style, a confusion of footballers and long ball style.

A manager who said anything but Autos is the requirement yet has only won 2 from 9 away games (An awful Bolton and a 90th minute Ince winner against a shocking Birmingham team). Play anyone half decent and we don't stand a chance as Rowett is inept.

This is what worries me. I can't see where we're going at the minute either...

[Abu Dhabi Ram]

3 minutes ago, Leicester Ram said:

The Keogh haters are doing my nut in today.

The whole club has been a shambles for f****** years now. We change managers twice a season, we sign players that don't suit each other's styles, we've completely f****** the wage structure and we've had to sell our best players.

Yet Keogh, who has been our most consistent player for 5 years now, being 'error prone', is what's holding us back. None of those other factors, ignore them, they'll sort themselves out.

Are you serious?

ONE BLOKE. ONE CENTRE-BACK. THAT'S ALL THAT NEEDS CHANGING TO GET US INTO THE PL APPARENTLY. IT'S THAT EASY! 

Just replace Keogh and suddenly Bradley Johnson will become a classy playmaker. Tom Huddlestone will inherit the pace of N'Golo Kante. Our wage bill will suddenly become manageable and we'll have room for more signings. 

He's a really good CB! That's what I don't get. If you were talking about a poor full-back we were carrying then I'd sort of understand your point. But you're saying one of the league's best CB is the issue because he's not the right type of best CB in the league?

'We wont go anywhere with Keogh in the side'- well, sorry to break it to you but he was the heart and soul of the Steve McClaren teams that actually deserved to get promoted out this league.

I feel sorry for anyone who can't wrap their minds around the concept that not every problem can be solved by changing just one thing. Life isn't that easy, football isn't that easy. Hope none of you run a business because god help your employees.

I'm sorry, but today I watched a player who I rate highly and have never been critical of before perform very poorly. In the first five minutes he nearly set up a goal with a miss timed header under very little pressure. He dived in when he didn't need to at 1-1 and he appeared erratic throughout. His nervousness seemed to spread to other defenders. I think describing his performance today as error prone is fair. I am not saying we drop him or anything, but it did make me think the people who are critical have a point. Did you watch the game? How did you think he played?

I agree that the problems are far greater than just Keogh, the past four years is littered with some awful decisions which will take a while to solve. We have gone backwards since 2013/14. 

[rammieib]

1 hour ago, Wolfie20 said:

No it doesn't - it depends on if Mel thinks he's good enough and I sincerely hope he realises that there has to come a point when he gives the manager sufficient time to be able to carry out an assessment of whether that manager can take the club forward. I'm not saying Rowett fits the bill but six months is nowhere enough to make that decision, despite some of the hysterical posts on here - posters who would be the first to criticise the Rams as an embarrassing, sacking club should he get the bullet sooner rather than later.

For us to express opinions on here it depends on our views. If Rowett has a Job depends on Mel.

I sit in the court that I'd never have got rid of Clement. The appointments since then have seen the football go steadily down hill. I don't see that changing with Rowett and haven't done since day one. I think Morris sees good football (passing, vision, creativity etc) as the Derby way but Pearson and Rowett contradict it.

I wasn't there today but reading comments, Mac got the sack after losing badly at Brigjton and you could argue today is even worse. Do you think we are in a better position than the day GR took over? I think we are worse and although I don't see any brilliant teams in the Champ, I see improvements in a lot of average teams. (Wolves, Bristol City, Cardiff etc). We're dropping down.

Fully get and understand the need to give a manager time and support him through multiple windows. However since I never supported Rowetts appointment from the get go, I wouldn't be upset if Mels short leish struck again.

[Angry Ram]

26 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Just for anyone arguing the not resting players/momentum point about Tuesday, I am currently watching Barnsley losing 3-0 at home to Aston Villa.

Did our first eleven need the game time? We are notoriously inconsistent, would we have benefited from another 90 mins playing together. 

Todays result is not down to Tuesday, but the players dont need resting at this stage. Todays result was about our fragility throughout, on and off the pitch. I know you don't agree with @EastHertsRam but he has a point. Just what Tuesday achieved I struggle with. Giving players a run out when they wont be used much in the near future.. Hmm.  Momentum is an issue, same 11 or not. We had an opportunity to build on Hull and create a feel good factor. Rowett decided that was not important. I dont agree but he is the manager and not me. But he is backing himself into a corner every time.

GR is making some basic errors and that is fine if he is learning from them but he does not seem to. I worry about his ability to change things when a system is struggling in a game. Wolves high wing backs, Sheff U etc.

I think 99% of us want him to succeed but he needs to up his game. 

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

5 minutes ago, Millenniumram said:

And your point is, that's exactly what I was commenting on! Right now holding the ball up ain't the problem, it's getting the bloody thing! Wasn't just a comment at you, also at the post you replied to. Nugent ain't bad at holding the ball up if the midfield ain't static and the striker behind him isn't injured. Mind you given the result martin will start next game, so let's hope we actually get the ball for him to use!

Fair comments...I like Nugent as well to be fair...but both need a agile quick thinking midfield to prosper.

[Birdyabroad]

I rarely post on here, but it's glaringly obvious that we've become an 'old team' overnight.

Even the bench today, in which you might expect a few 'younguns', was filled with older pro's - there were no legs that could come on and cover the turf.

I'm not one for just chucking the U23's into the fray, but maybe the only option now is to use one of Bird/Guy/Babos to sit in there and run their arse of to support Huddlestone.

We need some younger legs in the middle, in front of an ageing defence - I'm sure Rowett can see it???

[Millenniumram]

1 minute ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

Fair comments...I like Nugent as well to be fair...but both need a agile quick thinking midfield to prosper.

It's the balance of the midfield imo that's the biggest problem. Huddlestone can spray the ball around but he needs someone with a bit of bite next to him, and we don't have that. Should have been the absolute priority signing that imo, it's been a problem for years yet never gets sorted. Winnall should have come on earlier today as well, seems like that knock completely broke vydra as an outlet.

[Angry Ram]

19 minutes ago, rammieib said:

He can't coach it. Players ignored his boot it long tactic at times v Hull and we scored.

The club is a mess but has been for years. Migrates into different stages of mess. We now lack identity in style, a confusion of footballers and long ball style.

A manager who said anything but Autos is the requirement yet has only won 2 from 9 away games (An awful Bolton and a 90th minute Ince winner against a shocking Birmingham team). Play anyone half decent and we don't stand a chance as Rowett is inept.

Agree but if not Rowett who? Morris has created this mess with his constant changing. Rowett plays a certain way, it does not suit our players at the moment so we have to give him time. I dont like the style but if it is this years 'Derby Way' then we have to go with it.. 

Very frustrating but hopefully just transition. We need stability on and off the pitch.

[RoyMac5]

5 minutes ago, Angry Ram said:

Did our first eleven need the game time? We are notoriously inconsistent, would we have benefited from another 90 mins playing together. 

Why, GR didn't see the importance of them playing together preseason. What did today's centre halves get, one match?

[Mistaram]

24 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Were we actually any good in the 1st half, just leading is what I've heard. Plus the players should look at GR, he sent them out.

Roy I've been to the match and no we were not any good in the first half apart from first 10 minutes Lucky to go in one up but being out played for long spells Were Rowett was wrong ( and I'm a Rowett fan ) is not changing anything in midfield at half time because they were running through us at will I appreciate he's very limited in midfield but I would have switch Baird there brought Wisdom on and taken either Weiman or Lawrence off  Hindsights a wonderful thing though 

[GenBr]

8 minutes ago, NottsRam77 said:

Stuck in f and b in brizzle waiting for food with the little one and mrs so thought id give my two penneth

went today...

quite simply we were beaten by the better side.

out manoevered and at times out classed

watching it i was thinking to myself this bristol side is probably in terms of style the sort of thing that rowett is trying to move us towards

Raw power and pace up top , graft and mobility in midfield and then plenty of pace and trickery on the flanks - leko absolutely destroyed us all afternoon, was simply excellent, all held together by a couple of no nonesense centre halves at the back

is it lee johnson there in charge? Done a very good job.... but it hasnt happend overnight has it.

rowett needs time and a window or two where he isnt hamstrung by having to move players out to bring others in.

i read somewhere this summer 10 players are out of contract ... thats when i expect to see big changes

Shackell, Bent, Thorne, Russell, Forsyth, Pearce, Baird, Bennett, Hanson, Roos apparently have expiring contracts next year. Of those the only one I am really bothered about keeping is Thorne (as long as his legs don't shatter into a thousand pieces again). Imagine the wages we are going to free up if those guys all leave at the end of the season - should allow Rowett a bit more room to maneuver in the transfer market.  

[G STAR RAM]

5 minutes ago, Angry Ram said:

Did our first eleven need the game time? We are notoriously inconsistent, would we have benefited from another 90 mins playing together. 

Todays result is not down to Tuesday, but the players dont need resting at this stage. Todays result was about our fragility throughout, on and off the pitch. I know you don't agree with @EastHertsRam but he has a point. Just what Tuesday achieved I struggle with. Giving players a run out when they wont be used much in the near future.. Hmm.  Momentum is an issue, same 11 or not. We had an opportunity to build on Hull and create a feel good factor. Rowett decided that was not important. I dont agree but he is the manager and not me. But he is backing himself into a corner every time.

GR is making some basic errors and that is fine if he is learning from them but he does not seem to. I worry about his ability to change things when a system is struggling in a game. Wolves high wing backs, Sheff U etc.

I think 99% of us want him to succeed but he needs to up his game. 

Only the manager and players know whether they need resting or not.

The ground they covered against Hull may have been a factor. Not seen any stats but the pressing we did that night is something I've not seen from us before.

On the momentum point we had won one game. As I say Barnsley beat us Tuesday and got spanked today, against a Villa team that has been struggling, what happened to their momemtum. Too often we, as fans, have a bad habit of just completely disregarding our opponent and taking them out of the equation. 

I will certainly agree with the feel good factor point but what guarantee of a victory was there with the same XI that started today? I'm now reading that this starting XI is fragile and shouldn't be starting away games?

Make no mistake our results are worrying but I'm more interested in seeing what Rowett does to stop these happening, only then will we know if we have the right man for the job.

[ramblur]

Don't really know where to start with this ,but one of my favourite tracks (having ditched sky) is what about us . Apologies if much of this is 'what about me',because that is what much of this post is goiing to talk about to me.

Before I forget about it (and you;ll later undferstand,I hope why I said it early dooors), this team could easily have been turned over by a Barnsley team with good movement. Easily (worryingly).

Now we'll get onto 'all about me'. I actually thought Gary made the right call about Barnsley,but only if the attitude was right about Bristol.I played a lot of amateur sports,but always recognised that I didn't have massive talent (and I may have been underestimating myself a tad here),but I realised I had to scrap damn hard to get anything (which included beating current Derbsyhire champions and top players,but funnily enough,I allways remembered the games when I wasn't up to it  and remembered  the games I lost to players I should have  beaten easily-I invariably remembered it and gave them a sound thrashing in the return fixtures-which came nowhere near to eradicating the pain and the bad attitude of the earlier fixture.

So where does all of this equate to what I heard today? The first thing I'd say (and I absolutelyhate picking on individuals), is that I was surprised that Gary signed Tom (reminds me a bit of Peter Taylor signing Robertson- horse before the cart),because he's great attributes,but needs to be with the right partner (can we afford such a luxury?)

Unfortunately,Bradders got injured early doors,so it's very difficult to judge what impact he had on our game.George was a sub,but he wasn't going to provide movement off the ball(not his fault),just more of the same. I listened intently to what Gary had to say post Barnsley- Bird had more composure on the ball than Callum-fair comment and everyone could probably see this.But what about the things that Callum could bring to the game? (like heart,desire.the willingness to do the 'dirtier' aspects of the game).Personaly I think we missed a trick here-we needed something different on the bench)

Again,on a personal note,I was feeling pretty dreadful before the game,and I tucked into  glass of red before the game,thinking this could go two ways.With the full bottle having disappeared during the game (and now into well into my second bottle) I wonder  how these highly paid professionals can't display an ounce of the passion we fans can muster? I can remember other managers coming up with comment s like 'I can't understand it' after poor starts etc. I don't often agree with @Troy DyerI, but I think he's spot on-the culture needs to change.We've changed the personell,but the culture still remains.Is the training complex too cushy,could we do with a bit more 'Cold Blow Lane',,I just don't know.

Sorry to be so hard hitting,I'm not usually this way.That performance has sickened me to the pits,and I didn't need Gary to come on saying we should have done this,we should have done that. I stopped listening/reading players interviews a long time ago-they can do all their talking on the pitch (where they've been far more articulate). In Gary's defence,I can see why he was so gutted to lose out on 'Keith'. I looked at him and there isn't an ounce of fat on the guy,and he looked very athletic.

This post has taken me ages,because I'm so pi**ed I've had to correct everything every second.Does anyone agree with me,or should I lay off the booze? I don't know,but nobody can ever take away the passion I've felt for this club over decades.I'm so sick of these players now.Does anyone agree with me,or is it purely the booze talking?

I make no apologies for congratulating the Brewers on their performance.Not a 'Clough' thing,more an appreciation of their cutting a far superior side down to size through sheer hard work.God,I'm sorry,I feel so mad,it's unbelievable.

[SKRam]

47 minutes ago, BurtonRam7 said:

**** game, **** performance., **** result. Good day. I'm drunk and pulling so happy days. We all love Derby ******* County. We are the rams. We go again. COYR.

I'm heading out now to drown sorrows pity I'm not heading out to celebrate but after six pints (only six doc honest) I won't be too concerned so I'll toast you Burton for beating me to it.... As for pulling erm the night is young 

[Rev]

52 minutes ago, BurtonRam7 said:

**** game, **** performance., **** result. Good day. I'm drunk and pulling so happy days. We all love Derby ******* County. We are the rams. We go again. COYR.

Wanking and typing, oh to be young again.

[PistoldPete2]

Well what a very disappointing day. Many reasons for concern. 

Our away way form is very poor... That's two horror shows in the last two away league games.

its also three defeats in four games . We've conceded 10 goals in those games... Scored 8. Really if you score two goals per game, you don't expect to lose three out of four.

last two games we were winning at half time ... But lost both times. Fitness problems?  Even though most of the team were rested in midweek.

last two league games we played the same starting eleven. And used the same three subs with the same three players taken off. But in very circumstances . We really need to have a plan B for away games, or if things aren't going our way.  But we don't. 

We we don't seem to have much in midfield, which is why we concede so much possession. At half time, 1-0 up but conceding too much possession we should look to get a grip of midfield. Not a chance when you only have two players in midfield. 

[Yani P]

All we can do is carry on and hope thing improve,

At the moment the club smacks of a directionless mess and that is very very disappointing. So much of the foundations built 2-3-4 years ago have been smashed to pieces..I can only see us spending time getting it back on track - might take 3-4 years who knows. We nearly made it with Macs first stint when we blew the play-off final after totally dominating....but we didn't....I was full of hope when Mel claimed he had a 5 year vision and brought in a brilliant new young managerial talent in Clement - we got to top of the table we were still top 5 when for some madness that only Mel will ever know he got sacked...lets be honest since then the wheels have been off and we are now reaping what was sown from those decisions that Mel made...we are bang average..and we still appear to have no bottle whatsoever..we have sold our flair players and not really looked any better.

I really hope we can turn it around this season but very unlikely with this squad and organisational set-up..