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Thameram

Time for 3 at the back

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Not for me. It wouldn't have changed much at the weekend, would have been pushed to a back 6 and had really isolated attackers.

As a formation you'd need a totally different right wing back, 2 new centre mids and Lawrence, Wisdom and Huddlestone would be pretty much redundant or stuck out of position.

Just like the off field situation we need stability on it to build ourselves back up. Consistent line up, formation and style only tweaked in the second half to meet our needs if necessary.

Once we have that we will see progression, but not until. Swapping everything around on a weekly basis smacks of desperation and is what you'd expect from a relegation bound team that is devoid of ideas, not one in it's infancy.

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9 hours ago, RiddingsRam said:

Disagree , I think we can tick at least 2 of the boxes and half tick the time box , we've got as much time as anyone else would have.

Please elaborate...

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My version of this

Carson

Wisdom Davies Forsyth

Huddlestone

Anya Thorne Butterfield Russell

Martin Vydra

Huddlestone to drop in as required

Width, Pace the ability to hold up and pass in the front 6

Just need to find goals then :)

 

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3 hours ago, Jourdan said:

Please elaborate...

Well you said we haven't got a good coach to implement this system. Didn't Rowett play a 3 at Burton and again at Birmingham not always I know but he played it. Secondly you said we haven't got the players again we have, Wisdom Keogh Davies would be perfect then you have Shackell and Pearce for back up. Anya would be perfect for the right wing back role and as daft as you initially may think I believe Russell could easily be converted to a wing back again on the other side loads of options. Thirdly the time as I stated we would have as much time as everyone else but it would have been an idea to work on it over the summer.

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Just need to stop this 'adapting game by game' stuff and create an identity and a style that our player understand so well that our opposition change their formation to counter us and not the other way round. 

Altering formation game by game isnt the best way to get out of this division. 

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4 hours ago, RiddingsRam said:

Well you said we haven't got a good coach to implement this system. Didn't Rowett play a 3 at Burton and again at Birmingham not always I know but he played it. Secondly you said we haven't got the players again we have, Wisdom Keogh Davies would be perfect then you have Shackell and Pearce for back up. Anya would be perfect for the right wing back role and as daft as you initially may think I believe Russell could easily be converted to a wing back again on the other side loads of options. Thirdly the time as I stated we would have as much time as everyone else but it would have been an idea to work on it over the summer.

Honestly I didn't make a habit of watching Burton and Birmingham when Rowett was at either club, so I can't comment. But it doesn't strike me as a system that a lot of managers could successfully employ at our level, as it's not ingrained in our footballing culture as such.

How many teams have successfully used it in our division in recent years? Of course right now, it's en vogue. But the reason why it has worked so well for Chelsea is because they have a higher calibre of coach, the coach with the required principles to implement it, the coach who commands enough respect for the players to buy into it, and a higher calibre of player to make it workable.

And like you said, you need a whole summer to perfect it. That's probably what Nuno did at Wolves. We only have an international break.

I don't hold out much hope, to be honest. After all, wasn't it suggested that our players effectively downed tools under Pearson because he wanted to play and persisted with 4-4-2? And this was after a whole pre-season of trying to implement it.

If we still had Christie, Hendrick, Ince, and Thorne and Forsyth were fit and firing, I'd agree that we could try it. Russell's natural position is a striker (which he never plays in) and he is constantly panned for his contribution (or lack of) as a winger, his confidence is surely completely shattered at this point. It would be otherworldly man-management by Rowett to turn him into an effective wing back.

With the squad as it is, we'd probably not do the system any justice and look a complete shambles like Arsenal.

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12 hours ago, Jourdan said:

Honestly I didn't make a habit of watching Burton and Birmingham when Rowett was at either club, so I can't comment. But it doesn't strike me as a system that a lot of managers could successfully employ at our level, as it's not ingrained in our footballing culture as such.

How many teams have successfully used it in our division in recent years? Of course right now, it's en vogue. But the reason why it has worked so well for Chelsea is because they have a higher calibre of coach, the coach with the required principles to implement it, the coach who commands enough respect for the players to buy into it, and a higher calibre of player to make it workable.

And like you said, you need a whole summer to perfect it. That's probably what Nuno did at Wolves. We only have an international break.

I don't hold out much hope, to be honest. After all, wasn't it suggested that our players effectively downed tools under Pearson because he wanted to play and persisted with 4-4-2? And this was after a whole pre-season of trying to implement it.

If we still had Christie, Hendrick, Ince, and Thorne and Forsyth were fit and firing, I'd agree that we could try it. Russell's natural position is a striker (which he never plays in) and he is constantly panned for his contribution (or lack of) as a winger, his confidence is surely completely shattered at this point. It would be otherworldly man-management by Rowett to turn him into an effective wing back.

With the squad as it is, we'd probably not do the system any justice and look a complete shambles like Arsenal.

You make the pointy about not being ingrained in our football culture , then later claim the players downed tools at the thought of playing 4 4 2 ( the stereotypical English formation ). Just because Contes Italian , does that make him any more qualified to coach 3 at the back ? He used to play a 4 Juventus from time to time and when he started at Chelsea. 

On Russell , granted he was signed as a striker but do you think it's his natural position? Sometimes you have to look beyond the obvious , referring back to Chelsea would you ever have thought Victor Moses had the potential to be a wing back ?

Again disagree with the Arsenal comment there back 3 for a start is plain to see to all it would struggle in this league. Wisdom Keogh Davies would complement each other perfectly don't you think ? The only position that would worry me in this system would be the central midfield but that worries me in any system ! 

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