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Is Rowett up to the job


ramma

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59 minutes ago, Charlie G said:

Football is about opinions and at the start of the season I was all for GR getting some time. However he was the one who stated he was a couple of players away from the top two. All can see from the season so far is we are a mile off. He has let good footballers go without getting in his type of players. He's had all summer to do this so he is to blame. 

If I could just see a little progress I wouldn't be so harsh but there is none to find.

In my eyes the players replicate on a pitch the managers philosophy and currently all I see on the pitch is confusion.

 

correct, Sir. I recall at this point the late Graham Taylor's (RIP) "explanation" to a bemused Nigel Clough, to "thread the ball to "Wrighty" ...as shown in "Do I not like that" which is apposite here somehow. 

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49 minutes ago, EastHertsRam said:

Not looking for an argument or anything but why wait til the very last knockings to do the deal then ? It seems symptomatic of Rowett's tenure, "Do I really want him" ? "Shall I try for better" ? "Nah, eff it, he'll do, I'll get on the Internet and get it done"

He was only in Holland for goodness sake, if Rowett phoned him at 9 in the morning and said get yourself over here son, he could have been at the ground by 6 at the latest and done the necessary properly.

That's how I see it anyway.

 

45 minutes ago, HantsRam said:

But didn't we only move for him very late in the window,  once a number of attempts to sign Davies fell through?

And after considerable effort and focus was expended on getting lawrence over the line.

We had signed huddlestone early so presumably Gary had clear line of sight as to what complementary skills would be needed in midfield. To then limit your efforts to getting in a couple of brum players- one of whom doesn't make their bench - strikes me as very careless at best.

By extension,  if that issue has been created and allowed to persist without remedy, I  don't see why there should be a lot of expressed optimism that another couple of windows will sort us out.

You can imagine a scenario in which 2 more windows leaves us worse off than now!

Don't think Rowett has hidden the fact it's been a difficult window, buying a player can be like buying a house when you're in a chain, having to wait for clubs ahead of you to move.

Move on to the next target? Maybe, guess it depends how many players you have placed on your shortlist, how many of those are simply unavailable or a similar situation.

Not helped by the difficulties of moving players on, I'm going to bet that had Ipswich took Shackell, Bryson would have stayed. His comments after the window closing were that one was moved so we could get this which went tits up.

If either of you saw the Bleacher Report which had a reporter spent deadline day with Chris Wilder, was a bit in there about Birmingham messing around with the price of Clayton Donaldson, not saying they messed us around with Keith but just shows how difficult it can be.

I'd bet both balls Rowett would have wanted all ins and outs done by the first game of the season which might be a thing next year, EFL clubs were in favour of closing the window early.

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4 minutes ago, ramsbottom said:

It’s strange to have you as the voice of reason... ?

When am I not the voice of reason. 

Rowett needs some respect for taking such a difficult job at DCFC. 

He will get it right after a few mistakes along the line. 

Mel needs to sit easy and back him IMO 

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I don't think I want Rowett gone, all I know is I've never been so disinterested in Derby County. I don't know why that is, I just feel resigned to losing games and being bored. Like people have said, it'd just be nice to have a distinct style and see what we're doing on the pitch.

I know it's a rebuild job and it'll take time but we've got to start seeing some flashes of an on field style of play. 

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45 minutes ago, Anag Ram said:

I think we all know we didn't get the transfer window we had hoped.

There were plenty who wanted Bryson and Butterfield gone. However, what we needed was two more dynamic, young replacements who could drive the side forward. We lost out on Kieftenbeld at the last minute and then had to settle for Ledley. We are left with a group of players competing for the same position not a group who complement each other.

If we persist with 4-2-3-1 then we can't have the 3 as atackers unless they are so brilliant they are ripping sides apart. I don't think anyone believes we have those three. 

We are basically playing 4-2-4 every week with an ineffective front line and an overrun midfield two. 

With the current squad we can go one of two ways. Pick a side which is tough to beat but dull to watch with a midfield three of perhaps Johnson, Ledley and Huddlestone holding a solid and static middle (Vydra, Lawrence and Winnall picking up crumbs upfront?) or keep the current system and have results like Hull and Bristol City.

 

 

Absolutely Sir! If we persist, we will slip unequivocally down the greasy pole...We were 5 points off top a week and a half ago...now it's 9....what after Tuesday?

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2 minutes ago, David said:

 

Don't think Rowett has hidden the fact it's been a difficult window, buying a player can be like buying a house when you're in a chain, having to wait for clubs ahead of you to move.

Move on to the next target? Maybe, guess it depends how many players you have placed on your shortlist, how many of those are simply unavailable or a similar situation.

Not helped by the difficulties of moving players on, I'm going to bet that had Ipswich took Shackell, Bryson would have stayed. His comments after the window closing were that one was moved so we could get this which went tits up.

If either of you saw the Bleacher Report which had a reporter spent deadline day with Chris Wilder, was a bit in there about Birmingham messing around with the price of Clayton Donaldson, not saying they messed us around with Keith but just shows how difficult it can be.

I'd bet both balls Rowett would have wanted all ins and outs done by the first game of the season which might be a thing next year, EFL clubs were in favour of closing the window early.

Exactly, whats Rowett supposed to do if clubs dont actuallly want the players he needs to get rid of? We cant just keep buying and buying. Most of us wouldnt have wanted Hughes or Ince to go but to generate funds to buy new players it was probably unavoidable.

If clubs had come in for the players we wanted to offload one or both of them may still be here.

Rowett is really dealing with a situation of us making poor moves in the transfer market, maybe at the time they seemed like the right move but they didnt work out.

We absolutely need stability and provided we dont sink into a relegation position we should not be looking to change, changing managers is what has got us in the position we are in.

I just hope Mel learns from his mistakes and sticks with Rowett, the rebuilding will not take aslong as it did under Clough as we do have more funds available. People are slamming Rowett for saying his aims where promotion, but whats the point of competing if thats not your aim.

People look back on Jim Smiths tenure as mostly positive but at this stage we were looking far more like relegation fodder than we do today, he was fortunate he didnt have a transfer window to stick to or we may well not have got promoted that season.

If the forum was going then there would be a thread entitled 'is smith upto the job'.

I do feel there is more to come from this team, some steel in midfield will definately help and we have two very good players waiting for their chance who will definately do a job.

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46 minutes ago, Ellafella said:

Absolutely. 

"I was going to bring Martin on at H-T" said GR post match.

yes, the mind boggles...Ledley who is the next card to play, needs game time. He would have lifted PP...

hindsight is easy but it was the logical thing to do. 

Probably my main gripe over yesterday, I can handle a draw, doesn't bother me who we should be seen to be beating, this is the Championship.

It must be hard to find a Derby fan that doesn't believe our weakness right now is midfield, to address that with a short term deal for Ledley which will add some legs to midfield, and then given him no minutes on the pitch I just don't get it.

Would never have started him, not a chance, but 30 minutes, even 20 to get him back out on the pitch in a game which was pretty drab. 

2 more games until the international break, the first one back being Forest.

Would like to see him given 30 minutes on Tuesday, then look to start him v Cardiff. 

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38 minutes ago, NottsRam77 said:

Did wolves want him? Did they put an actual offer on the table or was it just alledged ITKs  trying to look clever   tabloids trying sell papers

we dont actually know do we, 

it seems so obvious doesnt it, do u not think that if there was something on the table it might have happend??

we dont and will never know, my guess is that there was no offer? Otherwise why would we gamble on letting brsyon go.... but like u im totally guessing 

 

I think they were interested until their change of manager. Don't know that for sure but their interest cooling did seem to coincide with their managerial change.

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Yesterday the one thing that did work was the subs.

i'm sure if we had the option of more substitutions then johnson would have been off for Ledley, as he was very poor. 

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2 hours ago, NottsRam77 said:

if u have one bad game it doesnt mean your automatically bombed out of the squad, he'll have won a lot of respect within the dressing room with that and perhaps at a club where some people have suggested weve had a problem with player power might not be a terrible thing, it should also give players the confidence to go out and try and express themselves knowing if the they do c*** up their not straight out of the side again.

What about the changes after the Wolves game? He changed quite a few players and the formation. After the 2 last away games the only changes we have seen is Baird in for the ill Wisdom and Lawrence in for Russell. Was the Wolves performance worse than the Sheffield Utd or Bristol City performances? After Sheff Utd he said there were going to be a few changes and he made 1 through choice and 1 enforced, after Bristol City he said there would have to be changes and he made 0, he said we were going to sign young, athletic players with pace, power and desire then we have signed Huddlestone, Ledley and Davies. It just seems like he says one thing then does another. At the silk mill forum he said he likes his teams to press high and the only example we have seen is Fulham last season (mainly Nugent on his own) and Hull.

Wow that went on longer than what I intended :lol:

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20 minutes ago, David said:

Probably my main gripe over yesterday, I can handle a draw, doesn't bother me who we should be seen to be beating, this is the Championship.

It must be hard to find a Derby fan that doesn't believe our weakness right now is midfield, to address that with a short term deal for Ledley which will add some legs to midfield, and then given him no minutes on the pitch I just don't get it.

Would never have started him, not a chance, but 30 minutes, even 20 to get him back out on the pitch in a game which was pretty drab. 

2 more games until the international break, the first one back being Forest.

Would like to see him given 30 minutes on Tuesday, then look to start him v Cardiff. 

All very logical...and the correct thing to do. Take the initiative, get B'ham on the back foot. Instead we persisted with a rag-bag of a match and yet we were the home side, and then we were 0-1 down and so it's all hands to the pumps...

Some leaders walk the walk and talk the talk...some just talk the talk...

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2 hours ago, Wignall12 said:

Have  you forgotten that those loaned/sold "best" players have gotten us nowhere over the past few seasons ?

When rebuilding you start with the weakest link and progress from there, not the strongest and hope that it is going to be as strong.

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31 minutes ago, Paul71 said:

Exactly, whats Rowett supposed to do if clubs dont actuallly want the players he needs to get rid of? We cant just keep buying and buying. Most of us wouldnt have wanted Hughes or Ince to go but to generate funds to buy new players it was probably unavoidable.

If clubs had come in for the players we wanted to offload one or both of them may still be here.

Rowett is really dealing with a situation of us making poor moves in the transfer market, maybe at the time they seemed like the right move but they didnt work out.

We absolutely need stability and provided we dont sink into a relegation position we should not be looking to change, changing managers is what has got us in the position we are in.

I just hope Mel learns from his mistakes and sticks with Rowett, the rebuilding will not take aslong as it did under Clough as we do have more funds available. People are slamming Rowett for saying his aims where promotion, but whats the point of competing if thats not your aim.

People look back on Jim Smiths tenure as mostly positive but at this stage we were looking far more like relegation fodder than we do today, he was fortunate he didnt have a transfer window to stick to or we may well not have got promoted that season.

If the forum was going then there would be a thread entitled 'is smith upto the job'.

I do feel there is more to come from this team, some steel in midfield will definately help and we have two very good players waiting for their chance who will definately do a job.

Great post someone who has took the trouble look to the future  Rowett is taking the flack for past signings he's obviously having to play players he doesn't want to He came out yesterday and said January will be very busy for the club Its obvious Shackel Russell and probably Forsyth have no future at the club 

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8 minutes ago, rynny said:

When rebuilding you start with the weakest link and progress from there, not the strongest and hope that it is going to be as strong.

No when you rebuild you need to generate cash to be able to do it Hence the only assets we had Ince Hughes Christy had to go 

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1 minute ago, Mistaram said:

Great post someone who has took the trouble look to the future  Rowett is taking the flack for past signings he's obviously having to play players he doesn't want to He came out yesterday and said January will be very busy for the club Its obvious Shackel Russell and probably Forsyth have no future at the club 

I think Forsyth has a future, needs to be fit hes had two seasons out but still think hes the better of our two main left backs.

Would still like Russell to stay but not sure after yesterdays comments.

Shackell I agree seems like he has no future.

I think he will still be restricted as some of our players are out only on loan so we might even have to wait until next seasons window.

I would rather him do that than us spend over the top on panic buys in January. If we are hovering around mid table unless the absolute right player comes along then leave it.

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5 minutes ago, Mistaram said:

No when you rebuild you need to generate cash to be able to do it Hence the only assets we had Ince Hughes Christy had to go 

So no other player could generate any money what so ever? Ffs we got £2.5m for Christie and replaced him with a better player for the same initial cost. We could have picked up fees for other players also. We did not beed to sell 2 of our best players, in the same window, especially so early.

Also how are you to improve if you keep the same weak links? No point changing the better players as the same problems are going to exist.

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