Robram Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 ...................................................................................and back to view from the outside . This taken from a cardiff fanzine is an interesting read "I’ve mentioned before on here that 0-0 draws can sometimes be very entertaining matches, but Cardiff v Derby was not one of them – it was dull, virtually free from goalmouth incident, scrappy and disjointed. One other thing I remember from a year ago was that we were supposed to be playing in “the Cardiff way” whereby we would succeed by playing crowd pleasing passing football using a tactical flexibility that had not been seen under the manager we had before Paul Trollope. There was also a “Derby way” at one time and it was a great deal more established than the Cardiff way ever became. From what I remember, there was never any mission statement as to what the Derby way was, but a season or two ago anyone who saw their very expensively assembled team on a good day would know what it was meant to entail – Derby were a very watchable side at their best as they generally tried to outpass their opponents while taking the game to them whether they were playing home or away. What Derby offered yesterday in no way was the “Derby way” – I’m struggling to remember the last time a side lined up as defensively against us and for about eighty per cent of the game I would have said a 0-0 draw was the height of their ambition. Derby took a step away from their self proclaimed way when they appointed Gary Rowett as manager, because his time at Birmingham identified him as someone who places defensive strength high on his list of priorities and, like Neil Warnock, he doesn’t seem too bothered if the opposition have more of the ball than his team does. It would have been easy to look at the turgid stuff Derby produced yesterday and think that they were not a patch on their teams of old, but there was a frailty about the sides that practiced the Derby way which helped ensure that, for all of the millions spent, they never fully convinced that they could make it to the Premier League – there was a discipline and a hard edge about them yesterday that was often missing from those earlier teams. Rowett claimed after the game that his side deserved to win. I’m not so sure about that, but I don’t think they deserved to lose and, after offering nothing in attack for the first hour or so (I’m struggling to remember a goal attempt of any description from them in that time), it’s true to say that they came closer to ending the stalemate than we did" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Spot on Mr Cardiff fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 3 hours ago, cannable said: Southampton, Swansea, Bournemouth, Watford - Yes West Brom, Palace, Stoke - I'd rather stay down thank you very much Which category would you put Burnley in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irobinson Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 1 hour ago, Robram said: ...................................................................................and back to view from the outside . This taken from a cardiff fanzine is an interesting read "I’ve mentioned before on here that 0-0 draws can sometimes be very entertaining matches, but Cardiff v Derby was not one of them – it was dull, virtually free from goalmouth incident, scrappy and disjointed. One other thing I remember from a year ago was that we were supposed to be playing in “the Cardiff way” whereby we would succeed by playing crowd pleasing passing football using a tactical flexibility that had not been seen under the manager we had before Paul Trollope. There was also a “Derby way” at one time and it was a great deal more established than the Cardiff way ever became. From what I remember, there was never any mission statement as to what the Derby way was, but a season or two ago anyone who saw their very expensively assembled team on a good day would know what it was meant to entail – Derby were a very watchable side at their best as they generally tried to outpass their opponents while taking the game to them whether they were playing home or away. What Derby offered yesterday in no way was the “Derby way” – I’m struggling to remember the last time a side lined up as defensively against us and for about eighty per cent of the game I would have said a 0-0 draw was the height of their ambition. Derby took a step away from their self proclaimed way when they appointed Gary Rowett as manager, because his time at Birmingham identified him as someone who places defensive strength high on his list of priorities and, like Neil Warnock, he doesn’t seem too bothered if the opposition have more of the ball than his team does. It would have been easy to look at the turgid stuff Derby produced yesterday and think that they were not a patch on their teams of old, but there was a frailty about the sides that practiced the Derby way which helped ensure that, for all of the millions spent, they never fully convinced that they could make it to the Premier League – there was a discipline and a hard edge about them yesterday that was often missing from those earlier teams. Rowett claimed after the game that his side deserved to win. I’m not so sure about that, but I don’t think they deserved to lose and, after offering nothing in attack for the first hour or so (I’m struggling to remember a goal attempt of any description from them in that time), it’s true to say that they came closer to ending the stalemate than we did" Absolutely fair and good observation my man. You know yer stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerTedd Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 3 hours ago, cannable said: Southampton, Swansea, Bournemouth, Watford - Yes West Brom, Palace, Stoke - I'd rather stay down thank you very much Bournemouth and Watford, still to early in there premier league tenured to call them established. Swansea and Southampton - have been established, and both playing good football alongbthe way, but on their way towards crashing and burning West Brom and stoke - undeniably established, and don’t look like they’re going anywhere very quickly. They’ve both had flirtations with relegation. But they’re have very quickly become 3 teams far worse than them, so never in any real danger, and both have even had flirtations with the lower European spots. So of those 6 examples, West Brom and Stoke are mostly what championship clubs are aspiring to be. Long term, established premier league clubs. And unfortunately playing turgid, safe football is the way to get there. That being said, I’d far prefer the frail, but exciting football under what was supposed to be the Derby way mentioned by the Cardiff fan. One example always made me laugh. I think it was something like 3-3 against a team bottom of the table, possibly millwall, when we were really sure we’d get a win and really needed one. Obviously the forum went into meltdown. What the f*** is out defence playing at. The attack do their job, the defence just watch. I think this was straight after a 4-4 as well. But, Jesus, would you not take those sorts of matches again now?! f*** promotion, don’t care if we finish 6th every season and end up loosing honorably on penos every season (or a last minute f****** Zamora goal - f****** Zamora). What a ride it was! I suspect this season will not be quite so exciting. Nor will next season, and we might even go up. But to what, and for what purpose? To become the next West Brom, and hire Tony Pulis when Rowett’s time comes to an end. What’s the point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B4ev6is Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 I disagree mr cardiff fan We had the better chances and looked more likely to score on saturday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philmycock Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 13 minutes ago, B4ev6is said: I disagree mr cardiff fan We had the better chances and looked more likely to score on saturday. And we outplayed Brentford? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boycie Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 23 minutes ago, B4ev6is said: I disagree mr cardiff fan We had the better chances and looked more likely to score on saturday. Oh my life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 27 minutes ago, TigerTedd said: Bournemouth and Watford, still to early in there premier league tenured to call them established. Swansea and Southampton - have been established, and both playing good football alongbthe way, but on their way towards crashing and burning West Brom and stoke - undeniably established, and don’t look like they’re going anywhere very quickly. They’ve both had flirtations with relegation. But they’re have very quickly become 3 teams far worse than them, so never in any real danger, and both have even had flirtations with the lower European spots. So of those 6 examples, West Brom and Stoke are mostly what championship clubs are aspiring to be. Long term, established premier league clubs. And unfortunately playing turgid, safe football is the way to get there. That being said, I’d far prefer the frail, but exciting football under what was supposed to be the Derby way mentioned by the Cardiff fan. One example always made me laugh. I think it was something like 3-3 against a team bottom of the table, possibly millwall, when we were really sure we’d get a win and really needed one. Obviously the forum went into meltdown. What the f*** is out defence playing at. The attack do their job, the defence just watch. I think this was straight after a 4-4 as well. But, Jesus, would you not take those sorts of matches again now?! f*** promotion, don’t care if we finish 6th every season and end up loosing honorably on penos every season (or a last minute f****** Zamora goal - f****** Zamora). What a ride it was! I suspect this season will not be quite so exciting. Nor will next season, and we might even go up. But to what, and for what purpose? To become the next West Brom, and hire Tony Pulis when Rowett’s time comes to an end. What’s the point? Is it fair to say though that some of those teams have changed. Like, what Swansea did well they stopped doing. While Stoke are stereotyped as ugly and negative aren't really like that for a while now. I can't even remember what WBA were like. Who took them up and kept them up? Bournemouth are an odd one. They've not looked troubled since gaining promotion and I think there's this sense of inevitable safety now. Only I don't understand why. They haven't replaced a couple of key players despite buying players that really you can't argue with. While other players Howe seems happy with when perhaps he should be looking to upgrade. I hope they do stay up. They still play a bit like we did. Slowly, slowly... boom! Attack! Don't like Howe but if he leaves Bournemouth I'd sell one of my kids to have him here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Swansea's style took them into Europe and won a cup too. I forgot that. But that has been slipping away for a while now. Just steady decline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inglorius Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 It's all very well setting up to park the bus away and frustrate the opposition, does Rowett have enough in his toolbag to be able to set up a side to be able counteract an opposition team performing exactly the same tactics to us at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 The Cardiff fan man had it right but I still believe we are a team in development. I haven't given up on GR making a team that can play the right stuff. we have to get away from this desire for instant success born of a couple of marquee signings and a decision to set up one formation or another ... Building a unit and getting them to gel is a dark art for which there is no recipe short of an oil well sized budget (and even that doesn't always work) patience fellow Rams . GR might fail but we won't do anything other than hasten that if we don't get behind the man in charge for a decent length of time and in good and bad runs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Just now, jono said: The Cardiff fan man had it right but I still believe we are a team in development. I haven't given up on GR making a team that can play the right stuff. we have to get away from this desire for instant success born of a couple of marquee signings and a decision to set up one formation or another ... Building a unit and getting them to gel is a dark art for which there is no recipe short of an oil well sized budget (and even that doesn't always work) patience fellow Rams . GR might fail but we won't do anything other than hasten that if we don't get behind the man in charge for a decent length of time and in good and bad runs. I hope that you are right and that we see Rowett continue to make progress with his team and style. Small steps are fine. It's unfortunate that he's made a rod for his own back by saying one thing and seemingly do another so far, but his position should be secure for his contract period in my view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Quote We weren't at the races today but we were still better than Derby draw was probably fair result. Quote basically they came to PARK THE BUS which worked which related in too many long balls from us hope all other sides that come down here now won't play the same . Quote two points dropped in a dire game against an average Derby side Quote Derby were an awful side given what they have at their disposal, on another day I think we would have put 3-4 on them. They had nothing going forward, cant see them being any better than mid table this season. Quote i thought Derby did really well..they came to disrupt and stop uur forwards 1st and foremost which they achieved.. and could have pinched it at the end. Quote They simply out powered us. A back 4, 2 sitters and not much ambition but to catch us on the break......Great away tactics. We didn't have the guile to break it down. Quote Can't quite believe he said Derby were the better side and deserved to win. The guy is seriously deluded. Fair enough, we were no great shakes today. A lot of huff and puff with no end products. Keogh played well for them and they dealt with our aerial threat well. Derby though we're absolute pants. They hit the bar with what appeared to be a cross shot ( maybe doing their guy a disservice) and apart from the last 5 mins when Etheridge made a great save they did the total sum of zero for the rest of the game. I was very disappointed with them. Quote Standard tactics for a manager under pressure away from home. Most derby fans won't have seen the game and just Base their opinion on his comments. Quote He was watching a different game from the rest of us. Comes across as really arrogant. He's seriously deluded. Quote they restricted us to next to nothing and nearly pinched it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CumbrianRam Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 2 hours ago, Alpha said: I can't even remember what WBA were like. Who took them up and kept them up? di Matteo in 2009, were quite a dyanmic team, omly since Pulis came in they have been pretty turgid and a lot of WBA fans want him out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CumbrianRam Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Cardiff stats http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/how-match-days-new-favourite-13694086 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Remember them coming to us and we totally battered them? Then they scored from a corner and you thought 'ok, no problem. We will still win this' Then they scored another corner! Think we drew 2-2. But they parked the bus. We were all over them. Saturday wasn't at all like that though. Just dull really which suited us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uttoxram75 Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 14 minutes ago, CumbrianRam said: di Matteo in 2009, were quite a dyanmic team, omly since Pulis came in they have been pretty turgid and a lot of WBA fans want him out West Brom fans want him out, Stoke fans wanted him out, the problem is the owners of both clubs are more than happy to be mid table prem with fullish stadiums and shed loads of Sky and sponsors cash rolling in. The owners don't need attractive football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CumbrianRam Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Cardiff have the worst pass completion stats in the league, they are very direct team but use players and system that is very effective for such system. In them early NC days I felt confident of beating most teams at home, I think the same season we thrashed Newcastle too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tombo Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 On 02/10/2017 at 15:50, KCG said: I think what most of us would like is to compete in the Premier, year in year out, like WBA and Stoke City. Neither play expansive football and make do to survive. Of course it would be nice to do a Leicester, or repeat the feats of BC and Mackay, but I don't think it's too much to expect of a club of our size to copy WBA! I definitely definitely never want this for Derby County. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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