Official: Cyrus Christie joins Middlesbrough

[Animal is a Ram]

I'm going to Legoland next Saturday. I'll take Christie, and if someone can invite the Reading and QPR execs, they can battle for him.

For a 10% handling fee, of course. 

[Lokidoki]

2 hours ago, sage said:

Thanks for your help.

My sincere pleasure.

1 hour ago, Arsene Titman said:

We just need to consult the oracle known as Lokidoki

next week the numbers are 15: 25:37 etc. and good luck

1 hour ago, RamLad1884 said:

Reality is consistency makes the player

and this really was my point; we have had so much poor management around this team that Christie and the like don't become Trippier. You can see it with Hughes (how he has become inconsistent [albeit part due to injury]) and with Ince; - by now Ince should've had his positional nasties coached out of him; instead we don't play Christie as first choice because the two are not compatible. 

[EnigmaRam]

9 minutes ago, Lokidoki said:

My sincere pleasure.

next week the numbers are 15: 25:37 etc. and good luck

and this really was my point; we have had so much poor management around this team that Christie and the like don't become Trippier. You can see it with Hughes (how he has become inconsistent [albeit part due to injury]) and with Ince; - by now Ince should've had his positional nasties coached out of him; instead we don't play Christie as first choice because the two are not compatible. 

We don't play Christie as first choice because he got injured and Baird did a great job. It's Bairds shirt to lose and Christie couldn't get it back

[Lokidoki]

39 minutes ago, EnigmaRam said:

We don't play Christie as first choice because he got injured and Baird did a great job

I went through this on the Ince thread - Bairdinho did a great job only because he got nosebleeds after the opposition "D" and this suits Ince. It did limit the amount of attacks unless he could pick the threaded ball to Ince, which he did quite well at times. You couldn't ever see Baird on the by-line apart from in his own area.

 When Christie played alongside Ince they tripped over each other as Ince can't take either the over or the under lap. This made the team unbalanced when Christie and Ince played together. Something that should have been coached out of Ince's game. This made Christie look poor. Question is: Do you get Eriksen in the way of Trippier in the same manner?

This is what I mean by the team not being balanced.

[jono]

I reckon Cyrus has been a disappointing signing. Not because he has played badly or let anyone down. He hasn't really. 

Yet when he arrived, he promised so much and seemed genuinely skilled. We paid a modest price for this strong fast physical player who could take on a man and frighten the pants off their RB .. and he was young .. any rough edges would get trained away and good coaching would see him become a real star. I honestly thought he'd be spotted and go off to the prem. 

Instead we have exactly the same player we bought. a good lad with some skill. I have no particular worries with him in the team and still like those bursts towards the edge of the box, its just that the class I thought was there to be nurtured just hasn't surfaced. 

[rynny]

5 minutes ago, Lokidoki said:

I went through this on the Ince thread - Bairdinho did a great job only because he got nosebleeds after the opposition "D" and this suits Ince. It did limit the amount of attacks unless he could pick the threaded ball to Ince, which he did quite well at times. You couldn't ever see Baird on the by-line apart from in his own area.

 When Christie played alongside Ince they tripped over each other as Ince can't take either the over or the under lap. This made the team unbalanced when Christie and Ince played together. Something that should have been coached out of Ince's game. This made Christie look poor. Question is: Do you get Eriksen in the way of Trippier in the same manner?

This is what I mean by the team not being balanced.

The main question is, who is better for the team, Ince or Christie? If you believe Ince is a better overall for the team you play a player that is going to help him perform better, and make sure that the team is better balanced i.e. Baird and Ince together. If you believe that Christie is the better player for the team then you pair him with someone who is going to help him perform better, and make sure that the team is better balanced i.e. Russell and Christie.

For me, and quite a few posters that I have seen on this forum, Ince and Baird are a better combination, have a better balance and bring more to the team.

The Christie or Ince debate also raises other questions, does Christie's attacking abilities good enough to sacrifice the wingers attacking abilities from time to time? Is our RB good enough to be occasionally left with a potential 2 vs 1?

You say that Ince should have been coached to take an overlap or an underlap, but shouldn't Christie be also equally criticised for not performing his attacking duties correctly? After all, he should be coached to know when to overlap, underlap or even stay put and back up the winger. Running in a straight line is a great strength of Christie's but it also one of his flaws, sometimes he needs to stop and think, am I going to get in his way, or am I going to take the space that he wants to run into, instead of running down the wing asking for the ball and wonder why he didn't get it and why Ince is looking frustrated and and having to turn back.

[Lokidoki]

@rynny A very good summary in which I fully endorse.

Personally I prefer Christie/Russell as I feel what you have highlighted is the flaw with Ince and although Russell's final ball is often poor; his contribution to the overall balance is greater than two players that just go up and down the line with a right winger that has to cut in.

 

[RamLad1884]

1 minute ago, Lokidoki said:

@rynny A very good summary in which I fully endorse.

Personally I prefer Christie/Russell as I feel what you have highlighted is the flaw with Ince and although Russell's final ball is often poor; his contribution to the overall balance is greater than two players that just go up and down the line with a right winger that has to cut in.

 

Very good points from you and @rynny. I'd look at it the opposite way around though. For balance purposes you would expect each player in their position to be able to achieve the basics of that position to a good standard. For me Baird defends very well, positionally he's as good as any of our defenders and has got us out of a sticky situation a few times. The same with Ince, his attacking play when on form is second to non in this team, possibly this division. Therefore both do what their position requires very well. Whereas the Christie struggles with his defensive play at times, as does Russell with his attacking play. They both have the ability to attack and defend but the phrase 'a jack of all trades but a master of none' springs to mind with both players. 

[EnigmaRam]

1 hour ago, Lokidoki said:

I went through this on the Ince thread - Bairdinho did a great job only because he got nosebleeds after the opposition "D" and this suits Ince. It did limit the amount of attacks unless he could pick the threaded ball to Ince, which he did quite well at times. You couldn't ever see Baird on the by-line apart from in his own area.

 When Christie played alongside Ince they tripped over each other as Ince can't take either the over or the under lap. This made the team unbalanced when Christie and Ince played together. Something that should have been coached out of Ince's game. This made Christie look poor. Question is: Do you get Eriksen in the way of Trippier in the same manner?

This is what I mean by the team not being balanced.

Baird got in the oppositions half loads of times and put in some quality crosses not to mention through balls. He did it by getting his head up. Cyrus just sprints with his head down then boots it 10 yards over everyone's head. He can neither defend nor put in a cross so he's a bit like a broken pencil.

russell and Cyrus would be a nightmare. Neither can defend and neither have an end product.

i get you don't like Ince, so many seem to be happy to get rid of our top scorers these days. 

[Sparkle]

Well if he has one year left on his contract and he isn't going to sign another one or be offered another one then sell if we can get an acceptable offer.

[Lokidoki]

47 minutes ago, EnigmaRam said:

Baird got in the oppositions half loads of times and put in some quality crosses not to mention through balls.

That's what I said and also that he never got past the "D"; I cannot remember many times he put crosses in though; although some good through balls.

funny how folks' memories fade - can you remember the fancy footwork on the right by Chrstie; you cannot do that with your head down?

 

[rynny]

18 minutes ago, Lokidoki said:

That's what I said and also that he never got past the "D"; I cannot remember many times he put crosses in though; although some good through balls.

funny how folks' memories fade - can you remember the fancy footwork on the right by Chrstie; you cannot do that with your head down?

 

Go to 58 seconds

[EnigmaRam]

7 minutes ago, rynny said:

Go to 58 seconds

If only Cyrus could cross like that

[sage]

42 minutes ago, Lokidoki said:

That's what I said and also that he never got past the "D"; I cannot remember many times he put crosses in though; although some good through balls.

funny how folks' memories fade - can you remember the fancy footwork on the right by Chrstie; you cannot do that with your head down?

 

Of course you can do fancy footwork with your head down. The ball remains at your feet.

It's looking up and playing a pass or cross at the right time that's the problem.

You must be WUMming now.

[Lokidoki]

1 hour ago, EnigmaRam said:

If only Cyrus could cross like that

Do you mean Anya? Lol  wumming away.

1 hour ago, sage said:

You must be WUMming now.

 

Anyway what a great example to prove my point on why a modern right back cannot play with Ince. Note the big FUP between Ince and Baird, with Ince doing his headless chicken act (great positional awareness) for the 2nd. Or the going with the man for the 3rd, which Baird did not do?

It didn't show Baird's nose bleed after our first goal. but it did show, for our third, the I'll get it on my left, I'll get it on my left, I'll still keep trying to get it on my left; until oops fell over the ball!! must be a penalty ref ?

wumming

[DcFc Dyycheee]

1 hour ago, rynny said:

Go to 58 seconds

That is a beauty. 

[Abu Derby]

Has he left yet?

[Rab a dab doo]

Who?

[jagerbob]

Whilst stil not good, he still managed a fair few near post cross assists for Martin in away games in particular.

In our old McClaren system he often got more room than players who were playing centrally

On 18.6.2017 at 18:23, Wolfie20 said:

Surely one of the main requirements of a wing back is the ability to deliver a quality cross since the opportunity to overlap will be more frequent than it is in a back four system. Unfortunately it's not one of Christie's strengths.

 

[QuitYourJibbaJivin]

I still can't believe we got a penalty for the "foul" at the end ?