Derbados Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Sky Sports article, as it happens I've been saying we are the Arsenal of the Championship for some time! http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11688/10794548/whats-wrong-with-derby-another-season-of-promise-turning-into-disappointment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuwtfly Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 If it is a mentality problem - how do you fix it? Does the mentality come from the manager, the captain, or the chairman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyDyer Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 A psychological disease from the top to the bottom. That's why I think the club needs a HUGE character. A Barton. A Warnock. A Pulis. whatever you may think of certain people within football, some seem to have the balls to go into a club and flip it on it's head. I hoped Pearson might be that man, but it seems his GI Joe routine is old hat. Players have far too much power and they are happy to wield it. I don't think SM is a strong enough man to command ultimate respect. Neither is Keogh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiddingsRam Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 4 minutes ago, TroyDyer said: A psychological disease from the top to the bottom. That's why I think the club needs a HUGE character. A Barton. A Warnock. A Pulis. whatever you may think of certain people within football, some seem to have the balls to go into a club and flip it on it's head. I hoped Pearson might be that man, but it seems his GI Joe routine is old hat. Players have far too much power and they are happy to wield it. I don't think SM is a strong enough man to command ultimate respect. Neither is Keogh. A new manager is not what's required ! Stability and a leader on the pitch on the other hand is what's required . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 this presumes that the Autumn form is standard and the winter form is unusual which I'm not convinced of. Currently we are getting what we deserve, we are a mid table ordinary Championship team, with Fozzy and Thorne (and maybe CM) we are above average but still short of automatics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyDyer Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 1 minute ago, RiddingsRam said: A new manager is not what's required ! Stability and a leader on the pitch on the other hand is what's required . I would like someone alongside SM though. Let SM coach. But a leader on the pitch is an absolute must. I really wanted Barton, although by looking at the level of cowardice when the chips are down, among our lot, he'd struggle to work out which one to smack first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Please no more "we need a tough guy" stuff.....Pearson, Barton, Warnock, Pulis....na, not for me. We need a solid plan, some stable building and to pull together as a club. This seasons promise was dead by September. The winning run corrected itself and we are where we are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiddingsRam Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 4 minutes ago, TroyDyer said: I would like someone alongside SM though. Let SM coach. But a leader on the pitch is an absolute must. I really wanted Barton, although by looking at the level of cowardice when the chips are down, among our lot, he'd struggle to work out which one to smack first. Sort of a Roy Keane / Martin O'Neil relationship ? Burtons the stand out candidate for the leader role , but surely there's more out there ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyDyer Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 5 minutes ago, RiddingsRam said: Sort of a Roy Keane / Martin O'Neil relationship ? Burtons the stand out candidate for the leader role , but surely there's more out there ? Connor McGregor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyDyer Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 8 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said: Please no more "we need a tough guy" stuff.....Pearson, Barton, Warnock, Pulis....na, not for me. We need a solid plan, some stable building and to pull together as a club. This seasons promise was dead by September. The winning run corrected itself and we are where we are. We also (NOTHING TO DO WITH PEARSON) became the 85th team in the football league over 7 games... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 18 minutes ago, TroyDyer said: I would like someone alongside SM though. Let SM coach. But a leader on the pitch is an absolute must. I really wanted Barton, although by looking at the level of cowardice when the chips are down, among our lot, he'd struggle to work out which one to smack first. Barton is all about cowardice and bullying, yeah just what we want. *If* there is a 'mental attitude' problem running through the club then its up to Mel to deal with it by looking for 'change'. If the money we pay and the wages the players earn aren't enough to motivate them then that has to be looked at, as does recruitment. But maybe, just maybe this squad aren't a good enough team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth's left foot Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 ******** to Barton, Savage was bad enough. With Martin, Thorne and Fozzy back we'll be a far better side. I think it's time to change the squad, Bryson and Christie aren't going to get any better now so freshen up the squad with young players not 'names'. Sam Rush convinced Mel to take SM back so it will be interesting to see how long he has. I was glad to see him back but I'm less than impressed with how things are currently going, the energy seems to have disappeared from the team. What about our Under 23's? The Derby Way is only a good idea if we see Bennett, Elsnik etc before the season ends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coneheadjohn Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Not much I don't think. Not been good enough but I don't think we're as far away as people think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 As the article says, we have brought in successful characters - eg Bradley, Shackell, Baird so surely the question should be what environment we need to create for them to be effective on the field? If we lack on field leadership but have on-field leaders within the team then either their leadership is being somehow suppressed or they don't feel the need to exercise it. Weird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamLad1884 Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Get everyone back in the summer, work out the dead wood (I.e Blackman etc). Get some youngsters in the mix and set out a real plan. Throwing everything at it in the hopes we'll win each week clearly isn't working Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bald Eagle's Barmy Army Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 1 hour ago, TroyDyer said: A psychological disease from the top to the bottom. That's why I think the club needs a HUGE character. A Barton. A Warnock. A Pulis. whatever you may think of certain people within football, some seem to have the balls to go into a club and flip it on it's head. I hoped Pearson might be that man, but it seems his GI Joe routine is old hat. Players have far too much power and they are happy to wield it. I don't think SM is a strong enough man to command ultimate respect. Neither is Keogh. Agree with you 100% on this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, RamLad1884 said: Get everyone back in the summer, work out the dead wood (I.e Blackman etc). Get some youngsters in the mix and set out a real plan. Throwing everything at it in the hopes we'll win each week clearly isn't working its not the people that are not playing that is the problem, it's the ones that are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. P Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 It would be nice to have a fully fit squad all season for change without someone's knee exploding! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicester Ram Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Think it's largely ******** and hysteria from the fans, if I'm being honest. Let's examine our "bottling" and failures, shall we? 13/14: play off final v QPR Closest we've come to bottling it. An almost perfect, well balanced, confident team couldn't find a goal against a very resolute QPR team who fluked a goal on the break when there were plenty of opportunities to stop them. If we played that fixture in the same conditions ten times over, we'd have won the other nine. Verdict: Gutting, but it was more horrific luck than anything, 99 time out of 100 that cross and clearance doesn't land perfectly for Zamora. 14/15: missing out on the play-off's A series of injuries to the spine of the team starting with all our CDM's, Thorne, Eustace and Mascarell, and our ST's Martin and Bent, meant the whole system the team was built around fell apart. It was extremely unlucky and the team falling apart probably had more to do with us struggling to find a new system that worked. One fixture that stands out is Norwich (A) when we had Johnny Russell playing as a lone target man and Jamie Hanson at DM for his debut. Another under appreciated factor was Buxton's injury, which took the consistency out of a previously solid back four. The fact that McClaren wouldn't rule out the Newcastle job also played a part, but I suspect it was more a factor for the fans than the players. Verdict: This would look like bottling to the uninitiated, but not many teams would survive so many injuries to their most important positions. If you lose your wingers, there's people who can do a job there, but when it's roles as mature/vital as CDM and ST in our classic 4-3-3, it's a kiss of death. 15/16: play-off failure with Wassall A bit of a car crash in slow motion of a season, we finally got George Thorne back fit and playing, only to lose Bryson and Hughes on the first day. Johnson and Butterfield were brought in and we plodded along fairly well until our playing style got worse and worse, and more negative, with players performances falling off a cliff. It seemed like a lot of our players had got worse under Clement and most likely due to other factors off the field, he was sacked. This left us with Academy director Darren Wassall for the rest of the season. What people often forget is that Wassall did get us playing again, we had some decent results. But after losing Thorne in the final game of the season, Wassall naively put Will Hughes in the holding role and Bradley Johnson more advanced for the play-off home leg against Hull. We got torn apart 3-0 and a spirited away performance wasn't enough for us to get back in it. Verdict: more poor luck, injuries at the worst times, managerial failings and ***** signings contributed to us messing up the play-off's. If Thorne had been fit for the play-off's, it could have been a different story. Although a good manager, Clement wasn't the right fit for Derby and Wassall did a fairly good job but was exposed by Steve Bruce in that play-off home leg. 16/17: being ****** from the off Pearson sat on his squad all summer, even though it clearly didn't suit the sort of system he wanted to play, then only decided to make moves in the transfer market late after an appalling start and no league goals. He shipped out the previously vital Chris Martin and cashed in on Hendrick, bringing in the very different Matej Vydra. After an awful 9 games and a shambolic performance against Blackburn, something seemed to happen off the field and he was out. McClaren came in, tinkered with the team and got us back into play-off contention with a run of clean sheets and wins. Unfortunately, to realistically make the play-off's, Derby would have had to keep up automatic promotion form for the rest of the season to make the play-off's and in a year where none of the top 6/7 teams seem to be slipping up, it's proved too much of an ask. Verdict: a team that's now a mish-mash of 3/4 managers different ideas was maximised by McClaren enough to get back into play-off contention fell off. Was this team really meant to be good enough to make the play-offs? Mac's played a 4-3-3/4-2-3-1 because it suits the majority of the players, but really there is no cohesive system they're all meant to fit into. Until there's some continuity at Derby, it's extremely difficult to say we are 'bottling' it because what is there to bottle? There's about 6/7 other teams in the league which are clearly better than us and that's for off the field reasons as well as on the field. Conclusion It depends on what your definition of bottling is, but I don't think we've bottled it really. It comes from this idea that getting out of the championship is a piece of piss and we're a big club so should be doing better than the likes of Bournemouth, Burnley and Huddersfield. It's a lot of arrogance, people forget that there's 23 other teams in the league trying to achieve something too. How many of the years we've been in contention and missed out have we been deserving of promotion? One I'd say, we were possibly better than Burnley in 13/14 and definitely better than QPR. The other times, there's been other teams! 14/15: Bournemouth were fantastic and Watford became a real force, Boro and Norwich were both comfortably better than what the depleted Derby team were at the end of the season. So were Brentford. 15/16: Burnley were absolutely clinical, Boro and Brighton were both clearly teams that would have finished 1st and 2nd in other years. Wednesday were on a level with us and probably had more momentum. Hull (and the rest of the league) had a proper manager instead of an academy director. 16/17: Newcastle and Brighton are about as good as it gets at this level. Huddersfield and Reading aren't as fashionable as other big teams in the league are, but they're easily play-off contenders and better than us. Wednesday, Leeds, Norwich and Fulham have consistency as well as a raft of talent. How is it an outrage/colossal failure that we aren't above these teams? Under the circumstances, we're pretty much where we should be and people need to get used to that. Next season will finally give a manager a chance to build on what he was working with the season before and I'm feeling very positive about that. So stop the hyperbole, entitlement and hysteria, get behind the team and take a minute before you buy into the bottlers image. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrdave85 Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 @Leicester Ram that is everything I've though about the bottlers tag and previous seasons, written far better than I could. All the likes for you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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