Sexydadbod Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 It's only just struck me how many players we have who are towards the end of their careers. Players(especially at this level) tend to slowly start to decline after the age of 28. Our recruitment in the last few years seems to be for the here and now which has resulted in us buying players coming to the end of their careers which is a problem imo because they may not be as motivated. I'm not saying to get rid of every old player in the squad because that's discriminatory and you need a balance but we do need to start focusing our recruitment on younger, hungry players. You just have to look at Monaco's attacking threat to see the benefits of having a young midfield and forward line(apart from falcao). Younger players are more dynamic and tend to play without fear. That's one of McClaren's biggest tasks in the summer, to try and reduce the overall age of the squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Whilst i think the rigid stretched 433 formation is the fundamentl problem, i would agree that we signed too many players who were unimaginative, long in the tooth signings to add to keogh and bryson. bent, nugent, johnson, baird, shackell, anya, etc even butters and camara are older than might be expected. Try to build a team younger team around will hughes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 You can't put an age on when players decline, position, style of player and personal fitness are bigger factors and even then 28 is still early to say players go into decline, even those that rely heavily on pace. Feels like 28 was plucked out to fit your argument but anyway, last night Christie 24, Lowe 19, De Sart 22, Butterfield 26, Hughes 21, Ince 25, Pearce 28 Which leaves only Carson, Anya, Bent, Keogh above the retirement age of "28". Worth noting that one of the best keepers in the world right now is 30, Neuer. Carson only a year older. Also Messi, Ronaldo are still scooping up all the awards despite all these better younger players around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 For me its about building a Derby team who can grow together. If we try to build a team of 23/24 year old and it takes 2 years to get promoted, there is still something to build on during the first 2 years in the prem. + younger legs have more energy. + i like players who are primarily associated with dcfc - for whom we are the best time in their careers. johnson will always be more associated with leeds and norwich, anya with watford, nugent with leicester and boro etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sexydadbod Posted February 22, 2017 Author Share Posted February 22, 2017 10 minutes ago, David said: You can't put an age on when players decline, position, style of player and personal fitness are bigger factors and even then 28 is still early to say players go into decline, even those that rely heavily on pace. Feels like 28 was plucked out to fit your argument but anyway, last night Christie 24, Lowe 19, De Sart 22, Butterfield 26, Hughes 21, Ince 25, Pearce 28 Which leaves only Carson, Anya, Bent, Keogh above the retirement age of "28". Worth noting that one of the best keepers in the world right now is 30, Neuer. Carson only a year older. Also Messi, Ronaldo are still scooping up all the awards despite all these better younger players around. Hence why I said at this level. Players at a higher level decline later. Having said that, even Ronaldo started to decline around that age and has had to adapt his role as a result. 28 is scientifically proven by sports scientists to show when performance levels start to decline. Decline doesn't mean it happens straight away, it can be over the course of a few years but that's when they tend to reach their peak performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 minute ago, McLovin said: Hence why I said at this level. Players at a higher level decline later. Having said that, even Ronaldo started to decline around that age and has had to adapt his role as a result. 28 is scientifically proven by sports scientists to show when performance levels start to decline. Decline doesn't mean it happens straight away, it can be over the course of a few years but that's when they tend to reach their peak performance. How is it scientifically proven yet you have exceptions to the science when players are at a higher level? Every players body is different, some recover from injuries better than others, stay in better shape. It's not like they forget each year more and more how to kick a ball, it's the physical side of the game which is why keepers go on much longer. I do agree with Ramnut above you want those 23/24 year olds to build a team around but you do need that experience around you as well. Squads are always changing, I'd say our balance is about right as a squad on the whole, certain positions we need to freshen up with younger legs but I don't see age being an issue right now at Derby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 If we just had Baird, Bent, Nuge, Shackell then yes. Overall, no. I do agree however, we've brought lots of "at the top of their career" players who will only decline in value and although can give us some seasons of dependable service, are not going to grow with us. On the plus side, isn't Vydra quite young still? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 minute ago, RadioactiveWaste said: On the plus side, isn't Vydra quite young still? And he'll help us grow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LesterRam Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 being old is in your head, I think they have a good few years left... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said: And he'll help us grow? Maybe not, unless a "two up top" revolution is being planned for next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Just because it's topical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 @McLovin Just remembered you was very pro signing Lansbury last month, turns 27 in October. We would have only had one season before the decline set in. Also Joey Barton who had just turned 34 at the time. On 16/09/2016 at 14:16, McLovin said: Absolutely, I wanted him before he went to Burnley and I still would like him now. He is the type of leader we need in the middle of the park. He may come across as a bit of a prat sometimes but he is an intelligent footballer. Surely if anywhere you would want these younger players in the middle if age is an issue? Wanting a leader in the middle is something that pops up every week on here, it's a popular opinion. You won't find many leaders much younger than 28, leadership comes with experience, experience comes with age. It's a bad week to go all ageist with me around, you don't have to send me a birthday card I prefer flowers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sexydadbod Posted February 22, 2017 Author Share Posted February 22, 2017 Never said to never sign older players, only that the majority of our signings should be young, hungry players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sexydadbod Posted February 22, 2017 Author Share Posted February 22, 2017 29 minutes ago, LesterRam said: being old is in your head, I think they have a good few years left... Is that Colin Gibson on the right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Some stats here, we've put out 4 teams this season with an average age of 29+ years old. Brighton 8. On the full list Brighton have played 13 games with teams with an average age of 28, Derby 5. *List only goes to 28.8, im sure both will have more up to 28.0 Our average squad age is 27.1, Brighton 28.1. Biggest stat of all is 2nd Brighton 68pts 11th Derby 48pts I say we need moooooore older players and Mel if you're reading, I can play any position and I'm 24hrs younger than Chris Baird. I can boost this average age for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Carson is in his prime right now. Keepers never reach it until their 30s. Shackell was perhaps at his peak the season we signed him but is still one of the better CB's in the league. It's not the fact we've brought players who're (supposedly) too old, we've bought players who appear incapable of developing their games to another level. Anya is a prime example, he's a tidy enough player but he isn't significantly better, or will be significantly better than Russell. The likes of Butterfield & Johnson are no better than the day we signed them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 5 minutes ago, ramsbottom said: It's not the fact we've brought players who're (supposedly) too old, we've bought players who appear incapable of developing their games to another level. Anya is a prime example, he's a tidy enough player but he isn't significantly better, or will be significantly better than Russell. The likes of Butterfield & Johnson are no better than the day we signed them. True. And that is fine if they're good enough to begin with. Although I'm not sure that Butters and BJ are as good as when we signed them, they aged so quickly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Nothing to do with age, we were and have been disjointed in the 433 for the past few weeks. A DM who's clearly out of his depth, a CF who can't hold a ball up, win a ball in the air or in fact move anywhere outside the circumference of a 10p, added with numerous right wingers who are just garbage. Simple for me and nothing to do with age, again we haven't replaced Martin or Thorne same as 2015/16 and with loss In form / lack of recruitment ability of anybody to play wide right, means the 433 isn't sustainable IMO. Let's enjoy the rest of season and hope these omissions are rectified next season COYR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LesterRam Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 55 minutes ago, McLovin said: Is that Colin Gibson on the right? No that's Keogh, call yourself a fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
europia Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Too old? Not sure. Too slow....probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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