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Big Overhaul - New Squad - Who?


mrdave85

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1 minute ago, Wolfie20 said:

About as long as Will Hughes so may as well get rid of him as well while we're at it (or is it your continuous criticism of Keogh that's really the issue yet again?).

Since Keogh signed we are now in our 6th managerial / head coach regime and each and every one of them have had Keogh as a definite starter match after match - think I trust their judgement a lot more than yours.

 

6th manager, 4th (failed) attempt at promotion, Keogh is a certain starter. ;)

You failed to mention what happened to those managers tentures kiddo

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5 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Did you not see how poor Keogh was against Bristol last season then? You want to play that card let's do it.

Wow Keogh plays for the mighty Ireland, so does John O'Shea and a 40 year old Shay Given, let's sign them both up. If Keogh was any cop he would have been snapped up by now, get a grip. He's a average Championship defender and I guarantee if you asked any fan of the current top six in the Championship if they'd take Richard Keogh over what they already have they'd flat out say no.

In 2017 we shouldn't solely depend on Chris Martin for goals. He is hardly on fire at the minute for Fulham, was dropped in the previous game funnily enough.

If he was bloody average you would think one of the god knows managers we've had would've dropped Keogh, but no they all keep him as a regular. 

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1 minute ago, TheDeadlySaul said:

If he was bloody average you would think one of the god knows managers we've had would've dropped Keogh, but no they all keep him as a regular. 

Idiakez was a key player for us was he not? Was Tommy Smith rated too at the same time?

When those two were sold for peanuts and there was a meltdown on the DET forum; what happened that very season? Promotion was it not?

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4 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Idiakez was a key player for us was he not? Was Tommy Smith rated too at the same time?

When those two were sold for peanuts and there was a meltdown on the DET forum; what happened that very season? Promotion was it not?

and you think selling Idaikez and Smith were the reasons for our promotion? Give me a break man. 

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TBH you could've made a point about moving on from keogh If you'd suggested a player better than him with a similar playing style, rather than flint. There's always an arguement for replacing any player in my view if you can find someone better than him who's got the same style- I believe the great Brian clough once discussed this. But it's all about whether these players are available, there are better players than will Hughes, but are they available to us? No, simply put and I can't think of any available players better than keogh either

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3 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

I did say in another thread I'd offer bent a year on reduced wages if he was up for it, but I wouldn't keep him as a key part of the squad for next year.

Fair enough. He's still proving he can cut it. 12 goals in 32 games bearing in mind he wasn't starting at the beginning of the season, I think we are seeing now back in the groove and at full fitness, there are not too many better at this level currently.

Thought I'd tire of him getting caught offside when he first signed, he's grown on me by showing he can adapt and refine his game, since he doesn't seem to get caught much in that respect. In fact most of the time he's checking his run because half the time no bugger sees him pointing or making the run; frustrating for him and others who watch him close enough.

Thats why I'd keep him at least another year, but he needs to be played to get the best out of him, with Martin coming back it may mean Daz fancies a move elsewhere for just that reason.

Wouldn't bet against him getting near 20 for the season if he stays fit, just to prove he's an option next year to anyone that wants him.

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1 minute ago, TheDeadlySaul said:

and you think selling Idaikez and Smith were the reasons for our promotion? Give me a break man. 

No , but it's proof selling a key player isn't always such a bad thing.

Huddersfield have shown that with Butterfield, Smithies, Coady departures.

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56 minutes ago, Papahet said:

Keoghs been here since 2012 and we are still a Championship club, it's time to freshen it up. There's better out there believe it or not.

Flint at 6'6 might actually make us a threat from corners, might actually be able to defend them too...

Tammy Abraham is a better prospect; scores for fun in a rather poor side and with the right service here he'd be lethal. We are too one dimensional with Martin in the side week in week out. We can't rely on the bloke forever **** me.

Football manager? booing? Nah didn't go to the recent home games buddy, what on earth does that have to do with anything like? 

Posted this in another thread.

Under Mac when both Keogh and Martin have started the game we have won 63% of matches, so in a season that works out at 29 games, wich is 87 points just from wins, without taking into consideration draws.

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8 minutes ago, Wolfie20 said:

About as much as I trust the judgement of some of our posters so no. 

On that basis then you've not trusted the other 4 people responsible for team selection?

I was just making a joke mate, I generally trust Mac and Clements decisions and I think in his role, keogh is an excellent player , and players of his type are hide to find hence why keogh rightly remains a key part of our team

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1 hour ago, rynny said:

Posted this in another thread.

Under Mac when both Keogh and Martin have started the game we have won 63% of matches, so in a season that works out at 29 games, wich is 87 points just from wins, without taking into consideration draws.

Under Chris Hutchings and  David Lowe we had 100% win record. In a season that works out as worthy Champions.

Isn't that straightforward though is it?

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We are still a Championship club though, give me all the stat's and figures you like pal.

How long do you stick with the same player until you say "Ok, maybe just maybe they aren't good enough to get us over the line"? Keogh has been here since 2012, Bryson nor Russell have improved over the past year or two.

Why would you stick with them? Make's absolutely no sense, we are in 2017 not 2013-14. We aren't that surprise package anymore.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Papahet said:

We are still a Championship club though, give me all the stat's and figures you like pal.

How long do you stick with the same player until you say "Ok, maybe just maybe they aren't good enough to get us over the line"? Keogh has been here since 2012, Bryson nor Russell have improved over the past year or two.

Why would you stick with them? Make's absolutely no sense, we are in 2017 not 2013-14. We aren't that surprise package anymore.

 

 

All I am saying is that when Mac has had his 2 main players, his captain and top scorer, fit and starting we have been good enough for a push for a top 2 spot. It is when one of them are missing is when we have struggled under Mac. So why is it down to them? Maybe the other players haven't been good enough? O have never understood the people calling for change why they want to start with the our better players, for me you start with the weakest link in the team and go from there.

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1 minute ago, Papahet said:

Find me proof we've struggled when Keogh has been out the side please. 

I honestly cannot recall such a thing, Martin yes but Keogh?

13/14 season drew 4-4 with Ipswich, then after going on 7 game winning run he was injured and next match we drew with Huddersfield, then beat Barnsley, then lost to Wigan 1-0, Chelsea 2-0 and Leicester 4-1. When he returned we went 7 unbeaten until we lost to Burnley when Martin was sent off and Milwall (no Martin) we then lost 3 of the last 15 games of the season. Without Keogh that season we won 1 drew 2 lost 3.

Since then Keogh has missed 3 games, 3-0 win against Brighton (last league game he has missed) in 14/15, 2-1 loss to Portsmouth in the cup and 2-1 win against Hartlepool in the cup.

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22 minutes ago, rynny said:

13/14 season drew 4-4 with Ipswich, then after going on 7 game winning run he was injured and next match we drew with Huddersfield, then beat Barnsley, then lost to Wigan 1-0, Chelsea 2-0 and Leicester 4-1. When he returned we went 7 unbeaten until we lost to Burnley when Martin was sent off and Milwall (no Martin) we then lost 3 of the last 15 games of the season. Without Keogh that season we won 1 drew 2 lost 3.

Since then Keogh has missed 3 games, 3-0 win against Brighton (last league game he has missed) in 14/15, 2-1 loss to Portsmouth in the cup and 2-1 win against Hartlepool in the cup.

And we've been great lately with him IN the side haven't we?

3 at Leicester, 3 against Bristol, 4 against Cardiff...

Who was playing defence in each of those games?

 

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I apologise in advance for not sifting through 12 pages of... the "opinions" of supporters of my football club, to put it most politely.

Before any undue criticism of Mac is levied, let's just remember what he did the first time around after 4-0 down vs. Ipswich. From then on it was just the most amazing rollercoaster ride followed by unbelievable heartbreak at Wembley. An overhaul of the squad is needed now, especially considering we're littered with the players of FOUR managers through the ranks. Clough, Mac, Clement and Pearson all have their players in this team and the fragmentation shows.

At this stage, we kind of actually need another Clough style clear out of the **** we've inherited over the last 2 years, because there's actually quite a lot. Too many statistististicicians have been involved in recruiting players for various reasons, all part of the fragmentation we see today. If I asked all of you to name our best 11, how many different outcomes would there be now compared to 2 1/2 years ago?

If there's any criticism to be given to Chairman Mel, it's that he's actually given too much freedom to managers to spend his money. As hard as it might be to accept for us, and for any manager at the helm too, he needs to tighten up the purse strings and stop some of the nonsense recruitment going on.

This season IS a write off now. It started badly, we had the new manager bounce but now the cracks are starting to show again. It would be foolish to ask promotion with what we have. Yes we might have the talent on paper but we don't have the cohesion, we don't truly have a team. We don't have that solid starting 11 that can be squaded in and out as and when it's necessary.

Let's forego any major criticism of the players and staff now for the rest of the season and let's start looking forward to next year. I have a little mascot on the way in early July and he has his kit ready. The poor little poo monster is going to be a FKW the moment he's born :lol:

I want this football back:

But it's not going to happen overnight and it certainly isn't going to happen this season.

Let's enjoy what's left of this season and start looking forward to what I hope is a rebuilt, tightly knit squad for next season that will also have more than a cameo appearance for King George VII.

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9 hours ago, Papahet said:

And we've been great lately with him IN the side haven't we?

3 at Leicester, 3 against Bristol, 4 against Cardiff...

Who was playing defence in each of those games?

 

So it is all Keogh's fault? Was it Keogh's fault that Olsson played the striker on that Pearce needlessly fouled against Cardiff? Was it Keogh's fault that Noone curled a one into the top corner? Was it Keogh's fault that De Sart, Olsson and Pearce all got beat in the air by the same person (I mean why the hell are 3 defenders challenging 1 player in the air and still losing out?) then Bent having an air shot to clear the ball, and Baird getting in Carson's way and popping the ball up nicely to Harris to smash in? Was it Keogh's fault that that Harris' shot took a deflection off Baird/Pearce and Carson misjudged the flight of the ball?

Which of the goals were Keogh's fault  against Bristol? Which were Keogh's fault against Leicester?

Who was in the team when the club's consecutive clean sheets was matched? Who was in the team when the consecutive clean sheets at home record was broken?

If you are going to blame him for the goals in the last few matches he deserves just as much praise, if not more for the clean sheet records that he has been a major, and only, player involved in both.

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