cannable Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Pace, energy, comfort on the ball and effective timing of the run are what I want in that position. Jeff could go on those powerful surging runs every now and then but Bryson helped to stretch the game running in behind, even if it was seemingly aimless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridgford Ram Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 I think we have 3 midfielders Hughes, Johnson and Thorne who when fit are all the best at what they do in the Championship. If we ever get the three of them fit at the same time we need to find a way to get them all in the side (4-2-3-1 with Thorne and Johnson at the base of the midfield providing muscle, protection and creativity and Hughes in the middle of the 3 with Ince and a.n. Other either side of him). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 1 minute ago, sage said: Daniel Johnson at Preston. Would cost a couple of mill i guess. Good shout that. Always scored whenever I've watched him as well so that's a guaranteed 35 goals a season minimum for us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1of4 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 What is needed is a midfield that works well as a unit and not three individuals eg Gerrard, Lampard, Scholes playing for England, three great players but together it never worked. One of the best midfield units we had was McGovern, Gemmil, Durban. You could pick holes in all of them as individuals but as a midfield unit superb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BramcoteRam84 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Agree with majority of comments on here. Our midfield is the issue as it lacks the running power we had 2-3 years ago. Bryson will make a difference but when he wasn't doing it or injured Jeff fit in seamlessly. Johnson and Butterfield don't have the legs to be effective in the role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 1 hour ago, EnigmaRam said: I agree with this but totally lost you when you started talking about rugby. Is that the sport where grown men like to touch each other's tackle in a big cuddle? Lol. The rugby wasn't a great analogy but I was trying to think of a different way to describe the sort of destroying advanced midfielder that I think would completely change the sometimes brittle nature of our play. In Rugby if the scrum half and fly half start attacks off it is the big, fast centres that burst through oposition lines and inflict damage. In footy terms the Gerrards, Lampards that stride through and can either feed the front line or score themselves. They can tackle, they are strong and fast, (not lumbering battering rams ) they can pass and shoot in equal measure. Ok so they were top of the tree in their era but below the Prem there are players with enough of those attributes to improve us and a good one would fit our system, complimenting Hughes creativity and ball retention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 1 hour ago, barnsley ram said: yes lets all slash our wrists and lets sack the manager dont know how we are three points off the play offs with such a crap team god help us all! I'm not slashing wrsts at all. We have a good team. I am just suggesting that we all get into hyper discussions about the relative merits and failings of our attack and defence but I feel that those things would lessen considerably with the right style of midfielder to compliment Will. It should be Butterfield but I don't think he has hit his stride for us yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 1 hour ago, smiths_tavrn said: Lol no. Let's just say you've posted an analysis and I'm giving feedback and trying to clarify a few points. You do welcome feedback don't you? On Archie Gemmil .. Wee genius with top flight skills. Bryson. Good hard working player with some skill, but a local hero rather than an icon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 1 minute ago, smiths_tavrn said: Thing is do you need a terrier in the side? Depends on how you set up and decide to play really. Horses for courses and all that. TBH .. I am not sure we do, IF we have an aggressive charger instead. Will has enough bite these days to do the terrier bit as well as all the other stuff. I might have argued myself into a bring back Jeff but he always seemed to go missing 2 games out 3. Then just as you were about to want to throttle him he'd give a storming performance and score a worldy. For me he wasn't consistent enough and turning the clock back to Martin / Bryson-Hendrick .. With Hughes as the young creative impact player isn't an option. Hughes has moved us on and we need a particular shaped piece to fit the jigsaw don't say I am right in any of this, just speculating that it isn't all about holding central striker or conservative defenders. Which seems to be the bulk technical armchair tacticians discussions we have on here ( me included !) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 3 hours ago, Alpha said: I agree with what your saying I just don't call it strength and pace. We need someone who's got the killer instinct that Bradley Johnson has but is better with his feet. Johnson has the mentality to be the aggressive, most advanced midfielder. He has enough pace and plenty of strength. However when he has the ball at his feet he becomes either overly careful or tries to hit the hardest pass in football (from the edge of the final third dipped over a defence). If he had the ball carrying ability of say Butterfield then that would be good. Butterfield is obviously just a bit too patient. But strength and pace, Johnson has that for that role. Hendrick had enough of that. It's just Hendrick and Bryson could get their heads up and look lively with the ball. Johnson can't. Somebody, whether it be Butters, Bryson, Johnson or someone else, is going to have to be braver on the ball. Be more aggressive and decisive. Cut out the head tennis. Stop kicking it where it came from. Stop waiting for Tom Ince to pull the rabbit out of the hat. Stop waiting for Hughes to do it all. They're all too fragile. Effected too much by the momentum of the game. Apply pressure to them and they do stop playing. Hughes doesn't. Even on a bad day he never stops trying to drive. But his role has more defensive support than the other role needs to. The other CM should be more focused on attacking. Like Bryson and Hendrick can do. Like Butterfield has done on occasion. Especially the last bit Alpha .. This is exactly what I mean .. The player I want should be there in Johnson or Butterfield. In a sense they are both nearly there but something falls short as you so eloquently describe. Coaching or mindset or ability I am not sure which. ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 5 minutes ago, smiths_tavrn said: There was a Burnley fan on here saying how well Jeff was playing for them. He probably doesn't dare go missing under Dyche, a right royal rollicking awaits if he did. He was fairly bland for much of the season and has started performing since Deffour was moved out wide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barnsley ram Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 32 minutes ago, jono said: I'm not slashing wrsts at all. We have a good team. I am just suggesting that we all get into hyper discussions about the relative merits and failings of our attack and defence but I feel that those things would lessen considerably with the right style of midfielder to compliment Will. It should be Butterfield but I don't think he has hit his stride for us yet. ok fair play we all have our opinions to which we are entitled Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsnip Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 An explosive midfielder like that Ndidi chap who damaged us last night would be lovely but i bet he cost a bob or two? I like our midfield when Hughes is in it - Butterfield for me isn't adequete cover for Hughes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malagaram Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 16 minutes ago, Parsnip said: An explosive midfielder like that Ndidi chap who damaged us last night would be lovely but i bet he cost a bob or two? I like our midfield when Hughes is in it - Butterfield for me isn't adequete cover for Hughes. Signed from Genk for £15 Million.! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ariotofmyown Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Did anyone else apart think Gerrard was massively over-rated? He epitomised the tactically naive English player who ran around a lot and got stuck in. Often overhit passes and positionally wayward. He had a good long range shot on him though and scored a few. He was great in a few chaotic games such as the champions league final 2nd half. Was usually poor in any games that were more cagey ie most England games. He should have gone abroad and learned how to play a different sort of game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uttoxram75 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 We are at our best when we move the ball quickly. That's why Butters, Bradley and Shackell don't always look the part. Individually they are decent players but if you play a system of pinging the ball quickly like the end of Clough/start of Mac era then those players are not what we needed. Its not strength and pace we need, its quickness of thought, football intelligence and orders from the bench for the midfield to push on at every chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uttoxram75 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 6 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said: Did anyone else apart think Gerrard was massively over-rated? He epitomised the tactically naive English player who ran around a lot and got stuck in. Often overhit passes and positionally wayward. He had a good long range shot on him though and scored a few. He was great in a few chaotic games such as the champions league final 2nd half. Was usually poor in any games that were more cagey ie most England games. He should have gone abroad and learned how to play a different sort of game. Gerrard needed a midfield partner like George Thorne who would sit in front of the back four and give him the freedom to roam. Why successive England managers thought him and Lampard could play together is totally beyond me. Probably cost us a final place if not a win on more than one occasion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 We have the players but we just don't move the ball well enough or quick enough that will either come or the personnel will be changed and currently both butterfield and Johnson are the most likely to give way in my opinion but we will see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 31 minutes ago, uttoxram75 said: Gerrard needed a midfield partner like George Thorne who would sit in front of the back four and give him the freedom to roam. Why successive England managers thought him and Lampard could play together is totally beyond me. Probably cost us a final place if not a win on more than one occasion. Absolute travesty that between them Barry and Carrick aren't anywhere near as many caps as either Gerrard or Lampard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 4 hours ago, sage said: Daniel Johnson at Preston. Would cost a couple of mill i guess. Yeah he does look good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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