RoyMac5 Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 1 minute ago, Tony Le Mesmer said: Why don't you text him or ring him yourself Benty instead of an easy generic unfeeling tweet? This is the world of footballers on twitter IMO. Vacuous generic praising of 'great support ' from fans. Showing your age there Tony. I think social media means a bit more to the younger generation mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Le Mesmer Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 Just now, RoyMac5 said: Showing your age there Tony. I think social media means a bit more to the younger generation mate. I'm just about 40. I just think it's too easy nowadays to fire off messages just because it fills a void and is expected rather than it done personally with meaning. We're all supposed to be so connected now with our hero footballers yet we've never been so further apart IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Le Mesmer Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 Check out Richard Brodie anyway. Model pro. Model citizen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 1 minute ago, Tony Le Mesmer said: I'm just about 40. I just think it's too easy nowadays to fire off messages just because it fills a void and is expected rather than it done personally with meaning. Oh well I quite enjoy some of the tweets, and not just the parody accounts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 Happens everywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyD Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 There is a blame culture with society in general, and not just footy fans, and not just Derby fans Its all part of the "I want it and I want it now culture" If something good doesn't happen, or something bad happens, then it must be someone's fault Its an unfortunate part of modern society, driven by instant modern communication methods that allows anonymous public criticism and a broader legal/insurance/social security system that in modern times positively rewards those looking for the scapegoat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Le Mesmer Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 38 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: Oh well I quite enjoy some of the tweets, and not just the parody accounts! You don't know Brodie then obviously Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagerbob Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 Expectancy plays a huge part. As does Mel and his millions raising those expectations. Mel and the club try to play it down sometimes, but our own fans, other teams fans and the media expect us to do better than we usually do. I wont say I was happy under the years of ousterity under Clough, but at least we were $hit and we knew we were. Sometimes it seems like Derby have tried to buy the league, but we arent any better off. Plus in this year Villa and Newcastle have raised the bar with the size of their club, and the parachute payments they have trying to get back up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warren Hobhead Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 I think it's probably a general thing, I doubt it's just our club. But it's tedious at best and at worst it can't be helpful. I don't ever join in with that kind of stuff, maybe I'm just a nice, happy go lucky bloke? I know I like the underdog though, I used to study law so maybe I can't help but defend people? I sell property these days and maybe that's why I only see the good in a product? Wow. I'm getting a bit deeper into this than I expected. So yeah, I think it's clear we all have our own MO. But the negative voices online and at the games always seem the loudest... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Le Mesmer Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 2 hours ago, Mafiabob said: Happens everywhere. 2 hours ago, Mafiabob said: Happens everywhere. This is true although I think less so in the lower leagues. At Championship level and above the descrepancy in salary between the ordinary fan and the players is so great that I feel subconsciously some fans feel it ok to berate and criticise. At Macclesfield on 750 quid a week or whatever it is then the fans feel closer to the players and perhaps are more forgiving. All comes down to money really I think and maybe a bit of the green eyed monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamworthram Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 2 hours ago, jagerbob said: Expectancy plays a huge part. As does Mel and his millions raising those expectations. Mel and the club try to play it down sometimes, but our own fans, other teams fans and the media expect us to do better than we usually do. I wont say I was happy under the years of ousterity under Clough, but at least we were $hit and we knew we were. Sometimes it seems like Derby have tried to buy the league, but we arent any better off. Plus in this year Villa and Newcastle have raised the bar with the size of their club, and the parachute payments they have trying to get back up. Generally speaking we're not $hit now just not as good as many of us think we should be. I'd rather have what we've got now - a relatively big fish with high expectations (often leading to disappointment though) than just mediocre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 I think it's absolutely clear that a culture of blame exists. I don't feel that it's a particularly small minority either. A ready made example would be the 'Richard Keogh - Always Got A Mistake in Him' thread on this forum which runs to dozens of pages and concerns a player who is a 2 time POTY. There are numerous other examples that could be cited as the OP points out and my feeling is that beyond just simple moaning, the treatment of some players is often toxic - the booing of Bradley Johnson whilst in a slump in form is an obvious example. Quite what folk hope to achieve by booing a player coming on as a substitute is completely beyond me and it does the broader fan base no favours IMO. There's a significant difference between a 'fan' and a 'supported in my mind and the clues are in the words themselves. Yes we all are entitled to an opinion and if it's a negative one then I guess that's ok too if it is expressed in a valid and constructive fashion. Just calling a player 'bang average, rubbish, useless' and the like, however, says more about those standing in judgement than it ever will the player in question. Entitlement is a particularly unattractive trait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerbyMark Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 I blame Donald Trump... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 What pisses me off is the enthusiasm and eagerness a lot of people show to attack the club and team. The team lose a game, the club don't sign a player, the manager makes an unpopular substitution and boom! The nastiness aimed at them is what you'd expect from a rival supporter aimed at Derby. And when we're on the up the expectation leaps up. And what's worse is due to the pressure that comes when we are competing for something our fans turn into big crybabies It was the same under Mac last time. When we're ***** then people tend to stick by the club. They do moan but they're not as nasty with it. As it is now it's horrible. Just look on here through the threads. Nobody escapes OTT criticism. If I felt like that about Derby County I'd either quit watching or buy a red shirt with a tree on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsnip Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 KBB OUT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 I asked to Mel a few months back to view this forum as a pub table, load of mates sat around having a laugh, a lot will be said in jest or knee jerk frustration after a poor performance try not to take it to heart. Couple weeks ago whilst talking he said I'm finally getting it, the personalities behind a username, the banter between members, had you just been sent a link, read this, it could be taken completely the wrong way. Also how new members sometimes can find it difficult to join in. Imagine walking up to a pub table, group of lads having a laugh and attempt to join in. It is something that's played on my mind a little as we're not always the most welcoming.....ahem Eddie. Largely this forum I would say is fairly positive whilst things are going well, most attempts at scapegoating a player are shut down by the majority (not always within forum rules). If you break up the Keogh always has a mistake in him topic it's probably 98% in support of Keogh, same with Vydra not fit to wear a Derby shirt. We don't block negative topics, remove any scapegoat attempts, this isn't Sky or BBC with a political agenda. I won't deny locking the Keogh thread hasn't crossed my mind once or twice as it's being bumped a lot with how good was Keogh today yet still has that ugly title for the world to see. You would be very naive to think anything said online doesn't get back to the players, having said that I doubt they would read every page and understand some of the more sarcastic replies to see the amount of support they have. As fans I do think we need to be more aware of the power our voices have, maybe take a leaf out of Ed Dawes book with his slept on it thoughts. This ability to have our opinions heard in real time can have a seriously negative impact on the club and players. Anyone thinking they need to man up, do the job they are paid for and we won't moan need to stop and think, these are young men, no amount of money can buy you thick skin. Some players have it, some won't. It's a personality trait money can't buy. Why read online? Good question I guess, imagine hundreds of people are online talking about you, would you be tempted to see what they are saying good and bad? I find it hard to not peek at other forums or banned members are taking a pop at me. I do wonder if it could play a very small part in players joining/leaving clubs, we all want to be loved right, sat around on deadline day, SSN with rumoured interest, phone in hand waiting for a call, what are the fans saying. Could argue Villa fans successfully blocked the move to appoint McClaren, how's Steve Bruce getting on? It's not just fan forums, Twitter and Facebook have given fans the platform to voice their opinions to the masses in real time, it's created a large number of fans that use their anonymity to post comments for the shock value in a bid to earn e-popularity through likes and retweets, some just love to wind other fans up. You see them with pinned tweets on their profiles proudly displaying an offensive tweet to a player that received several thousand retweets, take those away and get them round a pub table or on a podcast ahem and you will find they are normal level headed fans. People are right when they say it's not just Derby fans, doesn't make it right. Bigger the club the more of these fans you get. It's also not just fans, you have betting companies trolling players and clubs with memes after results, trying to gain followers which give more eyes on when the special betting odds tweet goes out. So to answer the question yes. Stop, think, post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 I think it would help if fans could live in the moment. It's bad enough that there have been umpteen transfer threads going manic through January but the window has barely closed and we're already planning who we will dump and who we will spend a shed load of money on in the summer. We always want more and we want it now. It's the same at games, a marked lack of patience if we haven't gone in front after ten minutes. Watch the game and encourage the players, applaud occasionally (I am amazed at the people round me who don't clap the teams out, or for winning a throw in or a well intentioned pass that didn't quite find its target. ) Some don't even applaud when we score. Would you go to the theatre or a concert and not applaud? Maybe some of you would. As for criticism of players, they do hear the shouts, we know as they say so. So why not a "keep going" or something encouraging instead of the swearing and the negativity? Even on here I read xx is crap, rubbish, should be sold, is deadwood all the time. Really? Criticise the performance certainly but not the person. I don't think any of our players are crap, I think some of them are sometimes out of form, or don't play well in a particular game, or don't fit the way we play etc etc. Say that, don't dismiss the person. It is a habit we have got into as a society this extreme expression, it is self-destructive to both the giver and the receiver. It's not happy clapping to be open-minded and to recognise and be positive where it's due. I think I mentioned in another thread about the altercation in the stand at Newcastle between one of our own fans and Butterfield's mother. Is that really what some of us have come to? Don't we realise that these players are just young men? I know that people will respond to this post excusing the behaviour because this is how it is. What a cop out! We are all collectively the result of individual behaviours, and we can only change the collective by changing ourselves. I try very hard to be positive before and during games. Until that final whistle blows we are in there with a chance of a win, or a draw or of reducing the deficit. My small actions maybe encourage others occasionally to think likewise. I hope so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 Yes we do have a scapegoat / blame culture KBB and its all your bloody fault !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 To @angieram and @David Posts above are excellent, thoughtful and eloquent. Haven't quoted them owing to length but found myself nodding as I read (in agreement not drowsiness ). I don't claim to be perfect and admit to the occasional criticism of an action but believe that to be ok - if reasoned and minus any inference that because one action hasn't worked then that defines a player to be poor/bad/c**p. I too witnessed our fans turning on each other at Brentford last season. At least one side were exhorting the other to stop the criticism, even if their method meant it was a bit difficult to tell them apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tweetendipity Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Answer: yes there is. Everyone has criticism of a performance good or bad. People/ fans will not only 'blame' but also 'praise' any player they feel has been outstanding. Players (like anyone else) need to know how to filter 'constructive criticism' vs 'verbal diarrhoea' and use it to improve or maintain standards of their game being in the public eye. Let's face it ....if you had 30,000 people watching you doing your job- would you be naive to think they have no opinion in how you carry out your job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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