Jacob Butterfield - Winger OR Midfielder

[Alph]

So now Martin has gone Ninos will post irrational hatred about Butterfield. 

If I wasn't a mod I think I'd put you on ignore brother. It's a little bit weird. 

There's plenty of people we all love and hate in football but we don't twist everything to prove they're good/crap and then bang on about it all the time. 

It gets to a point where there's no reason to take your opinion on board because it's so tragically warped by your agenda. 

You want Butterfield to be crap. And he will be crap. Always to you he will be crap. 

You did it with Martin. 

And as soon as I see either names in your post then I just skip to the next post because it's just hating. No point debating with you.

I've seen other people disagree with you, then post up stats that back their argument, then go into specific examples and then even post videos. And you still repeat your original stance with acknowledging anything presented to you. 

It's very odd. 

 

[Ninos]

4 hours ago, Derby_EnglandLoyal said:

Disagreed. Butterfield over Bryson every day of the week. Bryson will have to get used to it being on the bench.. 

It's quite telling that the crowd loves Bryson and sings his name - second only to Hughes. They could care less whether Butterfield plays. I recommend you watch Butterfields movement when he doesn't have the ball. It's almost like he's never learned where he needs to go.

[Ninos]

2 hours ago, Alpha said:

So now Martin has gone Ninos will post irrational hatred about Butterfield. 

If I wasn't a mod I think I'd put you on ignore brother. It's a little bit weird. 

There's plenty of people we all love and hate in football but we don't twist everything to prove they're good/crap and then bang on about it all the time. 

It gets to a point where there's no reason to take your opinion on board because it's so tragically warped by your agenda. 

You want Butterfield to be crap. And he will be crap. Always to you he will be crap. 

You did it with Martin. 

And as soon as I see either names in your post then I just skip to the next post because it's just hating. No point debating with you.

I've seen other people disagree with you, then post up stats that back their argument, then go into specific examples and then even post videos. And you still repeat your original stance with acknowledging anything presented to you. 

It's very odd. 

 

I'm sorry that your title prevents you from ignoring me. If it bothers you so much that you don't like my posts then give up as mod and then put me on ignore.  You're just creating a straw man here though, as have others.  I don't hate Martin and I don't hate Butterfield. I just don't believe either help Derby County much. In fact they hinder and stifle our potential, jb much less so. Butterfield was brought in as cover for Hughes and that's what he is - cover for Hughes. Under NP, we suffered from being STATIC in the attacking third and if you watched closely and I did (there were other culprits) but Butterfield has been extremely static. Yes he was better v Leeds but he can't touch Bryson for getting open and creating passing channels. 

This isn't about hatred etc that's just weak  to imply that: I think Bryson is vastly underrated for the record because he's been played out of position for a long time now. Hope mac will be sensible and fix it. 

 

[brady1993]

22 minutes ago, Ninos said:

It's quite telling that the crowd loves Bryson and sings his name - second only to Hughes. 

What an odd argument to make. The only thing that is telling about it is he the longest serving member of the current squad and is an easy character to like. Butterfield has been here just over a year and the club has had a fair share of turmoil in that time, I wouldn't expect him to have that same kind of fan recognition.

22 minutes ago, Ninos said:

They could care less whether Butterfield plays

So they do care that he plays ? 

22 minutes ago, Ninos said:

I recommend you watch Butterfields movement when he doesn't have the ball. It's almost like he's never learned where he needs to go.

I did, and he did good job of making himself available for the ball. As exemplified by the fact he had the 5th most touches (60 in total) of any Derby player despite being subbed after 74 mins. And before you argue that was because he was dallying on the ball, he made 50 passes, so he was having 1.2 touches for every pass indicating he was moving the ball on quickly.

His off the ball movement isn't as good as Brysons but it's still good. And what he lacks there he makes up in other areas.

[Warren Hobhead]

4 minutes ago, Ninos said:

I'm sorry that your title prevents you from ignoring me. If it bothers you so much that you don't like my posts then give up as mod and then put me on ignore.  You're just creating a straw man here though, as have others.  I don't hate Martin and I don't hate Butterfield. I just don't believe either help Derby County much. In fact they hinder and stifle our potential, jb much less so. Butterfield was brought in as cover for Hughes and that's what he is - cover for Hughes. Under NP, we suffered from being STATIC in the attacking third and if you watched closely and I did (there were other culprits) but Butterfield has been extremely static. Yes he was better v Leeds but he can't touch Bryson for getting open and creating passing channels. 

This isn't about hatred etc that's just weak  to imply that: I think Bryson is vastly underrated for the record because he's been played out of position for a long time now. Hope mac will be sensible and fix it. 

 

Yes, let's fix it. I'm not happy about Butterfield playing well in three consecutive games and us getting 7 points. I preferred it when Bryson was central and we managed less points, over a 9 game period. 

 

I'm happy with our recent form. If Butters, Will or whoever start to drop off in terms of form then back in comes Bryson. That's how I'd like to think it works. But too often since Butters has been here he's been quickly dropped or unused. The last time he had a stretch of games in his strongest position we were winning games and sat top of the league. With Johnson alongside. 

 

Feels familiar. I hope the team continue to re-find their form. I'm enjoying watching us again. But Bryson and others need to be ready to step up when called upon. Long season. Squad game. 

 

Looking forward to tomorrow night. Up the RAMS. 

[brady1993]

2 minutes ago, Warren Hobhead said:

Yes, let's fix it. I'm not happy about Butterfield playing well in three consecutive games and us getting 7 points. I preferred it when Bryson was central and we managed less points, over a 9 game period. 

 

I'm happy with our recent form. If Butters, Will or whoever start to drop off in terms of form then back in comes Bryson. That's how I'd like to think it works. But too often since Butters has been here he's been quickly dropped or unused. The last time he had a stretch of games in his strongest position we were winning games and sat top of the league. With Johnson alongside. 

 

Feels familiar. I hope the team continue to re-find their form. I'm enjoying watching us again. But Bryson and others need to be ready to step up when called upon. Long season. Squad game. 

 

Looking forward to tomorrow night. Up the RAMS. 

Agree with you here @Warren Hobhead. Rather than bickering over who should play out of Butterfield or Bryson. We should be grateful we have three quality attacking midfielders to choose from, all of whom offer something slightly different. This gives us options based on what our game plan is or what the game situation is. Also we aren't (as) worried if somebody takes a knock and needs to miss a game because we have a top quality player to slot right in.

We've played well as the team in the previous 3 games, Butterfield has played well and is showing signs of a growing understanding between him and Hughes. Why should we disrupt that ? Now we've gone back to 433 and Johnson's form as a DM has seemingly solved our DM worries, the midfield 3 are the least of our worries. The current biggest problem is getting the best front 3 (whichever combination it turns out to be) on the pitch and get them firing.

[Mostyn6]

Dear @Ninos,

Last 30 appearances for Derby, Butterfield has been far more effective and influential than Bryson. Scored more goals, more assists, more accurate passes, less errors and been more committed. 

regards

Football

[RadioactiveWaste]

I think @Ninos just has a thing about beards.

Martin wasn't as good when he got his ratty fluff going on, Butters with his lil beard....i bet Hughes only gets away with it because you can hardly see it and he's so good he could get MOTM whilst taking a dump in the centre circle.

You like Sam Rush Ninos?.....his goaty coming at you......you're going to give him what he wants.......?

Anyway, moving on, Butterfield, no not a winger. Tidy midfielder for the division? yes. good as Hughes? no. If he didn't have faults, would he be here? no.

[brady1993]

8 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said:

Dear @Ninos,

Last 30 appearances for Derby, Butterfield has been far more effective and influential than Bryson. Scored more goals, more assists, more accurate passes, less errors and been more committed. 

regards

Football

Whilst I don't doubt for a second you're correct. Could you link/show me how you isolated these stats if it's not too much hassle ?

I'm  just interested in looking at them.

[PodgeyRam]

2 hours ago, Mostyn6 said:

Dear @Ninos,

Last 30 appearances for Derby, Butterfield has been far more effective and influential than Bryson. Scored more goals, more assists, more accurate passes, less errors and been more committed. 

regards

Football

Think it might be worth noting that for more than a few of those 30 games Bryson was coming back from a serious knee injury, meaning he obviously wasn't going to hit the ground running like Butterfield (who fortunately hasn't been injured).

Anyhow, I think that's a misunderstanding of Bryson's best style of play. He isn't like Butterfield, in terms of creativity on the ball, vision and passing ability. He is far better at timing his runs into the box and at those short, snapppy passes in and around the edge of the opposition area - how many times of the past season or so have we said that we need more players in the box?  Bryson offers that, while Butterfield simply doesn't do it as well.

Not sure there's anyone more committed than Bryson at the club to be honest apart from Keogh (and Bucko if he was still here).

It's about what is best for the team. Is Butterfield a good player? Yeah, no ones denying that, but I think and so does @Ninos from the sounds of it, think that Bryson suits the team more.

 

 

 

[Ninos]

4 minutes ago, PodgeyRam said:

Think it might be worth noting that for more than a few of those 30 games Bryson was coming back from a serious knee injury, meaning he obviously wasn't going to hit the ground running like Butterfield (who fortunately hasn't been injured).

Anyhow, I think that's a misunderstanding of Bryson's best style of play. He isn't like Butterfield, in terms of creativity on the ball, vision and passing ability. He is far better at timing his runs into the box and at those short, snapppy passes in and around the edge of the opposition area - how many times of the past season or so have we said that we need more players in the box?  Bryson offers that, while Butterfield simply doesn't do it as well.

Not sure there's anyone more committed than Bryson at the club to be honest apart from Keogh (and Bucko if he was still here).

It's about what is best for the team. Is Butterfield a good player? Yeah, no ones denying that, but I think and so does @Ninos from the sounds of it, think that Bryson suits the team more.

 

 

 

Precisely. Someone gets it. Bryson and Hughes in the attacking midfield slots complement each other and the centre forward far better than having Hughes and mini-Hughes playing there. 

[Ninos]

6 hours ago, eddie said:

Do you do anything except bloody whine?

Yes. White whine when out with the lady. 

[YorkshireRam]

8 minutes ago, Ninos said:

Precisely. Someone gets it. Bryson and Hughes in the attacking midfield slots complement each other and the centre forward far better than having Hughes and mini-Hughes playing there. 

They did with Martin playing up front. Currently we have Vydra, a player who thrives off intricately placed through balls which Buttefield is far more likely to provide than Bryson due to his better passing ability.

Therefore, as it stands, Butterfield > Bryson

[RamsPolls]

7 hours ago, Ninos said:

Precisely. Someone gets it. Bryson and Hughes in the attacking midfield slots complement each other and the centre forward far better than having Hughes and mini-Hughes playing there. 

 

7 hours ago, YorkshireRam said:

They did with Martin playing up front. Currently we have Vydra, a player who thrives off intricately placed through balls which Buttefield is far more likely to provide than Bryson due to his better passing ability.

Therefore, as it stands, Butterfield > Bryson

Bang on... If we had a Martin style player up top who linked up players and held the ball up then yes. Bryson would be the man. But Vydra is not that style, he is a player who gets in behind and likes to stretch the defenders. That's why we need a talented midfielder who can pass through the eye of a needle. And when he's on his game, Butterfield is that man.

[Mostyn6]

8 hours ago, Ninos said:

Precisely. Someone gets it. Bryson and Hughes in the attacking midfield slots complement each other and the centre forward far better than having Hughes and mini-Hughes playing there. 

But Butterfield has been better than Hughes.

Surely, Hughes is the mini-Butterfield.

Hughes is neat and tidy, and looks the part, but thus far in his career, he's yet to influence things.

[Animal is a Ram]

Bryson and Hughes works well. 

But so does Hughes and Butterfield. I was disappointed in Bryson when he came on vs Leeds, he looked like he'd been out on the pitch for the rest of the game. Johnson did more in the last 20 mins.

Players are in the side on merit. Butterfield is outperforming Bryson. Simple as that.

[cannable]

The whole idea behind Bryson and Martin is that Martin dropped into the ten space and orchestrated things and Bryson would make runs in behind. 

So with Vydra making runs in behind we need somebody to drift into the ten space and play it through. Who would you want doing this; Butters or Bryson?

[RamsPolls]

3 minutes ago, cannable said:

The whole idea behind Bryson and Martin is that Martin dropped into the ten space and orchestrated things and Bryson would make runs in behind. 

So with Vydra making runs in behind we need somebody to drift into the ten space and play it through. Who would you want doing this; Butters or Bryson?

Butterfield all the way.

Love Bryson but he's not as technically gifted as JB.

[Dale The Ram]

Does anyone else see Butterfield as the Championship equivalent of Santi Cazorla?

Short, good balance, good with both feet, can pass, can shoot.

[europia]

1 minute ago, Dale The Ram said:

Does anyone else see Butterfield as the Championship equivalent of Santi Cazorla?

Short, good balance, good with both feet, can pass, can shoot.

I wish he was, but a million miles off in terms of ability.

To answer the original post:  Butterfield not a winger, no way.