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HantsRam

Brexit or Eurin?

How are you voting on 23rd June?  

290 members have voted

  1. 1. EU Vote

    • Stay in the EU
      133
    • Leave the EU
      134
    • Not voting
      7


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8 hours ago, King Kevin said:

Every time we have a general election a fair proportion of the electorate do not get their desires outcome .They suck it up get on with and I have never know a re run election .

Remain lost suck it up, you never know it's a big brave world out there with more oportuntities than a closed uncompetitive shop .But that's the issue I have with remainers no  vision, no bottle..

Right - we don't re-run elections, but we DO have regular elections. Where people get to decide if they still want to vote the same way they did last time. And they base that on what has happened in the preceding 5 years, how the incumbent government has been performing and what the opposing parties are offering.

So to criticise the thought of a second EU referendum at some point in the future isn't an affront to democracy - it IS democracy. It would be perfectly acceptable to have a future second referendum - especially if it was going spectacularly wrong or there was a clear decision to be made. Otherwise you may as well scrap elections and say "well we voted in the Tories in 2015 = we can't vote again. We've decided. It's the will of the people - we must have a Tory government whatever happens! FOREVER!"

 

 

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On ‎18‎/‎10‎/‎2017 at 13:16, G STAR RAM said:

@ariotofmyown @StivePesley I notice you both mention that we should remain and reform.

What have you seen that gives you any hope that the EU are prepared to reform? 

Good question - at the time I hadn't really seen anything that gave me hope that the EU are prepared to reform, but actually the UK vote to leave and the subsequent ripples that has sent across the other member states makes me think that the EU now has no choice but to reform. That might be wishful thinking, but

 

On ‎18‎/‎10‎/‎2017 at 13:16, G STAR RAM said:

All I've seen is complete disregard and contempt towards its second largest net contributor

I'd disagree with that - I think that's just a reflection of our own arrogance that we view the EUs behaviour as contemptuous. In actual fact I think they've behaved exactly how you'd expect them to behave given the fact that WE voted to leave. They have to focus on the process of disengaging with us. This wasn't their decision. The fact that we seem to think they should be somehow gracious and accommodating about it.

It's like me telling my wife I no longer love her and want to move out, but then telling her I want to come round and have her cook my tea every night while I save up for a microwave and a kettle, and oh can she do my washing and ironing for a while because I need to sort out my own washing machine and iron etc

Simply put, What responsibility do the EU have to make our rash decision any less painful for us?

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16 minutes ago, StivePesley said:

Right - we don't re-run elections, but we DO have regular elections. Where people get to decide if they still want to vote the same way they did last time. And they base that on what has happened in the preceding 5 years, how the incumbent government has been performing and what the opposing parties are offering.

So to criticise the thought of a second EU referendum at some point in the future isn't an affront to democracy - it IS democracy. It would be perfectly acceptable to have a future second referendum - especially if it was going spectacularly wrong or there was a clear decision to be made. Otherwise you may as well scrap elections and say "well we voted in the Tories in 2015 = we can't vote again. We've decided. It's the will of the people - we must have a Tory government whatever happens! FOREVER!"

 

 

I'm pretty sure the idea for the referendum was a 'once in a generation' decision - you're sounding very like Sturgeon demanding another go any sooner than in 30 years time....

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5 minutes ago, Gaspode said:

I'm pretty sure the idea for the referendum was a 'once in a generation' decision - you're sounding very like Sturgeon demanding another go any sooner than in 30 years time....

Maybe that was a nice media spin on it - but nowhere is that written in stone

I think we've already agreed in the past that holding the referendum when we did was a big mistake by Cameron. Neither side was ready to campaign properly. Neither side had any sort of plan. Triggering A50 without a plan was another massive mistake.

I'm not saying there should or shouldn't be a second referendum - I was just saying that it shouldn't be discounted if it feels like the right thing to do.

I'm no fan of Sturgeon, and I don't see another Scottish independence referendum happening for fun. I think if it does happen it will be triggered by whatever comes out of Brexit

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