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HantsRam

Brexit or Eurin?

How are you voting on 23rd June?  

290 members have voted

  1. 1. EU Vote

    • Stay in the EU
      133
    • Leave the EU
      134
    • Not voting
      7


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Do we have personal experiences that add credence to the debate on either side?

Personally I am very disappointed with the quality of debate so far. My industry is UK financial services so don't believe there would be an apocalypse if we left. 

I'd be more concerned if cheap wine imports dried up.

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we wont have an apocalypse either way, it is a shame that Mr Cameron has decided that the BBC will be his personal voice, I pay my TV licence and I would like an equal amount of debate, its going to be the Scottish Referendum all over again and fear will rule the day.

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The UK is one of 10 member states who pay more into the EU budget than they get out - only France and Germany contribute more. In 2014/15, Poland was the largest beneficiary, followed by Hungary and Greece.

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It's the constant expansion of the EU that is quickly turning me off the concept, more than anything else.

The EU has demonstrated in recent years that it is incapable of responding quickly to events & to the satisfaction of all. How exactly is bringing Turkey and Ukraine amongst others into the fold going to make that any easier?.

I know it's all politics but I'm thinking if they are hell bent on expanding the EU to both IS's and Putin's back door. I don't want us to be part of that.

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29 minutes ago, LesterRam said:

The UK is one of 10 member states who pay more into the EU budget than they get out - only France and Germany contribute more. In 2014/15, Poland was the largest beneficiary, followed by Hungary and Greece.

Define "than they get out" though?

I get a bit bored of this argument about us "putting in more money than we get out" as a reason to leave. There are reasons that I think we should leave but this isn't one of them.

Purely because you can't reconcile the saving of that money if we left with the increased costs we may have as a non-EU member. It's only really a valid argument if you can present the before and after figures - which so far no one has been able to do.

Interesting that France & Germany contribute more than us. Presumably they have an even stronger EU-exit movement then?

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4 minutes ago, StivePesley said:

I get a bit bored of this argument about us "putting in more money than we get out" as a reason to leave. There are reasons that I think we should leave but this isn't one of them.

My problem with that argument is: are people saying that we should be recieving more in grants than we pay in?. How would that work then?. How is it fair that one of the richer countries would benefit financially from membership?.

Surely every country should be paying in more than they receive for it to be fair - with the EU admin costs being shared equally according to whatever formula is agreed?.

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28 minutes ago, StivePesley said:

Define "than they get out" though?

I get a bit bored of this argument about us "putting in more money than we get out" as a reason to leave. There are reasons that I think we should leave but this isn't one of them.

Purely because you can't reconcile the saving of that money if we left with the increased costs we may have as a non-EU member. It's only really a valid argument if you can present the before and after figures - which so far no one has been able to do.

Interesting that France & Germany contribute more than us. Presumably they have an even stronger EU-exit movement then?

That's exactly what people are doing though. Lecturing people won't convince anyone. Why do we need to pay to trade freely? This also isn't just about our trade with the EU. The three variables are our net fee, exports to the EU and exports to the rest of the world. The reality is that any short term decline in exports to the EU would be minuscule in comparison to the size of our economy.  

I would rather it be about democracy. In relation to trade, as has become the slogan. With friends like these who needs enemies. 

The reason why Germany and France care and contribute more is because they are central to the project. They are also in the Eurozone. Many analysts predict whether we are in or out, that the Euro faces a collapse in the next 10 years. Even Paul Mason was saying the other day that even if we vote remain we will be out in 10 years anyway with some associate membership as the rest of the EU integrates even further. 

Voting to remain is avoiding the inevitable in my opinion. 

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33 minutes ago, StivePesley said:

Define "than they get out" though?

I get a bit bored of this argument about us "putting in more money than we get out" as a reason to leave. There are reasons that I think we should leave but this isn't one of them.

Purely because you can't reconcile the saving of that money if we left with the increased costs we may have as a non-EU member. It's only really a valid argument if you can present the before and after figures - which so far no one has been able to do.

Interesting that France & Germany contribute more than us. Presumably they have an even stronger EU-exit movement then?

oh my ******* god, I just wrote a massive reply and it didn't publish..

well accounting figures are Calculated differently. The EU financial year runs from 1 January to 31 December, whereas the UK's runs from 1 April to 31 March, meaning there are different figures in circulation.

not forgetting trade agreements were written pre EU and they would still remain even if we leave, so the tiny bit of trade we manage with EU countries will stay, secondly our economy is service based (currently 87% and growing) so by 2030 we will have exhausted all of our manufacturing base with the EU, we also have the second largest trade deficit in the world so would that mean we would stop paying our creditors ?

sorry about this reply I have lost all motivation to rewrite it :angry:

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