alram

mike ashley is the only long term option, we need to stop chasing results and short term goals. players and managers will come and go.

we want the owner that will put us in the best position long term and thats ashley. 

we own the stadium, pay less to the creditors (even if it means -15, the CLUB is saving money) and he is showing with this process that hes not going to waste a penny of the clubs money. that is what we need whether people realise it or not. 

I certainly hope Kirchners "funds" dont clear. he should not be in the running.

throughout this process he is not only shown he is incompetent but also a complete coward. his silence has really rubbed me up the wrong way, if you seriously intend to still own the club - he should be saying so. you think people will just forget if it gets over the line?

ashley is letting the press do his talking, ck is communicating to nobody and appears like a sulking teenager. not old enough, not wise enough, not wealthy enough. should be moved on, but he wont be because he offers the best deal for the creditor and thats Q job.

Just now, twelveincher said:

He has been wrong at numerous times throughout the process, he’s also been right. 
People don’t have much to go on.

hes probably been right because he says so much. i am sure most of us have been right with our theories throughout.

he is a bag of hot air, doesn't deserve to be on this thread so much.

it is crazy to me that kirchner is still even in the running. I do not want that many running this club, it will not end well. he has shown himself not only to be incompetent, but his silence is the worst part about it. 

if his funds really were being processed (i dont buy it) then say it, instead of getting the hump and not saying anything. i wouldn't mind if he didn't say anything in the first place, but was happy to have people lick his bum and when it goes bad he disappears. his ownership will be like that. i cant believe Q are still allowing him to be a bidder.

i am also sick of reading statements, most of them don't even say anything they are just blowing their own trumpets.

get on with the f****** job.

I am sick to death of seeing alan nixons tweets in this thread. hes become the most frequent poster

The guy is clueless and has been continuiously wrong throughout this process, hes spent the last day backtracking and changing his story to suit the facts yet people still claim he is reliable

why are people even giving him the attention he so desperately craves and makes people pay for now by the way.

sick of him, sick of the admins, sick of mel morris, sick of everyone involved in this shambles. 

45 minutes ago, Woodley Ram said:

There isn’t a conspiracy, just a number of mistakes that have been costly. Far too many, but this is a general thing this year not just Derby 

i have been watching football for 40+ years and i have never seen it so bad as the current crop of referees yet they have the best technology avalible. the whole system needs reform 

32 minutes ago, S8TY said:

MM's support??? .....yes thats done us a lot of good.     MM's support should not be needed!!!! he walked away ...no responsibilty !! yet holds cards still .....Morris chose to walk away and put us into admin ....his own mess but chose to walk away...yet here he is still holding valuable important cards like the stadium because he wants 20m for it or so we believe...take your rose tinted glasses off Mel and chuck the ground in as part of club ....you walked away yet still influence our future ...a future you put into jeopardy ...who would buy a house but the back garden is owned by someone else...I find your efforts to stick up for yoursef Mel ( if it is you!)as pitiful and I've often wondered if you are a WUM I'm really not interested in your support of Morris ....he's put this club into severe danger and bailed out because he lost 200m ...so what? we were better off being run by the yanks and thats a fact.....

get your head out of your backside and stop making Morris out to be hard done by.....his fault 100 per cent ....lets hear your love for morris if this club folds!!

it is shocking that people have a single favourable thing to say about the man. he should never be allowed to show his face in this county again after what he has done

it is pure stockholm syndrome

18 minutes ago, B4ev6is said:

No one is what mel has done is wrong but he came back to deal with steve gibson and I think someone spoke to home truths but I do think mel should clear msd loans and hmrc people even pay admin out of his pocket maybe that why he want 20m for pp. But yes I think it is wrong to expect to buy stadium on it's own.

oh come on please do me a favour. you are saying that like he is on our side

FACT

if mel wanted to resolve any of the stadium, hmrc or msd problems, it would have been solved by now. the only one he solved was the one that would potentially cost HIM money

1 hour ago, tombomb said:

Do we think everything hinges on staying in the champioship? Might aswell start as a phoenix club if we get relegated with - 15points or is it not as simple as that? I think this is the reason for the delay. Just waiting to see if we stay up. Why would you spend 30million plus on league 1 club with 6 contracted players and any decent academy players already poached for peanuts. Wouldn't make sense

Q shouldnt have put the club in a position where the league we are in is relevant

any amount we cost in this league will be the same as us being in league one had we sold assets and not taken loans out to see the season. we have borrowed the same amount PLUS INTEREST that the tv revenues would be.

the biggest failure of Q has been they have not made the club cheaper to buy, in doing so it is highly unlikely we will find a buyer

a disaster scenario is we go down and still have all those loans we took out to pay

1 hour ago, Ambitious said:

Are the administrators the ones we should really be kicking? I noticed in the statement released by the Binnies that they were more than willing to buy the club for less than what it would cost to avoid a -15 point deduction next season. Are we really sure that's not currently what they're working against, people wanting to buy the club happy to take the -15 point deduction, and they're buying time trying to avoid that situation. 

I mean, what sort of atmosphere would there be around the club towards a new owner if they happily took a -15 point deduction next season to save a few £ against paying creditors.

Without knowing the ins and outs, but reading the tea leaves, there is a narrative that the administrators are trying to avoid further penalties going forward which obviously impacts fans. I would've thought anyone coming in to buy the club would obviously want to avoid that anyway, but seemingly not. 

i appreciate your positivity but i think the truth is closer to they would be delighted if the club will be here next season with a 15 point penalty 

if it was the case that there was more money on the table then they would have announced a pf , we like to think that its ashley and appleby fighting it out to be pf but is it really the truth? or has nobody offered the amount needed so we are back to square one

of course it would have all been made easier if Q acted like most admins do and made the club cheaper to buy. are we more expensive than the first month they took over? i am 90% sure that we are

as long as the club survive i dont care what happens, we could be in league two next season for all i care i just want a club to go and watch

6 minutes ago, Reggie Greenwood said:

It reads  to me that the Binnie’s bid was the lowest and other higher bids are being considered 

i hope so

we are desperate for some good news, can you imagine how grim it would be if rooney was doing a poor job on the pitch as well

So them bidding 30m and not coming close all but confirms that there is no deal to be done with hmrc

i am sorry but we are doomed. nobody is going to pay 50m for a club with no assets 

1 hour ago, Unlucky Alf said:

Hhhmmm, We weren't in Admin near end of last season ?‍♂️

yes but we were saying the potential buyers were waiting to see what division we were going to be in

29 minutes ago, CornwallRam said:

HMRC is obviously a negotiable cost, so it could well be that.

is it obvious? because all the noises around hmrc and the new ruling would suggest that its not negotiable? they went through the courts to get the ruling, they wont throw it out on the first case

15 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

Only guessing here...PBs are waiting untill the end of the season, Why pay 10s of millions if we're relegated, When you can pay multi millions less if relegation or liquidation.

It's a buyers market in a cellars game, Too many people whining ?

we were saying the same near the end of last season

4 minutes ago, Crewton said:

HMRC will have discussions with Administrators, but they won't "do deals" with anyone except the prospective purchaser, as they will effectively assuming liability for the debt and paying whatever is agreed. So there's no deal with HMRC to announce yet.

The announcement of a PB could indeed be down to the fact that no-one is yet offering enough to be granted that position, given what Quantuma know HMRC would be willing to accept in quantum or payment plans, or it could be that each bid has different terms for debt repayment and future funding that need further negotiation/clarification, or even that new potential buyers have emerged (though I think this latter possibility is a slim one).

Pushing one narrative when you have no inside information is pointless.

just saying it as i am seeing it crewton. we just differ in opinions.

if there was a deal to be done the PF would have been named by now. my instinct tells me they are playing hardball and thus no PF bidder can be named. Don't forget PF is the starting point. we are not even allowed to get around the table.

you know what Q could do to reduce speculation and narrative? tell us the truth, why is naming a PF proving so difficult. it should be one of the easiest parts of the process

1 minute ago, Crewton said:

It's already been stated by Quantuma that any final agreement with HMRC can only be done by the Preferred Bidder, so this is yet more speculative bollo.

and yet there is no preferred bidder. so if its not the hmrc bill, then what is holding it up? 

Q have stated a lot of things. how many of them have come to pass.

1 hour ago, Carl Sagan said:

Surely at this point, with next season's division still up in the air, there will be no preferred bidder and no sale? It's a question of waiting until we're definitely down or, unlikely but still possible, definitely up. If the latter it means almost certainly waiting until the end of the final game. 

In turn this informs the decision as to whether take a further 15 point deduction next season or stick to a business plan that sees the EFL maintain its financial straitjacket in an attempt to relegate us again. 

No options are good, with the additional pain of nothing happening for 3 more months unless we become cast adrift of safety. Need a little patience while the thread builds to 2000 pages. 

i worry that the division really doesnt make that much of a difference at all. the debts we are running up to even try and stay in the division are worrying and it would just be the difference between league one and championship anyway. huge investment will be needed next season to even stay up again and we are not in a position to do that.

what we should have done from minute 1 is try to make the club as cheap to buy as possible as survival as a club was always first goal, i feel like Q have just chased survival on the pitch and for it i worry. Why would you not sell more players to cover the costs to see out the season, instead we are in a position where we are having to take out loans to see the next month instead adding costs to the buyer. 

i know fans wont like it but pragmatism was needed from minute one, they have taken completely the wrong approach and i am looking at this with my financial hat on. they are not doing all they can to ensure this club lives another day.

13 minutes ago, RamBeauIV said:

Yeah, the best we can hope for is 25% or 35% to HMRC, but I doubt they will accept it. However, if one of the bidders has offered 50% to HMRC over 2-years in Championship or over 3-years if relegated, then that might need some discussion or clarification with HMRC.

Also worrying is whether the EFL will accept it.  Technically, they might have to - but hit us with a 2 or 3-year budget / crucifixion plan (e.g. can't pay fees for players etc.). They're adamant that the 12-point deduction was just the first part of the punishment. They're not gonna let us buy a player for say £1M or 2M if that money could have gone towards the creditors.

if HMRC were going to do a deal it would have been announced already. they are not budging, and for me thats putting people off.

of course that would all be solved if mel foot the bill himself, as he was the one using tax money to fund his toy for the past 2 years. 

people can forget any idea of us surviving as a club until a preferred bidder is named. 

all i personally want from Q at the moment is for them to explain why its so difficult to name a preferred bidder. was the boro hold up ever the main issue here? they told us it was. now a month later and zero progress has still been made.

what is holding it up. be honest with us.

my theory is there are actually no buyers willing to put close to the amount required for the club, but then again why would they. they could buy another championship club for half the price. and that would include a stadium and players.

Do not let the amazing spirit of the team and manager allow the administrators to hide behind it. There is only one side of the club letting everybody down at the minute and we know what it is

we need to see PROGRESS not false promises

18 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

No news on the takeover then….

i have given up waiting for news

10 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

A phoenix club would start at the bottom of the pyramid (as per AFC Bury). However, if still in essence the original club, they'll be placed at a suitable level.

If Man Utd went into liquidation, which league do you think they'd start in?

If a L2 side goes into liquidation, they'll start in the National League, most likely one of the North/South ones.

In Bury's case (the real one, not the phoenix club) next season they'll be in NL North or the tier below due to missing a season. They were in L1 in 19/20. Would have been in L2 in 20/21, NL in 21/22, so NL North would be the likely league in 22/23.

L2 for Derby in the circumstances presented is more than fair.

i agree its fair but good luck convincing the others clubs that, not only hasnt it happened before it would set a precident going forward which allows clubs to easily wipe debt. if man utd went into liquidation they would wipe billions in debt, any division they start in that isnt the 8th tier would be a huge advantage for them.

and the national league and football league are two different entities