Shaftesbury Street

So what does that mean exactly?
Are you no longer a fan?  Will you refuse to go to games?  Have you started to tell folks that you are not interested in football, or do you express a fondness for a different team now?
What exactly happens when we run out of patience with our beloved football club?
#intrigued
 

I have ran out of patience now. The piss poor communication from the club is appalling. What contingencies do we have if dont find a buyer before season start? 

I have ran out of patience now. The piss poor communication from the club is appalling. What contingencies do we have if dont find a buyer before season start? 

If one of our many journalist do not get anything from them, I doubt Joe average fan will get a response.

I have ran out of patience now. The piss poor communication from the club is appalling. What contingencies do we have if dont find a buyer before season start? 

Past. Present. Proud. New 21/22 Home Kits available now.

I have ran out of patience now. The piss poor communication from the club is appalling. What contingencies do we have if dont find a buyer before season start? 

Given the two failed takeovers, I wouldn't be surprised if they waited until the ink has dried on the contracts before announcing anything. 

Given the two failed takeovers, I wouldn't be surprised if they waited until the ink has dried on the contracts before announcing anything. 

Given the two failed takeovers, I wouldn't be surprised if they waited until the ink has dried on the contracts before announcing anything. 

Given the two failed takeovers, I wouldn't be surprised if they waited until the ink has dried on the contracts before announcing anything. 

Why are some folk so unable, unwilling or both, to assimilate a few simple facts concerning these charges? It's no small wonder that fans from other clubs have a poor opinion of us now, when some of our own fans, who ought to be better informed, are themselves the first to jump on any sniff of perceived wrongdoing. What possible benefit is there in wilfully ignoring what we know to be true in favour presupposing guilt at every corner? We've even got folk using the fact that we've not submitted the new accounts inside 48 hours as the latest stick with which to thrash the club. It simply beggars belief.
For the umpteenth time, there were two charges; one related to the valuation of our stadium and was summarily dismissed by the DC; the other related to our amortisation policy which was signed off on and approved under legal accounting standards by independent auditors, the auditors regulatory body, the DC and the ducking EFL themselves, the latter several times over a period of years. The amortisation policy charge was also initially dismissed by the DC for the aforementioned reasons. This left the EFL so desperate to save face that they appealed the decision, the outcome of which was predicted by myself and numerous others on this very thread: a small fine in order to secure the token win they need to maintain any ducking credibility at all AND NO POINTS DEDUCTION. 
At this point, I very much doubt that even the EFL will be willing to risk further embarrassment. They can kid themselves this paltry fine vindicates two years of unwarranted charges and appeals and get back to their principal role as lapdogs to Sky and the Premiership whilst paying themselves inflated salaries for doing so. As for the DC, I strongly suspect that they only agreed to what is a nominal fine in order to save the EFL from falling into further disrepute and to allow us to finally emerge from under an endless series of unfair and damaging embargos and to prevent the EFL from continuing what has become a spiteful and unwarranted campaign against a club whose chairman quite rightly questioned their business acumen. In doing so, they have vindicated Mel's opinion in spades, though the crushing irony of this has unsurprisingly escaped the EFL's notice and who will doubtless be celebrating spending millions to secure a £100k fine for their members' coffers.
If, as I strongly suspect, the EFL do not appeal this sanction, I think we will 'be the bigger man' and simply take the £100k hit in order to allow us to return to football matters rather than spending every waking hour addressing the embittered ramblings and actions of a so-called professional body that seems more intent on undermining its membership than serving it. 

Can someone find the quote/interview where Pearce said even if we readjusted the accounts for amortisation we would still meet FFP requirements?

That's sexual.

Regardless of the outcome, the EFL have lost any credibility to govern the league and if anything, our case has brought out the need to completely rebuild the hierarchy in charge of our division.
When the EFL originally lost the case against Mel and DCFC, the honorable thing to do by the EFL would have been to accept that loopholes in the rules were exposed and used to our advantage, however that is not down to the club being in the wrong. The accounts were signed off. They have taken zero responsibility for their part in this mess and have taken all steps to cover their failings. I am a critic of how Mel has ran the football club however I will back him against these muppets.
If the EFL had questioned our practices at the time, the club would have needed to accept the consequences for breaking rules. This was authorised by the league. If I was at work and I signed off somebody's documentation, I would be the one responsible for any repercussions if there were problems. 
Not fit for purpose.

Thanks for going into such detail, really good insight.
Obviously a lot of roadblocks for this. In terms of action, that depends on how the club looks in the next 6 months or so. If we are ever in a position where the clubs future is in doubt, I would urge other fans/supporters groups to take a serious look at this. 

So, had a phone call with a very helpful & knowledgeable chap from the FSA this afternoon. He didn’t dismiss the idea of fans taking over at Derby & believed a well-supported one club city would stand a better chance than most to bring about a successful fan ownership model. He also made reference to the Fan Led Review – a task force set up by Government that is specifically looking at facilitating greater fan control of clubs & sustainability. This is due to report later this year on recommendations.
He did however warn it would be extremely difficult, that the Championship in particular was a basketcase division & threw around some horrifying amounts that benevolent chairmen have had to spend to keep their clubs competitive (including Mel). Nothing to be fair we'd didn't already suspect.
Asked him a few questions on behalf of interested parties on here;
Q Have you had many past enquiries from fans of other big clubs? What were the sticking points?
Yes, plenty. General issue is either that the cost of the club is prohibitively expensive or the size of the debt is far too high for fans to reasonably service
Q What are the different types of fan ownership models?
Two main types; conventional Limited Company (with shares) or a CBS (Community Benefit Society) which is basically a mutual co-operative. A CBS has to have one member one vote irrespective of member contribution & any profits have to be ploughed back into the business. There is also potentially corporation tax exemption
Q Ways of raising money to fund a fan buyout?
Either selling shares in a conventional Limited company or via debentures/supporter bond – basically fans lend money to the new ownership group at a low rate of annual interest. Also very wise to go after High Net Worth individuals who support the club – this was the basis of the successful buy in at Portsmouth in 2013 & the purchase of the new Plough Lane ground by AFC Wimbledon in 2019
Q Standard fan involvement in fan owned clubs?
Generally is a membership scheme for a small fee which entitles each member to a vote. Supporters are then able to vote for members to be appointed to the Board, who will then appoint a Chief Executive to run the actual club (this is the model AFC Wimbledon use). Other big decisions such as a badge change, significant changes to ground etc will also go back to the membership but these can vary depending on what fans agree from the outset should go to a vote.
Q Best way of organising fans into a collective to launch a fan led buyout
Supporters Trust (yes, Ramstrust). They have the connections to FSA & are meant to represent the supporters’ interest as a whole.
 
Obviously the last point may not sit well with a few on here, particularly given the recent letter sent to the club on ‘behalf of the fans’ (I personally have no opinion on them). The guy I spoke to made it clear Ramstrust’s connections with the FSA meant they wouldn’t want to seriously engage with another DCFC group for fear of causing offence & that it would be in our best interests to bring all fan groups together (he also referenced Punjabi Rams). He certainly knew the individuals heading up Ramstrust & was also aware of some of the ill feeling from 2002-2005.
I hope the information above helps to give some perspective. I was also advised to speak to a colleague of his (when he returned from holiday) who actually led the fan buyout of Portsmouth in 2013. Think his knowledge would be invaluable particularly given similarities between a) Portsmouth & Derby as football clubs/fanbases & b) the debt mountain that had accumulated under previous ownerships
Before going down that avenue though, I think the ball is back in our court as fans i.e. is this something people want to come together & seriously look at?
For me, the route looks something a bit like this;
Form a specific group via this forum to throw around some ideas especially around gaining support from wider fanbase, getting funding & ideas for a potential constitution and then agree on a draft plan Approach major DCFC fan groups; yes, RamsTrust but also Punjabi Rams to present our plan, sell them the idea & then work on an actionable plan going forward. If this goes well, probably a good time to speak to the FSA contact who led the Portsmouth buyout for specific advice before ‘going public’ Potential two-pronged attack; float idea to fans across all social media channels/ conventional advertising in Derbyshire explaining the plan & asking for pledge of funds and target high net worth Derby fans to see if they can also commit to a pledge of funding Depending on what amount can credibly be raised via fans (and possibly externally) approach the club. We’re not going raise anywhere near £60m but a serious fraction of that may at least get us round a table No doubt about it, this is a real long shot but it’s going to happen to a large club one day – why couldn’t it be us? And even if it doesn’t come off, the thought of bringing the fanbase together & actually being proactive rather than passively accepting our fate, could recharge energy & enthusiasm amongst us.
Maybe naïve but that’s my take ?

That fickle attitude has stemmed from poor communication, poor financial decisions and fans not having a voice when it matters. 
Of course it doesn't have to be a fan owned model to improve this a lot of the above can improved with better ownership but the attitudes of fans will change drastically when they feel they are a part of something.
The fan experience in German football is something else and albeit not the main reason, but the 51% contributes to that 'our club' mentality which builds that unflinching support.
Cheap tickets and beer might also help ?

Perhaps you're right. Certainly, a year or two back I'd almost certainly have shared your outlook but recently I'm become rather jaded, partially by the upheavals at the club, I concede, but not wholly.
As for cheap tickets and beer, well what's not to like! I think also, however, that the German mentality and mindset lends itself better to such models than would be likely in dear old Blighty but perhaps that's a jaundiced outlook too.
I've mentioned the Union Berlin fans who seem as staunch as any I've seen and literally gave blood to finance their rebuild as well as committing over 140,000 man hours of labour. The fans seem to love a good old sing song and they can bounce too.  Check out the vid below and the madness at 7m 50s ?
 

That fickle attitude has stemmed from poor communication, poor financial decisions and fans not having a voice when it matters. 
Of course it doesn't have to be a fan owned model to improve this a lot of the above can improved with better ownership but the attitudes of fans will change drastically when they feel they are a part of something.
The fan experience in German football is something else and albeit not the main reason, but the 51% contributes to that 'our club' mentality which builds that unflinching support.
Cheap tickets and beer might also help ?

I've shared from their trust page. I only pay a lowly amount but solely as it keeps local people on a job ,I also used their training ground facilities for a man Vs fat football thing(pre accident) and I can currently afford to. If I couldn't,I'd just stop as can cancel anytime

Interested to hear peoples thoughts on this and if its actually a viable option. 
Just from a fag packet maths point of view (and the numbers being floated about) we would need £30 mill a year to run the club. This might improve as the costs are reduced and fans return but as a rough estimate. Then if we assume maybe 20k would invest, that's £1500 per year, per fan. Yeah....
The only way I can see that working, is if its propped up by a wealthy backer for a large share (or 49%) and fans have the main voting rights. 
We would also need to completely throw out our recruitment process. Potentially becoming an academy focused/ feeder club. I'd have no problem with this, so long as we set the player values in a tiered system and a 'the price is the price' policy. So we don't get our pants pulled down in the transfer market. (Tier 5 500k, tier 4 £1m, tiers 3 £1m-£3m) all with sell ons.
If money does come in for a player, we would need to either put that back into the academy or buy realistic targets. Maybe a more data led/ moneyball approach. Its not a perfect system at Brentford but its a hell of lot better system then ours! Big money sale, all 'member' fans to be reimbursed that season.
I appreciate this is dreamland, but with the pandemic, ESL and the very real prospect of our club going under, just thought I'd put it out there. 
Maybe someone with a bit of financial/ accounting background can tell me its a ridiculous idea ??‍♂️

100% agree. 
I think Alan Sugar recently suggested what a farcical idea it was to have an average joe make key decisions about the club (or group collective). I would rather put my trust with the fans than have years have poor decisions from a dictator, oil tycoon or random American consortium. Also lets not pretend that running a football club is like anything else. I know many people that have had personal dealings with Mel, all have said what brilliant business man he is. You would have thought a ridiculously wealthy Derby fan, with immense business pedigree would would be a dream owner for our club and through either desperation or ego it has turned out to be the exact opposite.
That's not to say you can't have a great package in a individual owner and it working well (Leicester) but there are not many examples of that. If the pandemic and ESL has proven anything its that football is broken and fans need to have a greater voice. I'm not sure if a 51% model is the answer for Derby but if there is a genuine threat of liquidation, its definitely something we should explore.

100% agree. 
I think Alan Sugar recently suggested what a farcical idea it was to have an average joe make key decisions about the club (or group collective). I would rather put my trust with the fans than have years have poor decisions from a dictator, oil tycoon or random American consortium. Also lets not pretend that running a football club is like anything else. I know many people that have had personal dealings with Mel, all have said what brilliant business man he is. You would have thought a ridiculously wealthy Derby fan, with immense business pedigree would would be a dream owner for our club and through either desperation or ego it has turned out to be the exact opposite.
That's not to say you can't have a great package in a individual owner and it working well (Leicester) but there are not many examples of that. If the pandemic and ESL has proven anything its that football is broken and fans need to have a greater voice. I'm not sure if a 51% model is the answer for Derby but if there is a genuine threat of liquidation, its definitely something we should explore.

I've emailed the guy at the FSF who advises fan groups on how to get these off the ground. Our situation going to be very different from all of the other clubs under fan ownership as a) we would be looking to buy a large, existing club & b) any purchase would need to clear some of the debt off (assuming could come to some arrangement with Mel)
https://thefsa.org.uk/our-work/supporter-ownership/