LeedsCityRam

1 hour ago, HorsforthRam said:

What is truly our potential? We have a 33k stadium and the home capacity has been filled a few times recently? Posters always say “30k” each week but it’s really about 27k/28k. This might sound pedantic but the likes of the Dirties have 26k waiting list for STs and are planning to expand their ground to 53k. The dogs are planning to expand to 50k. Granted our population is a lot smaller than those two but i wonder where we top out…

Wasnt so long ago Leeds couldn't even get 26k at Elland Road let alone 26k season ticket waiting list!! Im always very sceptical of their claims, they're desperate to project an image of strength to non-Leeds fans when reality is their support is very fickle & they know that only too well. Remember their club shop closing in town 15 years ago due to poor sales & their top tier East Stand effectively being mothballed around that time. Derby's support by contrast held up despite dropping down 2 divisions in past 15 seasons. Meanwhile Forest talking about 50k capacity is so open to ridicule, its untrue.

Our potential? We averaged 27k both seasons in League One with many half empty away ends at PP. Thats a great foundation & with the inevitable added interest a PL team would generate, I think the long mooted 44k capacity would suit us fine as a top end. I also believe our location & strong identity as Rams (not just Derby) would make us interesting to broader foreign markets & offer potential tie ins with teams with similar identities should we become a consistent Prem side (LA Rams most obvious)

2 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

Interesting him being level on games with George Burley? For comparison from Wiki.

"...Derby County's relegation saw the club enter a serious financial crisis, which forced them to sell many key players. Gregory was later suspended from his managerial duties over alleged misconduct and former Ipswich Town boss George Burley was brought in. The club was put into receivership then sold in October 2003 for £3 to a group led by Jeremy Keith. After finishing 20th in the 2003–04 season, a dramatic improvement in the 2004–05 season saw Derby finish fourth in the Championship, qualifying for a promotion play-off spot, though they lost in the semi-finals to Preston North End. Soon afterwards, Burley resigned citing differences between himself and the board...

...In 2003, Burley became interim manager of Derby County while permanent manager John Gregory was suspended. Burley managed to halt Derby's alarming slide towards the relegation zone of the First Division (just one season after relegation from the Premier League) and kept the club up comfortably. Burley was then appointed manager permanently when Gregory was sacked. The following season (2003–04) was often a struggle, with Derby actually finishing two places lower than the season before, but there were signs of improvement. This showed through in the 2004–05 season when, despite spending no money on new players, Burley transformed Derby from relegation contenders to a fourth-place finish and play-off semi-finalists. However, things were not as happy as they seemed on the surface with Burley's relationship with director of football Murdo Mackay and the club's board (who sold star player Tom Huddlestone without informing Burley) being very strained. After days of speculation and mudslinging, Burley announced his resignation from Derby in June 2005."

Suspect its the EFL Trophy matches that have brought him level with Burley who had 2 full seasons & a couple of months at end of 2002/03 season.

1 hour ago, Tyler Durden said:

Putting an extremely cynical slant on matters (who, me 😏) could we have afforded to have got rid of Warne anyway being on a 4 year contract?

So his potential longevity as our manager will have always be tied to his performance but also the clubs ability or willingness to absorb any potential severance payments. 

Certainly that was the main argument against him leaving last autumn after Stevenage/Shrewsbury games but I think the main factor in him staying was Clowes' strong belief that Warne would get it right & take us up. Being a savvy businessman, I'd be surprised if he hadn't budgeted for things going wrong though & hence a severance could probably have been funded but to the likely detriment of the playing budget and/or Academy investment. Fair to say the club is in a stronger position now though & I'd be in no rush to start new contract talks until the end of the season at least (when Warne would still have 16/17 months left in any case).

29 minutes ago, maxjam said:

 

First time we've had a manager getting to his 2nd anniversary at Derby since Nigel Clough in January 2011. Yesterday's game also saw Warne enter the top 10 for most Derby games managed post-war.

Probably an indictment on how short managerial careers are these days but he's also the 19th longest serving manager in the top 4 divisions. Whatever your views on Warne, it is good value for the club him getting past 50% of his contract. The manager pay outs at clubs like Stoke & Hull must be ruinous & that's even before considering the inevitable upheaval as new managers start bringing in their own backroom staff & players to suit their particular style of play.

Good day out & whilst disappointed with the result, can hardly be too down about it. Kiefer Moore/Hamer/O'Hare would absolutely walk into our team & most of Champ...we gave them a good game (particularly first half) & their winner was from a free kick that clearly wasnt a foul as their lad dived. Dreadful ref btw 

Thought we created little second half in response but always tried to play (Yates on throughour) & loved the fight all game esp from Ebou. We are where we are..onto Norwich  up the Rams 💪🖤

14 minutes ago, HorsforthRam said:

Who was the lad in the U21s last season that played in the pizza cup that tried a shot from the halfway line? (Not a lot of info I know 😂)

Fapetu? I think he's left now, disappointing as thought he was a prospect.

Blunts 4 Derby 1

FRGS Jackson

14 hours ago, JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta said:

I know he's only on loan and I know he's a striker that hasn't scored a goal in the league yet (he will get at least ten I reckon).

But...

Sign him. It just works. I don't care if he scores 0 goals this season, because his effort, positioning and link up play enables everyone else around him to score goals. 

We are a much more potent team with him in it, even if he isn't the main threat.

Pub talk? Maybe. But this team doesn't function fully without him. Agree? Disagree?

Between Yates & Goudmijn, the technical standard of this team has increased substantially in the past few weeks.

Not knowing much about Yates before he signed/having watched his highlights on Youtube, I'd assumed a mobile penalty box predator. He's far more than that & a great foil to the express pace we have out wide. Intelligent, awareness of others, great first touch & actually very unlucky not to have scored a couple already this season.

My only concern with him would be in games where we are really under the pump & he gets isolated but in games where we're able to compete in midfield, he gives us a real cutting edge by meshing the attack together.

Would be keen to sign him permanently if Swansea are reasonable on price.

7 hours ago, IlsonDerby said:

Him and Kenzo bring us in £10m in transfer fees next summer or the summer after. Going to enjoy them both whilst they’re here. Credit to the recruitment process! 

Depressing to realise we’ll probably lose them but this is what it’s all about in our efforts not to end up in financial crisis again. Down to the club to identify the next Kenzo, the next JWZ, + others to recycle the eventual sales into raising the whole team by a level. 

I'm actually really enthused by it rather than depressed. To get to the top end of this division we need better quality throughout the squad & the quickest way of doing that is buying cheap & selling expensive to increase our overall budget. If both leave next summer for £10m combined (I'd hope for a lot more personally) that elevates this club to fishing in player markets that could see an outside playoff push next season - pretty exciting I reckon. The cycle then continues again buying talented young lads with good resale potential & good character.

Still very early days but both Zetterstrom & Goudmijn look very good value for money with the potential to improve further. Good work by the scouting/backroom team & credit to Warne given both look so settled in the starting XI so quickly. Very important with young foreign players that they are made to feel at home very quickly & a strong, inclusive culture is key to that - something you imagine Warne is very hot on.

Derby 1 Swim Away 1

FRGS Jackson

My favourite manager since Jim Smith - I was gutted when he left. Built a fantastic side on peanuts whilst having to contend with terrible owners - did a remarkable job considering where he found us after Gregory & the football was brilliant to watch too. 

Wishing you all the best George 🖤🐏

8 hours ago, CBX1985 said:

Thanks for the well thought out reply.  When you say tracking from mid October, and consistent spells below 1.2 points per game, would that be aggregate (i.e 1.2 PPG for the season to date) or within the period in question?  You say consistent spells - so you wouldn't sack on the first spell in that position?  How much time would you give to come up with solutions?

Regarding changes midseason: My view is that you need to have a clear strategy for what comes next.... just putting someone else in is ineffective.  You need to have a clear vision of what they would do better - and why.    

 

It would be 1.2 PPG across the season to date rather than the period in question. With regard to consistent spells, I think if we are bottom 3 for more than a month or dip into it for a second occasion that would be grounds for getting a replacement.

7 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

I'd say similar, except the failure bar dropped to 46 points. Tracked against a simple 1 ppg ratio on various rolling averages (6, 8, 10). Falling below 1 ppg across all of those is a serious concern.

Mitigating factors such as key players missing extended periods would be factored in if their return (or Jan signings) would mean a strong chance of exiting the bottom 3.

If we fall off the pace to such an extreme as needing 1.3 ppg over the rest of the season to meet the 46 point target, then a change of manager would also be required.

As an owner investing millions on the academy, I would also expect a meaningful amount of game time for DBrown. It would signify that there are opportunities if the get themselves into the first team picture. Limited minutes between now and January (given our CF options) would be another concern, as it will hurt youth retention. The integration of youth players would also buy the manager more time if results weren't going as hoped early in the season, with a view to said player adjusting, improving and having a greater impact as the season progresses.

Yes, its true the safety bar can dip as low as 46 points but I wouldn't ncessarily see 4th bottom as 'success' for exactly the reasons @trappatoni describes. 55 points invariably sees teams slightly above bottom 6 & ftom that yield, you could deduce that we've made a decent fist of our first season back i.e. a 10 point improvement in season 2 would see us threaten the top half, which is ultimately where we want to be in the midterm.

P.s. i share your concern about Academy progression but unlikely this would be a factor in Ckowes performance metrics this season because of the importance of staying up above all else & probable justification from management team that youngsters 'arent ready'. I feel next season would be the first season Clowes might be more forceful in expecting Academy minutes in the first team.

What does success look like?  ANYTHING ABOVE BOTTOM 6 AND/OR 55 POINTS

When is this to be judged?  ON AN ONGOING BASIS FROM MID OCTOBER ONWARDS

What would failure look like?  CONSISTENT SPELLS IN BOTTOM 3 AND/OR CONSISTENTLY TRACKING BELOW 55 POINT MARK (1.2 POINTS PER GAME)

When is this to be judged?  ON AN ONGOING BASIS FROM MID OCTOBER ONWARDS

In case of failure, would you change manager?  YES

What would you expect the new manager to achieve that could not be done via the existing?  In what timescale?  GET AWAY FROM THE BOTTOM 3 WITHIN 2 MONTHS OF APPOINTMENT

Who would we wish to replace and at what cost?  What if he is unavailable?  ROWETT IF CONTINUING SHORT/MID TERM PRAGMATIC APPROACH

I can't quite get my head around people only judging Warne at the end of the season when there clearly will be strong indications well before then of where the season is likely to end. To not act if we are consistently bottom 3 would be pretty reckless, this club can not sink back into League One again.

For thise who havent seen previous post I made explaining 55 point target, this is the lowest points total at which no team has ever been relegated from the Championship and the amount of points Derby won on the field in that horrendous 2021/22 season.

Brilliant result! Well done Derby. Them new signings got some work to do to get in the first XI 😉

Up the Rams 🖤💪

P.s. keep this going Paul Warne...loving this 👍

42 minutes ago, IslandExile said:

Warne in.

2 minutes ago, Elwood P Dowd said:

I do wonder if PW has replaced the CF, would hold the ball up, with a group of players who have the pace to attack as a unit.

A defenders nightmare must be having three pacy players running at him, the big question is can we turn the players pace into goals, can someone stick the ball in the net.

I remember Raheem Sterling when he was all pace and no end product.

 

I think having the variety to do both would be the ideal. Games where we are inviting the opposition onto us, could go with 3 quick forwards to punish them whereas games where we are struggling to get any kind of foothold, we have a strong number 9 to get us a platform higher up the pitch. That would also be useful in games where we have more of the ball (thinking likes of Millwall at home) when attacks might be concentrated out wide to evade their low block & hence we'd need presence in the final 3rd to make most of that delivery.

Agree about attacking as a unit by the way - my assessment is the attacking play seems to be very individual still (perhaps not surprising given how new the squad is) instead of forward players making runs to create space/providing those key final 3rd passes to others.

42 minutes ago, brady1993 said:

Martin was a case of a clearly talented player who had flaws and therefore for a while a lot of managers struggled to work him out as he didn't fit an archetype. Sometimes he had a bit of success and sometimes he wouldn't. Turned out though if you played to his strengths tactically and got players buzzing around him rather than worrying over what's he not good at.....

I don't think we are in an entirely dissimilar position right now with Yates. I think we've got the personal to get the most out of him and if we can work it out tactically to get the most from him I think he'll likely fly. I think the more we focus on tackling that problem as a club and the less we focus on getting a big target man as a free agent to lump crosses at, the better off we will be. 

Totally agree about potential with Yates & the side setting up to feed him opportunities. The issue this summer hasn't been strikers but the build up play/lack of clear chances created in open play & the additions of Harness & Chirewa should improve us in that regard.

Re big target man, I also wouldn't want a Ladapo type there for us to be aiming punts at but do believe we need that profile of forward in games where we will be penned in & need an out ball. Currently the ball is coming back to us too quickly & that will inevitably lead to 30% possession stats, tired bodies & late defeats. Having a Kazim type CF who is able to hold the ball & bring others into play will greatly improve us particularly on our travels. I don't see Yates as being able to have that same level of impact in those types of games.

8 hours ago, Day said:

Just, maybe get behind Warne and the team, full blind faith if that’s what it takes, just give this team a fair chance with full supporter backing?

I get that might go against your personal philosophy, the style of football you like to see. I get it will be hard at times if we’re walking away from games with 20% possession, we’re fresh out of League one, let’s have some realism on the current situation.

Hear me out, this doesn’t need to be forever thing, it’s a here and now situation that we are dealing with, we don’t have to love it, walk round with huge boners, but the least we can do is just get behind it and stop the daily whinging and groaning that’s completely draining the dregs of enthusiasm remaining amongst us.

We’re not even into September and it feels like many have just washed their hands and dreaming of the next manager, the next big signing.

We’re fresh out of League One, a club that’s rising from the ashes, where is the context, the patience, the understanding.

Please, for the love of all things Rams, just have a few months off and rally around this squad as it’s all we have now until January. 🐏

Obviously respect the call to arms but reality is it won't change much. The points have been made a few times before but;

a) there is a difference between disliking the playing philosophy for entertainment reasons & disliking the playing philosophy because you think it won't work. I will always want Derby to play a more controlled, progressive style but I have no issue playing with 30% possession given the circumstances we find ourselves in if it is effective. I sense that is where many critics of Warne are coming from. Warne's previous forays at this level suggest the style won't be effective but I will personally wait until mid October before making full judgement on this. It isn't unreasonable to point flaws out in our approach though in individual games.

b) there is a difference between venting on the forum & venting at the matches themselves. I never boo the team, will stay to the end to clap the players even if its been pretty poor & will vocally encourage. Clearly we all need somewhere to let off steam when things haven't gone well & given a lot of posters on here are based away from Derby & don't necessarily have workmates who share their passion, this is as good a place to express frustrations around matchtime that at times might seem a bit rash/emotional. Denying people the right to do this is unrealistic & smacks a bit of 'groupthink'. There's certainly a core of decent posters here to challenge extreme views/provide perspective if needed.

Finally, if those not supportive of Warne 'have a few months off', your forum isn't going to do too well for traffic! There is a sizeable minority who have never been convinced by Warne (myself included) & so yes, we are picking up on any sign that he is regressing to the kind of campaigns Rotherham had under his management because we're worried & desperately do not want to return to League One. However if he gets the results to keep us out of the bottom 6, the fanbase will largely be appeased including on here - that's the bottom line.

Derby 0 Portishead 2

Ideally I'd want a progressive coach who would get us playing some football & develop a style that is scalable at higher echelons of Championship - Mark Warburton has always impressed me in that respect.

Realistically I think we're in a dogfight & given relegation is absolutely unthinkable, we may need to be pragmatic for a season or two until Academy products start to mature & our foreign investments start to yield big profits. The obvious choice is Gary Rowett, someone who built 2 very effective sides at Small Heath & Millwall with relatively low quality squads in the Championship, much the same situation we are in now. Yes, he was nominally in charge when Small Heath went down in May but that could hardly be pinned on him given how late he arrived & the mess he inherited.

In all honesty, think this thread is a bit premature though - Warne will get until mid-October at the earliest even if we lost the next 3 games.

20 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

I was surprised to see a funding round for Watford today on the Seedrs/Revolution early investors platform. They put out a share issue to raise £2m and it's quickly been over subscribed with around £4m promised so far. Might be something for DC to consider. As well as equity in the club (which they value at £175m), there are interesting investor perks:

>£250 and you get a free scarf

>£5k you get that plus a shirt, hospitality for 2 once a season and separately 2 seats in a box once a season, plus a training ground tour

>£50k you get all that plus dinner with a couple of players once a season and a draw to stay in the team hotel for one game, plus a fair few other bits including playing on the pitch post season

>£800k all that and much more besides

How helpful would it be for DC to raise, say £2m this way? Or are we looking for much more significant input?

 

 

 

Checked with a Watford mate & original offering was very different...theit owners were seeking 17.4m & got 3.8m, mostly from US speculators. Apparently theit fan groups organised a fan boycott of the scheme given the distrust of Pozzos there.

That said, I like the general principle for Derby with this particular ownership (clearly wouldn't have worked under Morris by contrast). Some form of imvestor bond or equity ownership with preferential protection might raise a few million especially if high net worth Derby fans are sounded out. Ultimately Id love to see Derby as a substantially fan owned club & the short term cash injection could be enough to secure the signings (short term & long term) to enable the sustainable strategic plan going forward.

2 hours ago, Comrade 86 said:

In the absence of any rumours of any kind, can someone make some **** up please?

Ta.

86 x

 

Sure;

Tyrone Mears climbed back through a Moor Farm window this week. Sadly for him, security launched him out headfirst thinking he was a Leeds peeping tom. Out for 3 months as a result but Warne has offered him a trial in Nov.

Esteban Fuertes has finally got his UK passport & is ready to mingle. Warne sceptical he is really 31 as stated on his new documents..official checks pre-trial offer.

Michail Antonio inspired by Osborn & after his strike to force treetards to let him move to Derby, is back for another plunge. Warne assessing feasibility along with Billy Sharp. Wages a poss issue.

And Divock Origi nailed on 👍

'Family Club' 3 Derby 0

It was with a sickening feeling I realised in June that our first home game was same day I was jetting off to Spain. Even worse that it was against the tinpot bunch who tried to strongarm us into liquidation.

Stood in the queue at Leeds Bradford airport & one of their lot sees my Derby top & says 'gonna beat yous today pal'. Grimaced & broadly agreed. What a lovely surprise that when landing, I furiously checked phone to see game had just finished & we'd done them. My 'pal' was stood bemoaning the queue for gents so sauntered over...'hello pal, got some more bad news for you. You got beat...up the Rams' 😆

Now Im no fan of Warne & I fully reserve the right to call him out in October if we're mired in the bottom 3. But sticking it to those scumbags after the misery their owner inflicted on us 2.5 years ago feels very sweet indeed. Thank you Paul Warne & thank you Derby County. Cold beers are being toasted this evening in Catalunya, up those mighty Rams 💪🖤

Derby 0 Parasites 3

1 hour ago, Nuwtfly said:

Super impressed by Liam Thompson tonight. That mistake could have ruined his night but he grew into the game - top stuff 

Yes Thompson was very good overall.  Cracking strike for the equaliser & liked his overall composure & quality in the final 3rd. It was his ball that set Brown up for an easy chance after an hour & another great ball with outside of foot to set NML up late on. We have very few players in the squad with that ability & Id like to see him in the starting XI whether in a 3 man CM or at wing back.

As to the game overall, yes we had understated control of it throughout (if not of the actual ball). Impressed with Chesterfield, played some great stuff & think they'll do well in League 2 this season. Top support too.