tomsdubs Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Burnley aren't not scoring goals because they can't break teams down though, they're not scoring goals because they're being bossed about by the other side and can't get out of their half Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animal is a Ram Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 We played Chelsea last season, they contained us, controlled us and delivered the killer blow. We didn't have the quality to get beyond them. Cup game, playing at 70-80%. I guarantee they wouldn't do that in the league.. see Burnley first game of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daaave Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Burnley's relucatance to pay wages has been their downfall, never going to survive. They needed about 6 new signings minimum. Our defence is OK, but our midfield quality is miles off and creativity would be a huge issue. Huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomsdubs Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Huh? We went all out against Chelsea playing suposedly 80%, how many chances did we create? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daaave Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Not sure anyone is saying we'd be really capable of immediately competing with the likes of Chelsea though? But if teams like Crystal Palace, WBA, Stoke came to Pride Park looking for 3 points, which they would, I think we'd be more than capable of creating chances and winning the game even with the current squad. With perhaps 2-3 new quality additions we'd be well in the games with the bottom 12, both home and away, and in with a shout of upsetting the top 8 particularly at home. I'd be much more concerned with our defence than midfield if we were to go up, a lot of the credit for the clean sheets has to be given to the whole team for the way we control the game and boss possession and we wouldn't be as comfortable in doing that in the PL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Chelsea aren't your average PL side. If that's the sort of team we're going to face every week then there's no point in wanting promotion. We'll lose about 30 games, draw 5 and win 3. Despite knowing better people still think "Premiership" and think "City, Arsenal, United, Spurs and teams like Everton" and think about how the current team would do. You've got one transfer window where suddenly players from some of Europe's top clubs will be available to build on the team you already have. Then you just have to compete with Palace, Sunderland, Stoke, Newcastle, WBA, Hull, 2 fellow promoted sides, Leicester(?), Villa, West Ham That's like half of this super great awesome PL and you just need to finish higher than 3 of them. Then you get another summer. Worst thing you can do is panic buy and rush things. If you come up with a decent team and a controlled style I think your already half way to being able to mount a survival challenge at least Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomsdubs Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 I think Forsyth, keogh, Christie plus a new quality CB with Thorne in front of them is a good unit. Hendrick, Bryson, Russell and Ward would all come up short IMO unless they start making steady improvements to their game. I'm not saying this is impossible look at Swansea for example. I think we might get a bit carried away with the quality we have here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramekin Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Well if we go up as champions we should be able to finish higher than the other 2 promoted teams all things being equal. That would leave us with 1 other team to finish higher than so of course we'd stand a decent chance of staying up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 We'd be bottom 3 quite comfortably, we've struggled to break teams down this season. The main issue for promoted sides is scoring goals, watch a full Burnley game the class just isn't there. It's all signing dependant. You're right in that goal are important for promoted sides and have that attacking intent. But our struggles as say you include finishing as the top goalscorers last season 84, and netting 23 after 13 games this season - equating to 81 goals over a 46 season campaign. Swansea City got promoted in 2010/11 season by finishing 3rd on 80 points, winning less games than we did, losing more games, scoring 15 goals less and not having as good a GD as us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlsonDerby Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 We went all out against Chelsea playing suposedly 80%, how many chances did we create? All of your comments so far have made my p1ss boil. WHY on earth are you using Chelsea as a barometer for how we would fair in the prem when there are 19 teams worse than Chelsea, I'd say 15 of those worse by a long way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ram a lamb a ding dong Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 I'm almost tempted to shy away from this debate as its the biggest load of ***** i've read since i was stranded in trap3 with only a copy of the DailySport to keep me amused. 1. The BD side got promoted by default. One of the worst ever to get in to the Prem and the signings...............say no more. 2. We play damn good football and good football wins you games 3. Good football attracts big crowds 4. Big crowds attract good players 5. And so on....... 6. Continuity of 2 years of winning creates a winning mentality that gives you a head start when you mix it with the big boys. To compare now to 2007 beggars belief. Leicester were great last season and will comfortably stop up. Burnley are a 1 season wonder who will get no more than 18 points. QPR went up by default. Too many sides bottled it against Barton et al and Wembley.......................... AND AND AND......one more season in the Championship then mixing it with the big boys will give us more solid foundations. I had the debate at work today regarding next season and stand firm that if we were to go up tomorrow i would sign 3 players: Centre half Wide player Striker Spend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomsdubs Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 All of your comments so far have made my p1ss boil. WHY on earth are you using Chelsea as a barometer for how we would fair in the prem when there are 19 teams worse than Chelsea, I'd say 15 of those worse by a long way. OTT reaction much? Do you have issues discussing things in a civilised manner? The prem is lauded for its competitiveness. I took the current squad state and drew comparison for which a baseline could be established. The only real frame of reference we have except for the promoted sides, if you think we could compete well with the current squad then I'd say maybe you are wearing some strong rose tints. IMO we'd need another top quality striker, quality winger, CB to compliment Keogh (marquee signing). Then after that an upgrade on a few backups. Hendrick will be one of the main players to step up if he keeps improving. Our attacking approach to games will stand in better stead than ***** teams like Burnley. I think we are underestimating the quality up there. Just to add some outside perspective my WBA mate thinks we'll get destroyed playing the way we do even if we sign a few good players. Unfortunately this is all pie in the sky and we may never know, only played 13 games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Sagan Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 We've put all our core players on long contracts and, at the same time, are planning for promotion. I like that as it suggests we're looking to keep the bulk of the squad together to prove themselves in the Premier League. For me, evolution rather than revolution is what it's all about now. Had we gone up last year, it would have been more of a revolution. If we win promotion this season, we'll have had largely the same players together for two years, winning 60% of the games they've played together. Getting used to winning and knowing how to grind out results is really key. We can score goals, which you need to survive a division up. It's vital to carry a threat. We've tightened up at the back. For instance, I was surprised Burnley were in for Keogh in the close season, but he's stepped up a level so far in this campaign and shown to me he's probably got it in him. That's true of many of our players. They're all hungry for the Prem, but going about it in an incredibly professional way, despite the disappointment of last season. If we go up, we'll be an attractive destination for talented players wanting to prove themselves in the the "EPL". Transfer kitty probably Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesertRam Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 The only certainty is, that we will stand a better chance of staying up with promotion this season, rather than the last one. The longer our players stay together, it evens up the odds of beating teams who might have a few better individual players. We will definitely need to add premiership experience thou. How many and how much, hopefully SM knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlsonDerby Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 OTT reaction much? Do you have issues discussing things in a civilised manner? The prem is lauded for its competitiveness. I took the current squad state and drew comparison for which a baseline could be established. The only real frame of reference we have except for the promoted sides, if you think we could compete well with the current squad then I'd say maybe you are wearing some strong rose tints. IMO we'd need another top quality striker, quality winger, CB to compliment Keogh (marquee signing). Then after that an upgrade on a few backups. Hendrick will be one of the main players to step up if he keeps improving. Our attacking approach to games will stand in better stead than ***** teams like Burnley. I think we are underestimating the quality up there. Just to add some outside perspective my WBA mate thinks we'll get destroyed playing the way we do even if we sign a few good players. Unfortunately this is all pie in the sky and we may never know, only played 13 games But why use Chelsea?! If you'd said the same things because Leicester turned us over then fair enough but not recent European champions and probable title winners. You make some valid points but your attitude seemed so dismissive and it was the constant comparisons with Chelsea that led to my reaction. Obviously we would need some key signings. 3/4 maximum as to not upset the apple cart as all these players would deserve a chance IF we went up. But I still don't think our current team would finish bottom. Teams would have to attack us and our defence gas improved no end, that leaves them open to our quick countering etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomsdubs Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 But why use Chelsea?! If you'd said the same things because Leicester turned us over then fair enough but not recent European champions and probable title winners. You make some valid points but your attitude seemed so dismissive and it was the constant comparisons with Chelsea that led to my reaction. Obviously we would need some key signings. 3/4 maximum as to not upset the apple cart as all these players would deserve a chance IF we went up. But I still don't think our current team would finish bottom. Teams would have to attack us and our defence gas improved no end, that leaves them open to our quick countering etc I'm not dismissive mate I just prefer to take a step back. I'm 30 years old and the majority of my life we've been **** bar 5-6 good seasons. I think Leicester were better equipped than us but that doesn't mean we wouldn't be alright. I think you are being too simplistic saying teams woud come and attack us, like they don't do tactical analysis on sides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlsonDerby Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 I'm not dismissive mate I just prefer to take a step back. I'm 30 years old and the majority of my life we've been sausage bar 5-6 good seasons. I think Leicester were better equipped than us but that doesn't mean we wouldn't be alright. I think you are being too simplistic saying teams woud come and attack us, like they don't do tactical analysis on sides. I think although it sounds simple (and by no means is it that simple) it isn't far off what will happen as we've seen with West Ham, fans won't accept teams coming to little old Derby and trying to stifle us. The fans will expect to come and beat us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
top 6 finish Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 I think the debate has now been sorted.Doesn't matter we get promoted,take the money and run,start again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CumbrianRam Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 I think the debate has now been sorted.Doesn't matter we get promoted,take the money and run,start again. Thats what losers do. There is guarantee that you will return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted October 25, 2014 Share Posted October 25, 2014 Let's give up all hope.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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